# The Difference between a Boat and a Ship **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [September 26, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407 "2008-09-26T23:18:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2008, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/21 "2008-10-22T19:54:03Z")
Originally Posted by **BigT** : > [@](#): > > They’re synonyms. They may have different conotations, but they can refer to the same thing. So you are not going to get a definitive answer. Originally Posted by **Princhester** : > [@](#): > > No they’re not. If you think they are, call a ship a boat to it’s master. Wear your lifejacket, and I hope you can swim. Yes they are, and you’re saying otherwise does not make it so. The English language is filled with words that have overlapping meanings. Try “road” vs “street”. The fact that one word has slightly different connotations does not obliterate the similarity of meaning. A “boat” is any object used to convey humans and/or payloads across water by floating on the water. A boat includes canoes and oil tankers. “Ships” are typically meant to refer to large boats. A rule of thumb is a boat big enough for people to stand up and walk around without risk of capsizing the boat is a ship. YMMV. IANA Dictionary. IANA Cecil. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/22 "2008-10-23T01:23:38Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > Yes they are, and you’re saying otherwise does not make it so. The English language is filled with words that have overlapping meanings. Try “road” vs “street”. The fact that one word has slightly different connotations does not obliterate the similarity of meaning. **BigT** ’s post is self contradictory for a start. A synonym is a word that is, per the OED, one that is identical & co-extensive in sense and usage with another of the same language. If the two words “have different connotations” they are not synonyms. Further, you cannot say two words mean the same if they are merely overlapping to some degree. “Boat” may be used by some people to refer to a large craft, but no significant number of people use “ship” to mean a small craft. “Road” vs “street” is one thing, but “road” vs “motorway” is another. ---
**Author:** ![Virgil\_Tibbs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/c4cdca/32.png) [@Virgil\_Tibbs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Virgil_Tibbs)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/23 "2008-10-23T04:06:32Z")
I thought ships were ocean-going but boats weren’t. Which is why ferries are all boats, never mind how big they are. But then submarines are boats, so… ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/24 "2008-10-23T22:59:38Z")
**Princhester** said: > [@](#): > > A synonym is a word that is, per the OED, one that is identical & co-extensive in sense and usage with another of the same language. If the two words “have different connotations” they are not synonyms. Interestingly, I find different usage. [Answers.com](http://Answers.com) dictionary > [@](#): > > 1. A word having the same or nearly the same meaning as another word or other words in a language. [answers.com](http://answers.com) literary dictionary > [@](#): > > a word that has the same—or virtually the same—meaning as another word, and so can substitute for it in certain contexts. Columbia Encyclopedia > [@](#): > > word having a meaning that is the same as or very similar to the meaning of another word of the same language. Some are alike in some meanings only, as _live_ and _dwell_. Grammar Dictionary > [@](#): > > Words that mean roughly the same thing. _Container_ and _receptacle_ are synonyms. Wikipedia > [@](#): > > **Synonyms** … are different words with identical or at least similar meanings… > > An example of synonyms are the words _car_ and _automobile_. Similarly, if we talk about a long time or an extended time, _long_ and _extended_ become synonyms. In the figurative sense, two words are often said to be synonymous if they have the same connotation: > > … > > Some lexicographers claim that no synonyms have exactly the same meaning (in all contexts or social levels of language) because etymology, orthography, phonic qualities, ambiguous meanings, usage, etc. make them unique. However, many people feel that the synonyms they use are identical in meaning for all practical purposes, and are interchangeable. (all found [Answers - The Most Trusted Place for Answering Life's Questions](http://www.answers.com/topic/synonym) ) So, you may be technically correct that a synonym is only really a synonym if all usages are exactly correct, but it is certainly a widespread use of _synonym_ to apply to words that have similar or overlapping meaning, not necessarily identical in all connotations. > [@](#): > > Further, you cannot say two words mean the same if they are merely overlapping to some degree. “Boat” may be used by some people to refer to a large craft, but no significant number of people use “ship” to mean a small craft. > > “Road” vs “street” is one thing, but “road” vs “motorway” is another. But if I point at an oil tanker and call it a “boat”, I am not wrong. If I call a canoe a “ship”, I am wrong. Ships are a subset of boats, though some people prefer the more limited term for their specific circumstances, because it conveys a sense of importance upon the person. I can say two words mean the same thing if in the context being used they are overlapping. There is no explicit definition for _ship_\* other than “big boat”. The word is an old word, and there is no central authority to declare definitions. There is only convention and usage, and historical pretext. The OED has no authority to force word use, it only records what the historical use has been and the origins as they can be determined. \*In the context of a vessel, as opposed to other uses such as the verb form for transporting goods, etc. \*\*Virgil Tibbs \*\* said: > [@](#): > > I thought ships were ocean-going but boats weren’t. Says who? ---
**Author:** ![itfitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/59ef9b/32.png) [@itfitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/itfitz)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2008, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/25 "2008-10-28T18:48:43Z")
I spent 11 years in the Navy, and these were the rules I was taught: - a ship can carry a boat, but not vice-versa (exactly in agreement with Cecil) - a ship’s crewmember can refer to his/her own ship as a “boat,” but cannot refer to another ship as a “boat.” In other words, if I were stationed on the USS Enterprise, I could say, “What time do I need to be back on the boat?” But when referring to the USS Constellation, I would have to say, “Did you see the goofy guys from that other ship?” ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2008, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/26 "2008-10-28T19:31:18Z")
In other words, Boat may be used as a term of affection by the crew of the ship. Calling someone eles’ ship a boat is fighting words. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2008, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/27 "2008-10-28T21:04:31Z")
**itfitz** said: > [@](#): > > I spent 11 years in the Navy, and these were the rules I was taught: Blah, blah, blah, what you mention boils down to terms used as defined by the Navy for the Navy, basically terms for courtesy sake. But the U.S. Navy is not the authority for the definition of common words. There is _no_ authority, only common and historical usage. “Boat” is a generic term that _some people_ do not feel conveys enough status/moral imperative/significance to their personal vessel, and only the word “ship” can convey that significance. But that’s personal preference and that is all it is. A “ship” is a big boat. A “boat” is any floating vessel for transporting humans and/or goods. A supertanker is a boat, it is also a ship. A rowboat is a boat, but it is not a ship. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/28 "2008-10-29T00:51:21Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > “Boat” is a generic term that _some people_ do not feel conveys enough status/moral imperative/significance to their personal vessel, and only the word “ship” can convey that significance. But that’s personal preference and that is all it is. A “ship” is a big boat. A “boat” is any floating vessel for transporting humans and/or goods. A supertanker is a boat, it is also a ship. A rowboat is a boat, but it is not a ship. Do you realise how funny it is that you are dismissing everyone else’s experience including, in particular, the experience of those who actually work with ships and boats and therefore talk about them more than most (ie have a high level of usage) as irrelevant blah, while stating your own opinion in categorical terms as if it were the word of a deity? Do you see the irony? Why exactly do you think that what you say is Unarguably Correct, while what others say is not? I’m very much inclined to a descriptive and not a prescriptive view of language, but there is necessarily a tension (and a useful tension) between keeping some precision, consistency and uniformity in language use (which is what prescriptivism does) and keeping a reasonably good relationship between definitions of words as used and recorded definitions (which is what descriptivism does). I know a number of people who refer to the box containing their desktop computer as their “hard drive” yet anyone in the field would say that is simply incorrect. It takes more than some usage by some people who don’t know much about the subject matter to make a word take on a meaning with the type of certainty that you baldly assert. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/29 "2008-10-29T02:19:32Z")
By the way, I notice that you are from Houston, or perhaps going by your username you are an ex-pat. Do you accept that you are a Yank, or at least that locals in Houston are Yanks (ie short for Yankees)? ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2008, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/30 "2008-10-31T00:16:33Z")
**Princhester** said: > [@](#): > > Do you realise how funny it is that you are dismissing everyone else’s experience including, in particular, the experience of those who actually work with ships and boats and therefore talk about them more than most (ie have a high level of usage) as irrelevant blah, while stating your own opinion in categorical terms as if it were the word of a deity? Do you see the irony? Why exactly do you think that what you say is Unarguably Correct, while what others say is not? Yes, I do see the irony. And I do seem to be coming off very adamant in my use of the words. Here’s the problem - I cannot seem to find any justification for limiting the use of “boat” to small water vessels, other than some predisposition that a large water vessel must be a “ship”. The word “boat” has old roots dating back to Indo-European, which would certainly justify why the early uses of the word apply to smaller vessels simply because when the word originated, there \*were no \*large vessels. Does that mean the word stops applying because the boats get bigger? I don’t see how there is any authority to definitively declare the use of “boat” as improper against large, ocean-going vessels. But maybe it’s a bit like the IAU getting to redefine the word “planet”. The community of water vessel users all agree that boats are small and ships are large, so while the dividing line is murky, there is an agreed distinction. I guess I’m just looking for a better justification than “because we said so”, when the “we” isn’t even clearly delineated. I don’t particularly like being called wrong for calling a supertanker a “boat” when the only justification that can be given is you\* don’t like the use. If floats on water, it transports people, it’s a boat. \*Whomever “you” is at the time. > [@](#): > > By the way, I notice that you are from Houston, or perhaps going by your username you are an ex-pat. Do you accept that you are a Yank, or at least that locals in Houston are Yanks (ie short for Yankees)? Kinda depends upon the context. If you mean “Yankee” as in “Yankee Doodle” as in “American”, of course. If you mean “Yankee” as in “northerner”, then no. You seem to be using the first and hoping I’ll take it as the second. ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2008, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/31 "2008-10-31T01:38:46Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > I don’t particularly like being called wrong for calling a supertanker a “boat” when the only justification that can be given is you\* don’t like the use. If floats on water, it transports people, it’s a boat. Almost as bad as if you described the usage of “ship” versus “boat” in a particular community, without implying other usage was wrong, and someone responded dismissively with “Blah, blah, blah”? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2008, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/32 "2008-10-31T02:35:45Z")
From the link > [@](#): > > With regard to motorized craft, a ship is a large vessel intended for oceangoing or at least deep-water transport, and a boat is anything else. I have a hard time describing a self-propelled barge as either a ship or a boat. Or a canoe, kayak, or PWC or raft. And the USS Cole, which I would call a ship, has been carried on the deck of a ship. Simply put, I know a ship when I see one. What I don’t know is when a boat qualifies as a yacht. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2008, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/33 "2008-10-31T04:01:00Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > I guess I’m just looking for a better justification than “because we said so”, when the “we” isn’t even clearly delineated . But you are not going to get it. That’s not the way language works. Words mean very largely what they are used to mean. There are any number of words that are very old but are now used to mean something totally different. There is no absolute authority. > [@](#): > > Kinda depends upon the context. If you mean “Yankee” as in “Yankee Doodle” as in “American”, of course. If you mean “Yankee” as in “northerner”, then no. You seem to be using the first and hoping I’ll take it as the second. Well I just mentioned this as an illustration because in Australia we sometimes call Americans “Yanks” but when if we use that term about a southerner, they tend to get offended because they consider the word to mean a northerner. In fact, I have never before heard a southerner admit that Yank can be a generic term for American. If you consider that it can be a generic term, then it’s not a useful parallel for the purpose of this debate. ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2008, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/34 "2008-10-31T13:31:25Z")
> [@](#): > > Well I just mentioned this as an illustration because in Australia we sometimes call Americans “Yanks” but when if we use that term about a southerner, they tend to get offended because they consider the word to mean a northerner. In fact, I have never before heard a southerner admit that Yank can be a generic term for American. If you consider that it can be a generic term, then it’s not a useful parallel for the purpose of this debate. That’s an interesting point, probably worthy of its own thread. As someone from a northern state, I wouldn’t think twice about someone from another country using “Yank” to refer to any American, but now that you point it out, I can see that someone from a former Confederate state might have a completely different opinion. Someone I know who lived in the DC area used to say that if you go a little South of DC, the Civil War ended Yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Dave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/46a35a/32.png) [@Great\_Dave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Dave)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2008, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/35 "2008-11-02T04:08:27Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Using Cecil’s Dictum of What’s A Ship and What’s A Boat, sometimes a ship can be a “boat” to another ship: [File:MV Blue Marlin carrying USS Cole.jpg - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MV_Blue_Marlin_carrying_USS_Cole.jpg) Looks like they could’ve put the Cole parallel to the Blue Marlin, but just barely. Wouldn’t it be a little tricky at that angle? ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/36 "2008-11-03T21:34:50Z")
\*\*ZenBeam \*\* said: > [@](#): > > Almost as bad as if you described the usage of “ship” versus “boat” in a particular community, without implying other usage was wrong, and someone responded dismissively with “Blah, blah, blah”? Blah, blah, blah, I’m not listening! 😉 Yeah, that was a bit much. I read **itfitz** ’s remark as justification for one particular usage in all cases, which is why my response says it only applies to the Navy. \*\*The Flying Dutchman \*\* said: > [@](#): > > I have a hard time describing a self-propelled barge as either a ship or a boat. > > Or a canoe, kayak, or PWC or raft. “Boat” is a generic word. Same as aircraft. A 747, an F-22, a biplane, a glider, and a blimp are all aircraft. > [@](#): > > What I don’t know is when a boat qualifies as a yacht. A yacht is what rich people own. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/37 "2008-11-03T21:36:49Z")
**Princhester** said: > [@](#): > > But you are not going to get it. That’s not the way language works. Words mean very largely what they are used to mean. There are any number of words that are very old but are now used to mean something totally different. There is no absolute authority. DUDE, that’s what **I’m** saying! ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/38 "2008-11-04T04:38:00Z")
Yes but you also want to appoint yourself as the authority as to what boat means, while others who use the word more than you and who work in the field say you are wrong. And you won’t accept what they say because they don’t have authority. But you do. Apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/39 "2008-11-04T17:01:18Z")
No, I don’t claim any authority, other than that of a person who uses the word. My attempts to summarize the definition are my understanding of how the word is used in general language by many people. What I am reacting to is people declaring that my understanding is wrong, but not having any stronger basis for their definition than I have for my definition. If I seem adamant, it is because I have **just as much authority** as they do. Look, you want to say a boat can only be small or can’t travel on the ocean, that’s your business, but _I_’m going to call a ship a class of boats. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407/40 "2012-05-23T15:43:27Z")
Bumping this thread, since Cecil’s column is back on the front page. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-difference-between-a-boat-and-a-ship/465407.md?page=3)