# The death of a neighbor--and the nature of Catholic funerals **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 16, 2014, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270 "2014-04-16T16:28:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2014, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/41 "2014-04-19T14:42:36Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > I know its not strictly a Catholic custom but some are shocked when they see an open casket wake. I know several of my Jewish friends were shocked when they attended my father’s wake. Well, observant Jews don’t embalm, so an open casket would be…unwise in many circumstances. I’ve been to a couple of Catholic wakes, and I have to say, even though I hadn’t met the deceased alive in either case (co-worker’s mothers in both cases), I had no particular urge to see them dead. I didn’t even want to see my own grandparents dead! I’d rather remember them as they were alive, but I think if I saw them dead I’d never be able to erase the image from my mind. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2014, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/42 "2014-04-19T15:14:30Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Maybe you were just being funny, but I thought this was a Jewish custom? Not being Catholic or Jewish, I have no frame of reference. I’m Catholic, not Jewish but I think the Jewish custom is to send food _instead of_ flowers or plants. I suspect most cultures have a custom of family and close friends making sure the mourners don’t have to worry about matters like cooking. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2014, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/43 "2014-04-19T15:59:27Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > Out of curiosity: Under what conditions is a Requiem Mass observed? Those are any memorial Mass that’s specifically and completely dedicated to someone who already had a funeral (or a first “memorial Mass” because the body wasn’t available for burial\*), as opposed to that first Mass dedicated to that person and to regular Masses where that person’s name is added to the list of deceased the priest names. So, if I asked a priest to commemorate the anniversary of my father’s death by naming him during the Mass, that’s not a requiem. If I ask him to have a special Mass in memory of my father, who’s been buried since 2000, it would be a requiem. The custom we have in much of Spain where the family goes to Mass for the three days following the funeral so those who weren’t able to can present their respects, not requiems; if each of them was a memorial again, they’d be requiems. The term comes from “rest”, it’s a Mass being offered “for the eternal rest of the deceased’s soul”. Strictly speaking, the funeral is also a requiem since it _is_ offered for the rest of the deceased’s soul, but I’ve always heard them treated separatedly. - This can happen for a number of reasons: corpse unretrievable, decease took place in a very distant location from another one where many people knew the deceased (so a Mass is held in this second location), long autopsy/investigation/etc. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2014, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/44 "2014-04-19T16:03:28Z")
In my experience, the wake is open casket and the funeral service is closed. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2014, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/45 "2014-04-21T00:38:45Z")
Attending the wake will be sufficient. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2014, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/46 "2014-04-21T18:11:56Z")
To chime in with **Nava** regarding “requiem Mass”: \<\\> [http://www.ewtn.com/library/liturgy/zlitur78.htm](http://www.ewtn.com/library/liturgy/zlitur78.htm) I’ve never heard of our church doing a requiem Mass; the custom here as far as I know is to have your person as the Mass intention. ---
**Author:** ![HipGnosis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/76d3ee/32.png) [@HipGnosis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HipGnosis)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2014, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/47 "2014-04-21T19:53:11Z")
In case you don’t know, ‘communion’ is when the members of the congregation are lead to walk to the front of the church - usually a row at a time. When they indicate it’s time for your row to go, just stay in place and let any others in your row go past. Don’t sit in the front row and you’ll surely tell when this is happening. If you do get ‘caught-up’ and/or lead to the front, just say “I’m sorry, I’m not Catholic” when they offer you the wine and/or communion wafer. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2014, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/48 "2014-04-21T23:20:04Z")
> [@HipGnosis](#): > > In case you don’t know, ‘communion’ is when the members of the congregation are lead to walk to the front of the church - usually a row at a time. > When they indicate it’s time for your row to go, just stay in place and let any others in your row go past. > Don’t sit in the front row and you’ll surely tell when this is happening. > If you do get ‘caught-up’ and/or lead to the front, just say “I’m sorry, I’m not Catholic” when they offer you the wine and/or communion wafer. Unless it will offend you in some way, if you do get up there, just cross your arms (opposite hands on shoulders) and the priest will know to bless you and not offer communion. But ideally just remain in your seat. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![GameHat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ed655f/32.png) [@GameHat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GameHat)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/49 "2014-04-22T01:58:47Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > You stand when everybody stands, kneel when everybody kneels, sit when everybody sits, and (this won’t count as it’s a funeral) when everybody goes to communion you just sit and watch. Speak in English - if you’re in the US, it’s likely that many of the people going to the funeral won’t know Spanish themselves. (The amount of non-Spanish speaking Hispanics in San Antonio is amazing. Your area is likely the same, depending upon how close to the border you are. ETA: Gardena? You can speak English if you want to say a few words.) > > It’s pretty much that simple. I’ve been to a few Spanish Catholic funerals and it’s no big deal (as far as protocol is concerned - it’s a funeral of course, so act funeral-y.) Grew up Catholic though a bit lapsed these days. Yep, this is pretty much spot on. You’re honoring them by attending, nobody is going to mind if you’re not sure what to do at one point or another. Just follow the rest. Except (as has been pointed out), don’t take communion (procession up to the priest to get the communal wafer) if you’re not Catholic yourself, Catholics take that pretty seriously. Even for other denominations, no matter how devoutly religious the person may be - Catholic communion (Eucharist) is for Catholics. I think I may remember there being a loophole for Eastern Orthodox, but don’t quote me. …I don’t think the world is going to end or God is going to smite anyone if that rule is broken, but you should respect that faith, just like you should respect all other faiths and their practices when you’re in their church/mosque/temple or attending a service they are running. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/50 "2014-04-22T02:35:16Z")
> [@GameHat](#): > > Catholic communion (Eucharist) is for Catholics. To explain, this is because Catholic doctrine holds that the eucharist IS the body of Christ, not just a symbol. This is pretty important; it’s not just a divisive rule. ---
**Author:** ![GameHat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ed655f/32.png) [@GameHat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GameHat)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/51 "2014-04-22T02:55:13Z")
> [@j666](#): > > To explain, this is because Catholic doctrine holds that the eucharist IS the body of Christ, not just a symbol. This is pretty important; it’s not just a divisive rule. Yes, agreed. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/52 "2014-04-22T05:20:03Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > I’ve never heard of our church doing a requiem Mass; the custom here as far as I know is to have your person as the Mass intention. I’ve only seen them in very special cases and as a public event, such as one offered in memoriam of the people who died during a war. As you say, for a relative normally you just add the name to the intentions. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/53 "2014-04-22T06:08:49Z")
Hope this isn’t too much of a hijack, but: > [@GameHat](#): > > Except (as has been pointed out), don’t take communion (procession up to the priest to get the communal wafer) if you’re not Catholic yourself, Catholics take that pretty seriously. Just adding my agreement and a bit more info. The term for this Catholic belief is _Transubstantiation_, which means that the bread and wine _literally become_ the body and blood of Christ. The theology and philosophy regarding transubstantiation is actually quite interesting. [This page has a good layman’s explanation while also being really conversational](http://www.piercedhands.com/transubstantiation-its-like-magic-but-logical/). Transubstantiation is the opposite of transformation, basically. When a caterpillar transforms into a butterfly, its characteristics change, but its essence is the same - it’s still the same insect it was before. Transubstantiation of bread and wine is the reverse - their characteristics stay the same, but their true essence changes from ordinary food and drink into the body and blood of Christ. This doctrine was one of the big issues Martin Luther had with the Church when he kick started the Reformation. Protestant churches believe that communion is symbolic instead of literal. This is why Protestants are not allowed to partake in Catholic communion - how can they, if they literally don’t believe THE most important belief about the (Catholic) Eucharist? On the other hand… > [@](#): > > I think I may remember there being a loophole for Eastern Orthodox, but don’t quote me. It’s not a loophole, per se, but [yes, there are times when Orthodox can receive Catholic communion](http://www.catholic.com/tracts/who-can-receive-communion) > [@](#): > > Catholic ministers may licitly administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist and anointing of the sick to members of the oriental churches which do not have full Communion with the Catholic Church, if they ask on their own for the sacraments and are properly disposed. This holds also for members of other churches, which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition as the oriental churches as far as these sacraments are concerned. (CIC 844 § 3). Eastern and Oriental Orthodox Churches _do_ believe the bread and wine -\> literal body and blood, though they avoid attempts to explain why and instead refer to it as a mystery. This is why the Catholic Church says Orthodox members can receive communion if they ask for it. But keep in mind this is the RCC’s stance and has no bearing on whether or not an Orthodox Church says it’s okay for their members to receive Catholic communion (it seems like individual churches have some freedom to decide this individually). ---
**Author:** ![GameHat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ed655f/32.png) [@GameHat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GameHat)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2014, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/54 "2014-04-23T02:59:05Z")
> [@zweisamkeit](#): > > Hope this isn’t too much of a hijack, but: Just adding my agreement and a bit more info. The term for this Catholic belief is _Transubstantiation_, which means that the bread and wine _literally become_ the body and blood of Christ. The theology and philosophy regarding transubstantiation is actually quite interesting. [This page has a good layman’s explanation while also being really conversational](http://www.piercedhands.com/transubstantiation-its-like-magic-but-logical/). Transubstantiation is the opposite of transformation, basically. When a caterpillar transforms into a butterfly, its characteristics change, but its essence is the same - it’s still the same insect it was before. Transubstantiation of bread and wine is the reverse - their characteristics stay the same, but their true essence changes from ordinary food and drink into the body and blood of Christ. > > This doctrine was one of the big issues Martin Luther had with the Church when he kick started the Reformation. Protestant churches believe that communion is symbolic instead of literal. This is why Protestants are not allowed to partake in Catholic communion - how can they, if they literally don’t believe THE most important belief about the (Catholic) Eucharist? > > On the other hand… > > It’s not a loophole, per se, but [yes, there are times when Orthodox can receive Catholic communion](http://www.catholic.com/tracts/who-can-receive-communion) Eastern and Oriental Orthodox Churches _do_ believe the bread and wine -\> literal body and blood, though they avoid attempts to explain why and instead refer to it as a mystery. This is why the Catholic Church says Orthodox members can receive communion if they ask for it. But keep in mind this is the RCC’s stance and has no bearing on whether or not an Orthodox Church says it’s okay for their members to receive Catholic communion (it seems like individual churches have some freedom to decide this individually). Very well explained, thanks. Wasn’t clear on the the Eastern Orthodox part myself. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2014, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/55 "2014-04-23T03:13:01Z")
> [@zweisamkeit](#): > > But keep in mind this is the RCC’s stance and has no bearing on whether or not an Orthodox Church says it’s okay for their members to receive Catholic communion (it seems like individual churches have some freedom to decide this individually). Each individual Church decides individually. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2014, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/56 "2014-04-23T04:19:59Z")
I have been the cantor at both Catholic memorial services (no Mass) and funeral Masses. The latter are generally held when the family of the deceased is Catholic, or the deceased was active in the parish, and there is likely to be at least a moderate number of people who will receive communion. As at weddings, there are almost always quite a few attendees who are not Catholic and I’ve sung for a couple where no one seems to be familiar with the service except the priest and me. As other posters have indicated, no one expects you to do more than be unobtrusive and respectful. If it is a Mass, do not receive communion, but in many if not most parishes in the US, you may join the communion procession and when you get to the eucharistic minister, cross your hands over your chest, indicating you would like to receive a blessing instead (this will be something very brief). If this is your first Catholic service, it hardly matters that it won’t be in English, you would be at sea even if it was. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2014, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/57 "2014-04-23T23:48:52Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > I have been the cantor at both Catholic memorial services (no Mass) and funeral Masses. So, there are three possible services? Memorial service (no Mass), Memorial Mass (when the body is not present), and Mass of Christian Burial (when it is). I just have never heard of the first. > [@zweisamkeit](#): > > The term for this Catholic belief is Transubstantiation, which means that the bread and wine literally become the body and blood of Christ. That depends what your definition of “literally” is. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/58 "2014-04-24T13:22:42Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > That depends what your definition of “literally” is. 🙂 I’m sorry, but I’m not sure what you’re saying? ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/59 "2014-04-24T16:36:04Z")
Never mind, I agree with what you’ve described, it’s just a knee-jerk on how “literally” gets misused IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2014, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270/60 "2014-04-29T22:03:40Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > So, there are three possible services? Memorial service (no Mass), Memorial Mass (when the body is not present), and Mass of Christian Burial (when it is). I just have never heard of the first. I believe so, but I’m just the cantor, I show up and sing what I am told, so don’t go by me. I’ve been to things that are like all of the above. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-death-of-a-neighbor-and-the-nature-of-catholic-funerals/686270.md?page=2)