# "The deceased bombing suspect" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 8, 2013, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797 "2013-05-08T14:52:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/1 "2013-05-08T14:52:55Z")
Every media reference to Tamerlan Tsarnaev refers to him as a “suspect.” Is there any legal event that could cause him to be properly posthumously referred to as a criminal? I know they can’t try a dead body, but will he forever be the “suspect,” as though we can’t be sure? ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/2 "2013-05-08T15:00:24Z")
I don’t believe there can be a trial, since he can’t participate in his own defense. Wouldn’t be much point in going to the trouble and expense of a trial anyway, because you couldn’t administer any punishment in the event of a “guilty” verdict. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/3 "2013-05-08T15:01:51Z")
I recall several cases were closed upon the death of the suspect. Can’t try a dead man, can’t convict without a trial. ETA: He’s only not a criminal in the eyes of the law. We all know what he is. We don’t have to call him an alleged bomber, and neither does the news, that’s also just a legal definition. He’s a criminal, a terrorist, an idiot, a coward, and an asshole, among other things that we’re free to call him. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/4 "2013-05-08T15:05:50Z")
I suspect (heh) that when his brother is convicted, he will become “the other bomber” rather than the “suspected bomber.” ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/5 "2013-05-08T16:05:09Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I don’t believe there can be a trial, since he can’t participate in his own defense. Wouldn’t be much point in going to the trouble and expense of a trial anyway, because you couldn’t administer any punishment in the event of a “guilty” verdict. This. Every person charged with a crime is entitled to defend themselves. Since Tamerlan is dead, he can’t offer a meaningful defense. It used to be centuries ago in England that a felony conviction could result in your heirs being unable to inherit from you (corruption of blood). Apparently some people might have been tempted to commit suicide so as to die in an unconvicted state. Once you were dead, the government couldn’t grab as much. > **[Peer to prison : Courtney Milan—Historical Romance Author](https://www.courtneymilan.com/peer-to-prison/)** > > Crime and Punishment This article discusses cheery subjects, such as: Can you put a peer in debtor’s prison? Does it make sense to commit suicide to avoid conviction? Someone on the Beaumonde asked if you could put a peer in debtor’s prison. This... ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/6 "2013-05-08T16:13:36Z")
I admit that the fact that Tamerlan more or less suicided by cop leads one to want to find some satisfactory end, but if you were to allow prosecutions against the dead you’d have to decide the boundaries of the allowance. What if some hotshot DA decided to posthumously charge Abraham Lincoln with burglary, second degree rape, and aggravated mopery that the DA alleges Lincoln committed in Champaign, IL in 1855? Should we allow the case to proceed and potentially result in history books branding Lincoln a rapist? Who would defend him? While we’re at it, let’s charge Ronald Reagan with stalking and resisting arrest in Alexandria, VA and charge C. Everett Koop with possession of a sawed-off shotgun and DUI in Philadelphia. ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/7 "2013-05-08T16:15:10Z")
If the news reports that Tamerlan was a bomber/terrorist/killer (and not just a suspect), then his brother is guilty by association. The evidence connecting the two is so strong that you really can’t have a scenario where only one of them is guilty. Either both are innocent or both are guilty, at least as an accessory. Once Dzokhar is convicted, they’ll stop referring to Tamerlan as a suspect. Also, the trial for Dzokhar is going to essentially try Tamerlan as well, since his best defense is to say his brother coerced him or brainwashed him or something. ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/8 "2013-05-08T16:42:29Z")
> [@CookingWithGas](#): > > Every media reference to Tamerlan Tsarnaev refers to him as a “suspect.” Is there any legal event that could cause him to be properly posthumously referred to as a criminal? > > I know they can’t try a dead body, but will he forever be the “suspect,” as though we can’t be sure? The death of a criminal defendant and subsequent dismissal of the charge is known as an Abatement. Since he was not charged before he died, he is NOT a criminal, just a suspect. I keyed in; abatement; with a few select words. and got this about MA; Traditionally, the death of a criminal defendant following conviction, but before an appeal can be made, is a ground for abatement. 37 1. See, e.g., Commonwealth v. Eisen, 334 N.E.2d 14, 14 (Mass. 1975). [abatement](http://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=4251&context=flr&sei-redir=1&referer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Furl%3Fsa%3Dt%26rct%3Dj%26q%3Dmassachusetts%2520%252B%2520death%2520of%2520criminal%2520defendant%2520%252B%2520abatement%26source%3Dweb%26cd%3D1%26ved%3D0CC0QFjAA%26url%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fir.lawnet.fordham.edu%252Fcgi%252Fviewcontent.cgi%253Farticle%253D4251%2526context%253Dflr%26ei%3D3H2KUa6TFuTTyAHA44HgBA%26usg%3DAFQjCNG-LO__zxcM4nWqtYtQKX6XRFwGOA#search=%22massachusetts%20%2B%20death%20criminal%20defendant%20%2B%20abatement%22) ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/9 "2013-05-08T16:45:11Z")
Don’t worry. By the end of the year, he will be forgotten and his name will never be mentioned again. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/10 "2013-05-08T16:49:31Z")
Abatement also occurred with Ken Lay, the CEO of Enron. He was convicted at trial, filed an appeal, then died. Since an appeal was pending at the time he died, the conviction was set aside. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/11 "2013-05-08T16:55:38Z")
The only reason for a _media outlet_ to refrain from calling him a bomber is fear of defamation suits. He’s dead, and can’t be defamed, so this is really just habitual ass-covering which happens to be unnecessary. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Greenjeans](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.greenjeans/32/551_2.png) [@Mr.Greenjeans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Greenjeans)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/12 "2013-05-08T17:01:54Z")
Is the same distinction made for non-citizen bad guys? Take the 9/11 hijackers. They were never tried, of course, but I don’t believe I’ve ever seen them referred to as suspects. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/13 "2013-05-08T17:19:18Z")
I am not even anything close to a lawyer, or American for that matter, but my understanding is that when people die in unnatural ways, for instance getting blown up by terrorists, the coroner has to have an inquest into their deaths. At the inquest, the coroner can name a person as the guilty party. I’m guessing that after the inquest into the deaths of the people in Boston, Tsarnaev will cease to be a “suspect”. You can’t try a dead man, but a coroner can find that a (now) dead man committed murders. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/14 "2013-05-08T17:48:19Z")
Coroner’s reports identify the cause of death, not the killer. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/15 "2013-05-08T18:04:22Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Coroner’s reports identify the cause of death, not the killer. According the [the Wiki page](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coroner#United_States), in the US: > [@](#): > > Under NC GS 152, coroners are charged by law to investigate cause and manner of any death caused by default of another person (homicide) and may convene a coroner’s inquest with a jury of six jurors taken from the county jury pool. > > Coroners may arrest persons suspected of homicide and can charge other lesser crimes discovered during the course of any such investigation or inquest. They can hold persons in contempt of court for failing to cooperate or comply with an inquest and may issue summonses or subpoenas and even arrest or material witness warrants, in addition to the setting of bails. In some parts of the US, the Coroner is called the Medical Examiner instead. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/16 "2013-05-08T18:15:40Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > The only reason for a _media outlet_ to refrain from calling him a bomber is fear of defamation suits. He’s dead, and can’t be defamed, so this is really just habitual ass-covering which happens to be unnecessary. Yes, exactly. Feel free to call the dead guy anything you want. Media types just have “suspect” seared into their brains if there’s been no conviction. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/17 "2013-05-08T18:20:38Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > The only reason for a _media outlet_ to refrain from calling him a bomber is fear of defamation suits. He’s dead, and can’t be defamed, so this is really just habitual ass-covering which happens to be unnecessary. It’s a professional ethics thing, not a legal choice. I think courts have found that calling someone an “alleged” criminal is not a defense against libel suits. And yes, after the brother is convicted I expect the “suspect” thing will go away - because Dzokhar will be charged with planning and executing this terrorist attack with his brother, and it stands to reason that if he’s convicted the court accepts that Tamerlan was guilty, too. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/18 "2013-05-08T18:59:54Z")
I think **dracoi** is right - it’s all about Dzokhar and his presumed innocence until conviction. Because the two are inseperably linked, the media is proceding with caution in their descriptions of Tamerlan. I don’t think the media is particularly concerned with Tamerlan’s reputation. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-deceased-bombing-suspect/657797/19 "2013-05-08T20:29:23Z")
AND if you’re convicted of a crime–even murder–and die while your conviction is being _appealed_, you are considered innocent. My cite is the tale of [Joseph Pikul](http://truecrimezine.com/joseph-pikul-diane-murder/)