# The Difference between a Boat and a Ship **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [September 26, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407 "2008-09-26T23:18:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![madlax44](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ec9cab/32.png) [@madlax44](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madlax44)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/1 "2008-09-26T23:18:00Z")
I have read Cecil’s answer on the difference between a boat and a ship and he is WRONG. The size of the vessel and whether it can carry a boat, does not determine it’s definition. Simply put, when a vessel turns at speed to starboard and leans to the starboard side, it is a boat (like a motorcycle going around a curve) If a vessel turns to starboard at speed and leans away from the turn to port, it is a ship. Speed boats, submarines, jet skis, most pleasure craft are boats. Aircraft Carriers, container/tankers, battleships are ships. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/2 "2008-09-26T23:22:53Z")
Why would a submarine lean at all during a turn? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/3 "2008-09-27T00:28:17Z")
Letting out the fart? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/4 "2008-09-27T02:19:15Z")
Hang on… that doesn’t quite jibe, at least by my way of thinking. In a sailing ship, wouldn’t a ship or a boat be heeling to leeward (i.e. the wind is pushing the boat over a little), regardless of whether it was turning or not? Also, what would be the determining factor as to which way it would lean? Size? Design of the keel? Design of the bow? And don’t say whether it’s a ship or a boat either. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/5 "2008-09-30T09:19:02Z")
> [@madlax44](#): > > I have read Cecil’s answer on the difference between a boat and a ship and he is WRONG. The size of the vessel and whether it can carry a boat, does not determine it’s definition. Simply put, when a vessel turns at speed to starboard and leans to the starboard side, it is a boat (like a motorcycle going around a curve) If a vessel turns to starboard at speed and leans away from the turn to port, it is a ship. > > Speed boats, submarines, jet skis, most pleasure craft are boats. > > Aircraft Carriers, container/tankers, battleships are ships. Pardon me if I don’t take the word a guy who shouts “wrong” at me as gospel. Cecil’s answer fits with everything I’ve ever heard and I’ve been working in the legal and commercial side of the maritime industry for nearly 20 years. Besides which firstly your rule is complete nonsense when it comes to sailing ships (see **bump’s** post). Secondly, by your rule, an underpowered, top heavy 6ft dinghy is a ship. This is clearly wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/6 "2008-09-30T19:13:25Z")
A cite for the column: [What’s the difference between a boat and a ship?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/754/whats-the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship) ---
**Author:** ![RedSwinglineOne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a9adbd/32.png) [@RedSwinglineOne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedSwinglineOne)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/7 "2008-09-30T22:13:06Z")
I shall not today attempt further to define weather a vessel is, or is not a ship;and perhaps I could never succeed in intelligibly doing so. [But I know it when I see it…](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_know_it_when_I_see_it) ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/8 "2008-10-03T18:39:20Z")
> [@madlax44](#): > > I have read Cecil’s answer on the difference between a boat and a ship and he is WRONG. The size of the vessel and whether it can carry a boat, does not determine it’s definition. Simply put, when a vessel turns at speed to starboard and leans to the starboard side, it is a boat (like a motorcycle going around a curve) If a vessel turns to starboard at speed and leans away from the turn to port, it is a ship. > > Speed boats, submarines, jet skis, most pleasure craft are boats. > > Aircraft Carriers, container/tankers, battleships are ships. OK, I was in the Navy (and a submarine officer), and this is the first time that I’ve ever heard this theory. Where did you get this from? Not to mention the fact that the direction a vessel leans during a turn has to do more with the draft of the vessel, how much superstructure is above the waterline, the location of the vertical center of gravity, and how much righting arm there is for the vessel. For a submarine, it gets even more complicated, because a submarine behaves differently when surfaced and submerged. A submarine making a right turn on the surface leans outward to port, just like most other large surface vessels. A submarine making a right turn when submerged leans inward to the starboard, just like an aircraft. Also, in the modern Navy, submarines are indeed referred to as “boats,” but it is not uncommon to also hear them referred to as “ships.” In formal documents, submarines are invariably referred to as “ships.” So all in all, I’d say that you don’t know what you are talking about. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/9 "2008-10-03T19:28:36Z")
> [@robby](#): > > Also, in the modern Navy, submarines are indeed referred to as “boats,” but it is not uncommon to also hear them referred to as “ships.” In formal documents, submarines are invariably referred to as “ships.” I’m glad to hear that. The notion of a “capital boat” has always seemed immensely silly to me, and any vessel armed with city-killers has _got_ to qualify as “capital”. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/10 "2008-10-03T21:46:07Z")
Using Cecil’s Dictum of What’s A Ship and What’s A Boat, sometimes a ship can be a “boat” to another ship: [File:MV Blue Marlin carrying USS Cole.jpg - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MV_Blue_Marlin_carrying_USS_Cole.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2008, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/11 "2008-10-04T04:22:31Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Using Cecil’s Dictum of What’s A Ship and What’s A Boat, sometimes a ship can be a “boat” to another ship: [File:MV Blue Marlin carrying USS Cole.jpg - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MV_Blue_Marlin_carrying_USS_Cole.jpg) Yes, I think we need a modern addendum: if it takes a heavy lift ship to lift a ship, it’s still a ship. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2008, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/12 "2008-10-06T17:57:23Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Using Cecil’s Dictum of What’s A Ship and What’s A Boat, sometimes a ship can be a “boat” to another ship: [File:MV Blue Marlin carrying USS Cole.jpg - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MV_Blue_Marlin_carrying_USS_Cole.jpg) Whoah. There’s something you don’t see every day. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2008, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/13 "2008-10-06T22:40:57Z")
Yes, though it should be noted that destroyers, as a class, barely escaped being “boats” themselves. ---
**Author:** ![vison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/e47774/32.png) [@vison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vison)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2008, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/14 "2008-10-07T02:44:48Z")
The Captain says: This is a ship. (And it was.) A boat is what you look for when the ship is sinking. That’s the rule I live by. Well, one of them. ---
**Author:** ![Snnipe\_70E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@Snnipe\_70E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snnipe_70E)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/15 "2008-10-09T04:31:52Z")
I know several ex Navy people that served on the Connie a air craft carrier, they all refered to it as the boat. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/16 "2008-10-09T14:11:31Z")
They’re synonyms. They may have different conotations, but they can refer to the same thing. So you are not going to get a definitive answer. (From anyone but Unca Cece, that is.) ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/17 "2008-10-10T00:56:22Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > They’re synonyms. They may have different conotations, but they can refer to the same thing. So you are not going to get a definitive answer. No they’re not. If you think they are, call a ship a boat to it’s master. Wear your lifejacket, and I hope you can swim. ---
**Author:** ![cplschnapps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b487fb/32.png) [@cplschnapps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cplschnapps)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/18 "2008-10-10T06:48:26Z")
Madlax44 is confused. What he’s referring to is the difference between planing hull and displacement hull vessels. A vessel on plane will lean inward while turning, like an airplane, but the same vessel if moving at less than planing speed will lean outward, like a displacement hull vessel. This has nothing to do with size; my 12’ rowboat is a displacement hull and leans outward (at least in theory, I can’t row fast enough to make the lean noticeable). And some hydrofoil vessels are certainly large enough to be called ships by any definition, but lean inward when planing on their foils. So Cecil’s definition stands. ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/19 "2008-10-10T06:59:46Z")
> [@Snnipe\_70E](#): > > I know several ex Navy people that served on the Connie a air craft carrier, they all refered to it as the boat. I currently serve on an Aircraft Carrier(The Carl Vinson, CVN-70) and I’ve heard the two terms used interchangeably by my coworkers. And I was stationed on a submarine that was designated a Moored Training Ship(MTS-635), if things aren’t confused enough. ---
**Author:** ![critter42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ba0ec/32.png) [@critter42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/critter42)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/20 "2008-10-10T18:48:43Z")
**HPL** , are you a Nuke? I’m assuming that my memory isn’t faulty and that the MTS was Charleston’s prototype facility (I prototyped in Connecticut back in the day) Anyhoo, I have to back up what the other squids have already said. And also agree that submarines are so specialized in their function and missions relative to the other ocean-going vessels in the US Navy, that the whole boat/ship thing is kinda like asking what a duckbilled platypus is (and don’t say marsupial - I’m trying to use a smidgen of hyperbole here…). Oh, and **madlax44** , trying to come in here and prove your superiority to The Master by starting your first post with the sentence “I have read Cecil’s answer on {insert column subject here} and he is WRONG.” is not the way to make friends here. Many have tried, most have failed and only wound up making themselves look foolish in the process. However, as this is apparently also your only post on this board, I have the distinct impression you won’t be back to see this answer either, so I guess I’m just wasting my breath. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407.md?page=2)