# The driver who killed a cyclist last night used to be the Attorney General of Ontario. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 2, 2009, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596 "2009-09-02T02:27:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2009, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/61 "2009-09-04T16:41:34Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > I disagree with those upthread who are saying that the cops are smearing Sheppard. Ironically, it is not in their interests to do so. If they claim he was drunk and dangerous, they have to explain why they let him ride his bike away scot free after his confrontation with his girlfriend … I don’t think the cops are smearing him either, actually. They’ve been pretty consistent with a simple message: “Yes, he was detained briefly at his girlfriend’s earlier. No criminal activity occurred. He was told to go home.” The media on the other hand has been sensationally painting everyone in sight with the “asshole” brush, it seems. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2009, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/62 "2009-09-04T18:24:43Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > I disagree with those upthread who are saying that the cops are smearing Sheppard. I for one never stated such. I stated that a smear engine seemed to be in work from Bryant’s side that was painting Sheppard with the 'evil, alchoholic, suicidal psychopath. That would be the work Navigator, Ltd. which Bryant hired after his arrest. There has been some backlash, resulting in some media comments about Bryant’s own actions and attitude. Then folks started crying ‘unfair!!’. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2009, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/63 "2009-09-04T18:37:26Z")
Legally, this seems to me to be basically the Bernard Goetz case. Bryant was confronted by someone who may or may not have been an assailant who may or may not have threatened him, and the jury will have to decide whether Bryant was justified in escalating to deadly force. Note that Goetz was mostly acquitted. Factually, I guess it comes down to what Sheppard was doing and saying when he grabbed the door. If he was reaching for Bryant while roaring, “I’m going to kill you,” Bryant has a strong defense. If all Sheppard did was shout, “Stop and wait for the cops,” then Bryant’s in a much tougher position. The fact that Bryant appears to have been deliberately taking reckless actions to make Sheppard collide with something (and not just fleeing) makes his actions seem considered, rather than simply panicky. This suggests to me that negligent homicide may not ultimately be the correct assessment. If Bryant was genuinely threatened sufficiently to justify deadly force, then it looks like justifiable self-defense, and the charge should be dropped. If he was not sufficiently threatened, then his actions sound more like manslaughter. Bryant could try to argue that he did not realize that his driving could constitute deadly force, I suppose. His unique personal history in cracking down on street racing, however, would seem to make that defense a real stretch in his case. It’s a lucky thing he didn’t hit anyone else while up on the sidewalk. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2009, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/64 "2009-09-04T18:38:18Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > Yup. It’s basically comparable to two assholes getting into a fist-fight in a bar. You’d charge _both_ of them with felony assault or what have you, but when one of the combatants ends up dead, then the other will get charged with some form of manslaughter. I’m not sure it’s _just_ like two assholes getting into a fist fight. If this was a few seconds, where Bryant panicked and was only thinking of getting himself (and his wife) away from an aggressor, than the two actors were reacting to a “fight or flight” situation, with Shepard choosing “flight” and Bryant choosing “flight.” The consequences of Bryant’s decision are terrible, but there’s a significant difference in intent between “I’m gonna get that guy” and “I’m getting the fuck out of here, _now_.” ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2009, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/65 "2009-09-04T19:11:03Z")
> [@Larry\_Mudd](#): > > I’m not sure it’s _just_ like two assholes getting into a fist fight. If this was a few seconds, where Bryant panicked and was only thinking of getting himself (and his wife) away from an aggressor, than the two actors were reacting to a “fight or flight” situation, with Shepard choosing “flight” and Bryant choosing “flight.” Yes, but presently witness accounts are conflicting, with some saying Bryant was yelling at the cyclist _before_ the initial collision took place. Local media are reporting that it is unknown whether Sheppard was “attacking” them or simply trying to prevent Bryant from leaving the scene. What is consistent in reports of witness accounts is that they were both yelling at each other, then Bryant stormed off, and then Sheppard gave chase. That’s why video footage is so important: to find out if Bryant floored it because Sheppard charged them, or if Sheppard charged them because Bryant floored it (which would have been a hit-and-run). That’s why I think is pretty much _just_ like two guy’s getting into a fist-fight and just as hard to figure out what exactly happened. Who started it? Who was acting vs. who was reacting? Was either guy reacting in self-defense (the guy who threw the first punch could still have been acting in self-defense after all). ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2009, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/66 "2009-09-04T19:20:17Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > I for one never stated such. I stated that a smear engine seemed to be in work from Bryant’s side that was painting Sheppard with the 'evil, alchoholic, suicidal psychopath. That would be the work Navigator, Ltd. which Bryant hired after his arrest. > > There has been some backlash, resulting in some media comments about Bryant’s own actions and attitude. Then folks started crying ‘unfair!!’. I don’t wish to appear argumentative, but: > [@](#): > > Maybe, maybe not. It seems that the info about Sheppard’s drinking was released very quickly and that the **police are doing their darndest to smear the dead guy.** [Emphasis added] ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/67 "2009-09-05T02:04:08Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > I don’t wish to appear argumentative, but: > > [Emphasis added] Point taken. I misspoke (or typed). ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/68 "2009-09-05T03:45:30Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > This suggests to me that negligent homicide may not ultimately be the correct assessment. If Bryant was genuinely threatened sufficiently to justify deadly force, then it looks like justifiable self-defense, and the charge should be dropped. If he was not sufficiently threatened, then his actions sound more like manslaughter. In Canada, the distinction between criminal negligence causing death and manslaughter isn’t that great. And in some cases, the mental element for crim. neg. might be more culpable than manslaughter. [Criminal negligence](http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/ShowDoc/cs/C-46/bo-ga:l_VIII::bo-ga:l_IX/20090831/en?page=6&isPrinting=false#codese:219) is based on “wanton or reckless disregard for the lives or safety of other persons.” [Manslaughter](http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/ShowDoc/cs/C-46/bo-ga:l_VIII::bo-ga:l_IX/20090831/en?page=6&isPrinting=false#codese:234) is any culpable homicide that isn’t murder or infanticide. It’s also sometimes described as “unlawful act manslaughter” - that is, that manslaughter is simply homicide caused by an unlawful act, such as an assault. There is no element of “wanton or reckless disregard” in manslaughter, so in some circumstances the mental element for manslaughter might not be as culpable as that for criminal negligence. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/69 "2009-09-05T03:50:19Z")
I wouldn’t call setting out relevant information as being smearing. That the deceased was a drunk, was a druggie, had a very long list of oustanding warrants, had been described by police in a public warning as having a history of violence, had been in conflict with the law earlier that night, and was drunk that night, are all relevant to the matter, for there is one heck of a difference between a person verbally venting, and a violent drunk smashing a pack on a hood and then coming at the driver in an open top car. Which type was the deceased? Two wrongs don’t make a right, and based on the information made public to date, I would not venture to have an opinion as to whether or not the accused is guilty, but I certainly consider the background of the deceased as being very relevant in trying to piece together what took place, and why the accused did not take his foot off the gas. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/70 "2009-09-05T04:32:17Z")
I forgot to include that the acccused had already been in a fight previously that night. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/71 "2009-09-05T11:39:34Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > He left provincial politics a couple of months ago. He was AG for four years (2003-3007). The Premier had moved him from AG to Minister of Aboriginal Affairs in a Cabinet shuffle in 2007. This spring he announced he was leaving politics. > > Here’s his [wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Bryant_(politician)) article. Ex-Attorney general and ex-Minister of Aboriginal Affairs kills an aboriginal. I’d laugh at the irony, if the situation were not so tragic. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/72 "2009-09-05T12:41:45Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Leaving aside the pitbull hijack for now, what a bunch of friggin’ hypocrites you people are. Did Bryant use bad judgement? Absolutely, but good luck any one of us doing better in that situation. The papers can try to paint Sheppard as an innocent victim all they want, but he wasn’t. Not even close. This isn’t the Pit and frankly, your criticism here is totally divorced from any sane or literate reading of the thread. It’s like you’re replying to posts that aren’t there. ---
**Author:** ![Eats\_Crayons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/278dde/32.png) [@Eats\_Crayons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eats_Crayons)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/73 "2009-09-05T16:51:18Z")
I’m finding media coverage of this event interesting/odd. The further west you go, the more details you are getting about Sheppard’s history. For example, I have been able to find no mention of Sheppard’s previous run-ins with police in Edmonton in the online version of local papers, but the farther west you go, the more the on-line news fill in unsavory background information. Meanwhile, Sheppard’s on-again-off-again (ex)girlfriend. Was initially reported as his “ex-girlfriend” (when he showed up drunk at her place, wouldn’t leave and police were called to make him leave), then she was his “girlfriend”, and in yesterday’s National Post she’s his “fiancee”. ---
**Author:** ![Annie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/858c86/32.png) [@Annie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/74 "2009-09-05T17:39:37Z")
At this stage of the media/PR shit blizzard, I’m treating all data as suspect. Hasty judgements based on unverified info aren’t bringing anyone back from the dead, there’s time (and prosecutors, and courts) to get this to shake out ---
**Author:** ![Flutterby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Flutterby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flutterby)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/75 "2009-09-05T18:04:25Z")
> [@Eats\_Crayons](#): > > I’m finding media coverage of this event interesting/odd. The further west you go, the more details you are getting about Sheppard’s history. For example, I have been able to find no mention of Sheppard’s previous run-ins with police in Edmonton in the online version of local papers, but the farther west you go, the more the on-line news fill in unsavory background information. Apparently he was from Edmonton area,or at least they mentioned his mother was in Edmonton and at least one of the mothers of his four children also. > [@](#): > > Meanwhile, Sheppard’s on-again-off-again (ex)girlfriend. Was initially reported as his “ex-girlfriend” (when he showed up drunk at her place, wouldn’t leave and police were called to make him leave), then she was his “girlfriend”, and in yesterday’s National Post she’s his “fiancee”. I noticed that, the last article I read said ‘they were having troubles and on a break but they were engaged’. Or something like that. ---
**Author:** ![Picard\_Kills\_Kirk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/dec6dc/32.png) [@Picard\_Kills\_Kirk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Picard_Kills_Kirk)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/76 "2009-09-05T18:33:45Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > I might have difficulty deciding what to do, driving my car with my wife sitting next to me, in a busy street, with a person hanging on to the side of my car screaming at me. It’s a tricky situation, and there doesn’t appear to be an easy way out. But I hope I wouldn’t try driving on the wrong side of the road, hoping to knock the person off. It really doesn’t seem the best solution. I actually hope this is the first thing I would do! If some crazy is hanging onto my car getting dragged along because he’s so upset/angry/drunk/whatever, I would not feel bad about smashing him into a few mailboxes. How do I know if this guy (who I already know is crazy enough to hang on to my moving car) isn’t next going to pull a gun or knife out and attack me? The way the story states it, I have more sympathy for the former AG than the rider. ---
**Author:** ![Eats\_Crayons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/278dde/32.png) [@Eats\_Crayons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eats_Crayons)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/77 "2009-09-05T18:48:06Z")
> [@Flutterby](#): > > Apparently he was from Edmonton area,or at least they mentioned his mother was in Edmonton and at least one of the mothers of his four children also. I realize that, but the information is available to the media here too, but it isn’t being reported as thoroughly. For example the Toronto Star keeps going on and on about how Bryant’s expert defence team is spinning events, but there has been nothing about Sheppard having been fighting with a man, nothing about warrants. The Toronto Sun _shudder_ has been mirroring Edmonton Sun stories. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/78 "2009-09-05T19:36:13Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > I wouldn’t call setting out relevant information as being smearing. That the deceased was a drunk, was a druggie, And yet we knew about within a few minutes of Bryant hiring the Navigator. > [@](#): > > had a very long list of oustanding warrants, had been described by police in a public warning as having a history of violence, had been in conflict with the law earlier that night, and was drunk that night, are all relevant to the matter, Was he drunk? He been described as drinking but in his earlier ‘conflict’ with the police he was described as not being drunk at all. > [@](#): > > for there is one heck of a difference between a person verbally venting, and a violent drunk smashing a pack on a hood and then coming at the driver in an open top car. Which type was the deceased? Someone whose bike had just been struck by a driver? I’m not saying Sheppard is innocent in these matters, I am saying that we seemed to get quite the smear campaign on him. Sheppard doesn’t have the benefit of hiring a PR group to bring up Bryant’s indiscretions and possible drinking. ---
**Author:** ![Flutterby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Flutterby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flutterby)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2009, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/79 "2009-09-05T19:50:58Z")
> [@Eats\_Crayons](#): > > I realize that, but the information is available to the media here too, but it isn’t being reported as thoroughly. For example the Toronto Star keeps going on and on about how Bryant’s expert defence team is spinning events, but there has been nothing about Sheppard having been fighting with a man, nothing about warrants. The Toronto Sun _shudder_ has been mirroring Edmonton Sun stories. Ew, the Sun is horrible. Yeah that is odd that that info isn’t really being put out in Toronto but it is here. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2009, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596/80 "2009-09-06T02:21:50Z")
> [@Eats\_Crayons](#): > > For example the Toronto Star keeps going on and on about how Bryant’s expert defence team is spinning events, but there has been nothing about Sheppard having been fighting with a man, nothing about warrants. Sheppard was a cyclist. Therefore, in the eyes of the Toronto Star, he was blameless. As a cyclist, who was thus environmentally-friendly, he couldn’t be at fault against the big, bad, fossil-fuel-driven and polluting car; which was obviously driven by a maniacal madman who hated environmentally-friendly cyclists. Heck, if the Star had its way, Sheppard probably also rescued kittens and puppies in his spare time, and was ready to go to Somalia to alleviate hunger. Yes, folks, the Toronto Star is to the left what the Toronto Sun is to the right. Having liven in Toronto and read both, I’m serious. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-driver-who-killed-a-cyclist-last-night-used-to-be-the-attorney-general-of-ontario/508596.md?page=5)