# The Durham indictments prosecuting fake Trump 'collusion' **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 23, 2021, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215 "2021-09-23T20:11:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2022, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/402 "2022-09-13T23:34:41Z")
_Technically_, the assertion is that he had no reason to lie in July of 2016 and July of 2020. The former is definitely before this happened, as far as I can tell, but the latter is definitely after, unless he’s arguing that all the death threats came after July 2020. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2022, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/403 "2022-09-13T23:44:48Z")
Even in 2016 he probably realized that talking to the FBI about being an informant on Russia might not be the best thing for one’s health. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/404 "2022-09-14T01:24:54Z")
Look, they hooked him up to the motive meter and scientifically measured zero motive. For four straight years. It’s irrefutable. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/405 "2022-09-14T11:25:32Z")
[New York Times](https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/14/us/politics/durham-inquiry-trump-russia.html) is reporting that the Durham grand jury is expired and no motions pending to extend or convene a new one. “Over the course of his inquiry, Mr. Durham has developed cases against two people accused of lying to the F.B.I. in relation to outside efforts to investigate purported Trump-Russia ties, but he has not charged any conspiracy or put any high-level officials on trial. The recent developments suggest that the chances of any more indictments are remote.” Poor Sam. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/406 "2022-09-14T12:55:23Z")
So to all the various posts by various posters telling us that, if we just wait, the validity of Durham’s position will be revealed or the “reckoning” will come etc etc: Can we stop waiting now? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/407 "2022-09-14T12:56:41Z")
DurAnon ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/408 "2022-09-14T15:03:07Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Can we stop waiting now? Nope, nope. What if something else happens. Must wait more. (Until we forget about the whole stupid thing) ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/409 "2022-09-14T15:16:01Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I am not a lawyer, but I have seen several analyses of this indictment which say it’s a placeholder for further conspiracy charges. A number of individuals are identified by title they held at the time, and these include current National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan and other people currently in the Biden administration. I have also heard that the Durham investigation is now focused on conspiracy charges. This indictment, so I’ve been told, nullifies the statute of limitations for all those who may have been part of the effort to manufacture evidence against Trump. I am not a lawyer, but a man from a year in the future, and I can tell you that none of this bore any resemblance to what really happened. I suggest skipping this thread, you’ll be disappointed. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/410 "2022-09-14T16:15:10Z")
It feels like some of you are forgetting the Conspiracy Theorists’s Credo: > Conspiracy theories resist falsification and are reinforced by circular reasoning: both evidence against the conspiracy and an absence of evidence for it are re-interpreted as evidence of its truth, whereby the conspiracy becomes a matter of faith rather than something that can be proven or disproven. [**SOURCE**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory) So, _ipso facto_, Durham apparently winding it down is incontrovertible proof of … uh … what was it again? QED ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/411 "2022-09-14T16:39:24Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > So, _ipso facto_, Durham apparently winding it down is incontrovertible proof …that They™ got to him! ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/412 "2022-09-14T17:02:37Z")
Its proof that they got all the evidence they needed to take down Biden and reinstall Trump. Big Things happening in the next Two Weeks!! ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/413 "2022-09-14T17:03:46Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I am not a lawyer, but a man from a year in the future, and I can tell you that none of this bore any resemblance to what really happened. When a post contains phrases like, “I have seen several analyses”, “I have also heard”, and “so I’ve been told”, but doesn’t cite any sources for any of that, you can rest assured that one year in the future will bear no resemblance to the way that post envisioned things going down. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/414 "2022-09-14T22:24:07Z")
RELEASE THE MEMO! … wait, sorry, getting my right wing fantasagasms mixed-up. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2022, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/415 "2022-09-15T15:40:45Z")
READ THE TRANSCRIPT!……. The recent court filing that shut down Trump’s lawsuit over Trump/Russia was interesting and I think it has some implications for Durham’s investigation. Part of the filing was a detailed analysis of the timelines, and the judge concluded that everything he alleged was time-barred by the statutes of limitations. He even said that though the alleged acts didn’t rise to RICO conspiracy, even if they did they all occurred outside the 4 year window. He also said the entire lawsuit was a performative grievance filled gish-gallop of lies and bullshit, and hinted and sanctions against the lawyers that filed it. He didn’t use those words, of course, but that’s what he said. [https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/22277845-ruling-in-trump-v-clinton](https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/22277845-ruling-in-trump-v-clinton) I really don’t understand why the Durham investigation is still open, he just doesn’t have anything that occurred within the various statutes of limitations. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2022, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/416 "2022-09-15T15:50:23Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > He also said the entire lawsuit was a performative grievance filled gish-gallop of lies and bullshit, and hinted and sanctions against the lawyers that filed it. He didn’t use those words, of course, but that’s what he said. The second to last line… “I reserve jurisdiction to adjudicate issues pertaining to sanctions.” 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2022, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/417 "2022-09-15T19:03:11Z")
> **[The Durham probe isn't turning out how Donald Trump said it would | CNN Politics](https://edition.cnn.com/2022/09/15/politics/john-durham-russia-probe-donald-trump/index.html)** > > After then-Attorney General Bill Barr appointed attorney John Durham in December 2020 to look into the origins of the FBI investigation of Russia's meddling in the 2016 election, Donald Trump insisted that the probe would uncover widespread... ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2022, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/418 "2022-09-16T11:14:56Z")
Are you actually Dr. Allison Gill? 😀 (if you are or not you’re awesome) ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2022, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/419 "2022-10-01T23:34:40Z")
> **[In ‘close call,’ judge declines to toss case against Steele dossier source](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/09/29/close-call-judge-declines-toss-case-against-steele-dossier-source/)** > > U.S. District Judge Anthony J. Trenga allowed special counsel John Durham to put Igor Danchenko on trial in October, but said it was “an extremely close call.” This does not bode well for Johnny D. As with Sussmann, Durham is going to have trouble showing that the alleged false statements made by Danchenko are even untrue. > “The law criminalizes only unambiguously false statements that are material to a specific decision of the government,” Danchenko’s attorneys Stuart A. Sears and Danny Onorato wrote, adding that the FBI’s questions at issue “were fundamentally ambiguous, Mr. Danchenko’s answers were literally true, non-responsive, or ambiguous, and the statements were not material to a specific government decision.” ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2022, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/420 "2022-10-05T12:16:02Z")
This seems to be different/more than the above, and/but also not a win for JD: > **[Judge rules naughty bits off limits at Trump dossier trial](https://news.yahoo.com/judge-rules-naughty-bits-off-221147768.html)** > > A federal judge ruled Tuesday that prosecutors cannot present evidence to a jury about the most salacious parts of a flawed dossier alleging connections between former President Donald Trump and Russia at an upcoming trial of an analyst who served as... > [@](#): > > The five specific counts in the indictment don’t charge Danchenko with lying about his sourcing for the sex allegations. Still, prosecutors wanted to present testimony at trial that they said would have shown that Danchenko lied about his sourcing for those allegations just as he lied about other aspects of his sourcing, > > Danchenko’s lawyers objected. They say the testimony would be highly prejudicial and would confuse the jury. > > In a ruling issued Tuesday, U.S. District Judge Anthony Trenga agreed with the defense. Specifically, he said the testimony that the government planned to introduce wouldn’t actually prove Danchenko lied. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215/421 "2022-10-13T14:57:11Z")
Gosh, guys, is it a good sign if, as a prosecutor… and just go with me here… if you call your first witness and he does such a good job bolstering the defense teams argument that you have to close questioning by discrediting your own expert witness? Is this good lawing? > [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-durham-indictments-prosecuting-fake-trump-collusion/951215.md?page=22)