# The "Dark Phoenix" phenomenon - when good characters go bad.

**URL:** <https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dark-phoenix-phenomenon-when-good-characters-go-bad/480236>\
**Category:** Cafe Society\
**Created:** [January 7, 2009, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dark-phoenix-phenomenon-when-good-characters-go-bad/480236 "2009-01-07T16:57:28Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 3\
**Page:** 2

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**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\
**Post date:** [January 7, 2009, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dark-phoenix-phenomenon-when-good-characters-go-bad/480236/21 "2009-01-07T20:07:00Z")

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Sauron & Saruman spring to mind. We didn’t see or hear much about them before they turned to eeevil, but they definitely started out as good guys.

Khan Noonian Singh only wanted _order!_ And concubines. But mostly order.

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**Author:** ![Atomicflea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/58956e/32.png) [@Atomicflea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomicflea)\
**Post date:** [January 7, 2009, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dark-phoenix-phenomenon-when-good-characters-go-bad/480236/22 "2009-01-07T20:08:58Z")

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Can I call a “reverse Dark Phoenix” on Emma Frost, formerly the Hellfire Club’s White Queen?  
Also, I forgot to mention Mystique.

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**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\
**Post date:** [January 7, 2009, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-dark-phoenix-phenomenon-when-good-characters-go-bad/480236/23 "2009-01-07T20:15:28Z")

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I love it when good guys go temporarily bad. It’s a theme. Good guys always hold back their abilities for fear of hurting someone, but as a fan-boy, I’m always thinking, “but if you’d just used your powers like I know you can, you’d have kicked ass!” So the writers make the good guy temporarily bad and they _do_ use their powers like we know they could. Fun stuff.

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