The dyslexia myth

Great Debates
61

I was diagnosed with dyslexia as a child. Unfortunately I think I have something else. I was going to get re-tested in my early 20’s, but didn’t seem to think it was worth knowing what my learning disability was at that point, (since I was out of school, and it was just easier telling people I was dyslexic since everyone knows what that is). I regret not getting re-tested, and contemplating wether or not I should do so now.

The problem with saying I’m dyslexic, is that people often tell me they are as well, (or that they think they are). This is not helpful because people who are, (or say they are), dyslexic seem to be more capable than I am of doing certain things. I didn’t watch the video the OP linked to YET, but I wouldn’t be surprised if there are quite a few people who have been, (or are being – I don’t know if things have changed since I was a kid), misdiagnosed. Either people who don’t have a learning disability at all, or people who have something altogether different.

All I know is, some ‘everyday things’ are a huge struggle for me. I know I’m on the lower side of having a “normal” IQ. Which is difficult for me to admit. It’s funny because I’m capable of contemplating grand-scale things on my own, (Like is it likely that there’s a God?, Do we live in a deterministic universe?); Sociological, and philosophical questions that I, as a youngster, pondered before being presented without any information on the subjects presented to me.

But I can’t ‘see the trees from the forest, so to speak’. Little things are difficult for me to remember. Names of new people or things are difficult for me to nail down. I still don’t drive on city roads or the highway because I’m flustered. I can’t make a dinner for myself because I have a hard time with measurements, and multi-tasking. Writing this post took me an hour, and I’m sure it’s littered with mistakes still…

I don’t know what’s wrong with me. But I know everyone seems to think they’re dyslexic… "I had problems with my “d’s” and “b’s” as a child, they would say. I WISH that was my only problem as a child.

62

I have to say on the basis of the previous post you are not on the lower side of having a “normal” IQ. Even if writing the post took you an hour, it’s not littered with mistakes, and was a pleasant read.

63

This sounds like me. Also, I have no sense of alphabetization. Does V come before or after S? Pick any two letters, and I’d have to sing the alphabet song for almost very single case. Of course I know A comes before Z, and adjacent letters (say M and N) are easy. I can start the alphabet at either letter, but If I start on the later letter, I don’t know this until I get to Z. Makes it very slow to find names in a phone book, and nearly impossible to use a paper dictionary to check spelling.

Computer spell checkers are a godsend…but often I can’t get close enough for the checker to figure out the word I wanted. I typically then end up rephrasing or using a synonym to work around it. In school I probably spent 2/3 of my homework time learning the weekly 20 word spelling list, and it never, ever got easier…and unlike pretty much everything else, three weeks later I wouldn’t be able to spell most of those same words.

I also have an awful time with those word search puzzles. (Find words embedded in a block of letters) My teachers used to use these as a reward because my classmates found them fun. They were sheer hell for me. I think I always see letters in the context of all the letters around them, and if you hang extra letters off the ends, the words just blend into the background like a ptarmigan. The vertical and backwards ones might as well not be there at all.

And yet I read more, faster, and with better comprehension than nearly anyone I know. I also tend to screw up by using UK spellings. Gray vs. Grey, Aluminium vs Aluminum, etc. I mostly don’t even notice these when I am reading…In fact looking back at Aluminum and Aluminium, I have to study them letter by letter to tell which is which…I look at Aluminium, and see the four syllable US version, and offhand I can’t remember if I, as an american, am supposed to use grey or gray. I’m absolutely certain I don’t see individual letters as I read. That thing where they only keep the first and last letter of each word…I read that at probably 75% of normal speed. I also think that my eyes run 2-3 words ahead of my mind when I am reading. If I get interrupted, I can look up and continue to “hear” the next 2-3 words. This causes problems if I have to read out loud. I have to make a concerted effort to keep looking at the word I am speaking or I get totally messed up.

Oh, and he may have been spelling the same word differently so that maybe at least once it would be correct. I used to do this.

64

Depends - my daughter gets speech therapy - and they were delighted when she met the requirements for an IEP. Because its pulling her out for speech a few times a week into a speech therapy session already being run. And because it reclassed my overperforming daughter as “special needs” for the purposes of NCLB.

Often the intervention and resources are in place already. Our school has a full time reading specialist to deal with kids with dyslexia - it isn’t a big deal to add one more kid (they don’t get individual attention).

65

Back when I used to proctor the SAT/ACT for students with disabiilties, the testing companies required substantial documentation and history of learning impairments for these students, which were usually provided by the public school attended.

Recently, I have noticed parents attempting to get 504 accomodations (students usually who don’t get sped classes, but are entitled to adjustments in their educational program) based on diagnoses they bring in from private evaluators. By getting the school to sign off on an innocuous little 504 plan, they can show history of educational impairment. Some school districts have been too easy in allowing this to happen, although I think the more recent trend is to be more conservative in writing these plans.

We’ve had the exprerience of parents asking for 504 and special accomodations for their children who show little to no sign of struggle in the classroom. These requests are denied unless there is evidence of real world impairment in the learning or performance of the student, and not just a diagnosis brought in from a private evaluator. That’s how it should be, but alas, this is not always the case.

BTW, I’ve seen many more “slow learners” (lower IQ) mistakenly identified with ADHD than with specific reading disability.

66

I am sorry if the word “specific” throws you somehow.

Often specific learning disabilities are called simply “learning disabilities”; the only reason to spell out the whole name is to distinguish it from a global learning disability.

Once again, I can understand the frustration that some may have that some parents are able to advocate for their children more effectively than others and that some cross the line and game the system. (Although I also see ADD inattentive predominant type as the more common and frankly easier route to do that.) That has nothing to do with making a silly claim that dyslexia does not exist or that there is no utility to calling dyslexics dyslexic.

Golfing is nice but you can succeed in this society without knowing how to golf. Do you think that reading is as trivial as golfing? Were unable to learn history and science to the level of your peers because you couldn’t golf well? Did you grow up believing that you must be on the lower side of having a “normal” IQ despite being normal intelligence or better because of your golfing disability?

67

Plus, dyslexia gives rise to one of the best jokes ever:

A dyslexic insomniac lies awake all night wondering if there really is a dog. Eventually he decides there is not, and in his despair ends up selling his soul to Santa.

68

DSeid, I’m curious if you would accept that, in principle, the notion of specific learning disability could be applied to mathematical ability, the sufferers of which could then plead a special disability the way that dyslexic readers can? I’m not pulling your chain here; I’m just wondering.

So, for example, for those folks wired well for verbal skills or factoid retention (or whatever) who start to falter at anything beyond Introductory Calculus, could we in principle administer tests that identify them as dysquantic and assign them special considerations including early identification and intervention, and more time on exams?

Have I spent a lifetime thinking I’m just a slow learner on the math front for anything past calculus when I’ve really just been afflicted with a disability?

69

Yes, there is an entity of dyscalculia, and there is remediation for it. No, it is not defined as a difficulty mastering calculus; more the inability to master the more simple operations of multiplication, division, or even addition and subtraction, significantly outside what would otherwise be expected for overall intelligence level and age. It tends not be labeled so much as people with it can learn other subjects besides math without much difficulty (the exception being some of the sciences). A significant specific deficiency in math ability is not as systematically handicapping as is a significant deficiency in reading … more than a specific golf deficit mind you though. A student could get through all of the non-math curriculum of elementary school and succeed within grade level through all of High School with unremediated dyscalculia to a degree they could not with unremediated dyslexia.

BTW, the smartest dyslexics are often the most delayed in being diagnosed. Someone who is overall on the slower side will show the fact they cannot read by second grade and get reading services. The brightest kids will be able to compensate for years - they memorize enough word shapes and guess from pictures and context enough to fool the teachers in the first few years and after that they learn enough just listening in class to get by never reading the textbook, they watch movie versions of the books they were supposed to read and fake it, they pretend like they don’t care to study … so on.

One true story back from residency days: one little correlate of dyslexia is a difficulty in telling right from left. A neonatal nurse was having a hard time with that and I asked her about her spelling - awful. Asked her to spell a word I did not think she’d know but easy to sound out - “plethora” - no clue as to how to sound it, how even to start. “Oh I’m just stupid, my whole family is. We were always the dumb kids.” She had gotten through advanced nursing with hardly any reading ability, memorizing whole word shapes and devising her own go around tactics thinking she was dumb when in fact succeeding to that level with no remediation and no help took* amazing* smarts.

70

Students in U.S. public schools are identified every day with disabilities in the area of math. One may be identified as having unexpected delays in the area of either math operations or applied reasoning skills. It’s a matter of federal law, i.e., IDEA.

As Dseid mentions, it occurs/is identified much less frequently than disabilites in reading or writing.

71

I remember having to memorize this (not write it out though) and I remember it was fun. It feels good to own something completely and have it at your fingertips. I still remember lots of songs and poems, the beginning of the Declaration of Independence, and all kinds of other stuff I memorized in school or on my own. There are things I haven’t memorized that I always hope won’t come up, because I’ll feel foolish: for example, the capitols of countries and their current rulers, and all the important politicians in Washington. I bet a lot of dyslexic kids get really good at the useful skill of memorization in the process of working around their difficulties.

72

Are those really symptoms of dyslexia? I used to have most of the problems you listed. And I still do things like county and country like in your example.

I never had a “problem” reading. I just hated all the books we had to read in school, so that effected how I read them. I started reading books myself in high school, and have never had a problem.

73

The Internet is your cite.

Seriously,though, I am starting to see many posters on various sites put “I have dyslexia so do not correct my post for spelling” in their signatures. I can’t believe there’s been an explosion of dyslexia that’s somehow dwarfed the explosion of lazy spellers, so I assume many of these people are claiming the disability in the hope that they won’t be judged for their poor spelling.

I’d guess actually dyslexic people would be annoyed by that practice.

74

Well, but there isn’t really a sharply-defined difference. Dyslexia, dyscalculia and any other “specific” learning disabilities are “specific” only in the sense that arbitrarily-defined standards are set for them.

We all have genetically-defined maximum potentials for learning and understanding. Were we all more highly capable linguistically, what is now “normal” would be dyslexic (or some similar term). A “specific” learning disability simply means an individual is at least about average at most things and well below average in one area. But because “disability” is more palatable than “dumb” or “lazy” it’s become a highly popular reason.

The fancy way to say that someone is dumb and/or lazy is to assign him a “specific learning disability” (he’s dumb for that ability) and to say he needs specific intervention to correct it (he’s too lazy to work on it without external support).

I’m exaggerating, of course, but you get the point: The more palatable a term is the more broadly it will be applied, and when you add the secondary gain on the part of therapists who now have a broader population needing therapy, and sufferers who now not only get therapists but get additional advantages (such as more time on standardized testing) it’s win/win/win.

It won’t be long until we have a category for someone suffering from 5 concomitant specific learning disabilities instead of someone who is just generally mentally retarded. They will require early diagnosis and early intervention, of course–and both of those things will, in fact, improve their overall outcome.

75

There is sooooooo much more to dyslexia than reading and dylexia, I know first hand. I had rigorous testing as a child, hearing tests-perfect hearing, sight- perfect sight, intelligence-above average. So why couldn’t I tie my shoe laces, catch a ball, tell the time or spell my name at 11? I slso had to have speech thearpy at 3-4 years old because I wasn’t talking. So, does every child who struggles to read have this? I still can’t prononce a lot of words no matter how many times I hear it so I do agree with the bit about picking out sounds.
My phycoloogist that I eventually spoke to said I was textbook dyslexic, weak short term memory memory yet good at discribing things and forgot verbal instructions yet understands puzzles. I also have issues with numbers also, I still can’t recite the alfabet or the months of theyear. But hey I wrote this without spell check so I’m not too bad haha!
Words moving around isn’t dyslexia, its another condition that can come with or without dyslexia. I sometimes see words already jumbled up, my theory is that my brain is like autocorrect and guesses because I usually see a different word spelt right. Then after 5 minurtes of confusion I finally see the actual word lol.

76

Reading and spelling not dyslexia lol

77

Or maybe I meant to type “slow readers.” Is it really that difficult of a skill to try and make something make sense before assuming that the person was making things up?

I mean, if you don’t allow for mistakes, what I said was pretty much the exact opposite of what the thread said. Which is more likely–I missed the entire point of the thread, or I made a mistake in what I said?

78

FYI: You are responding to a post made over 2 1/2 years ago.

79

Dyslexia literally means “problems with words” but it’s really about problems with written words. It’s a symptom, not a cause. The causes are unknown and might vary considerably.

The definition isn’t “above average intelligence, below average reading ability.” It’s “reading ability that’s incommensurate with intelligence.” So, obviously, a below-average intelligence person could have it, but it might be harder to notice.

My single data point is my son. He was in grade school during the era of DSM III, where it’s not listed (it was in II and was restored in III). Instead, any kid who had any kind of difficulty learning that was incommensurate with their overall intelligence was labeled ADD. A friend who’s a doctor (a brilliant diagnostician, top 1%) gave him the then-current ADD test informally. He was at most borderline; I was a more likely candidate.

Alex is bright but had a terrible time learning to read, write, and spell. We tried all sorts of programs to help, so he got tested a number of different ways and at different times. Everything we tried helped some – I think that’s a given. None was anything near a silver bullet. (We did not try medication.)

In the 5th grade, he scored collegiate level vocabulary, but with a 1st grade ability to decode (reading without any semantics). For grade-level reading his speed was very slow, but his comprehension was very high. Since reading was very fatiguing to him, I read to him at bedtime, up to about age 12. We read lots of classic stories like Twain and Stephenson. I read The Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings trilogy. I remember a couple times I was confused about the plot, for example, how certain characters had arrived where I thought they couldn’t be, and he explained in vivid detail how they had arrived there.

When he typed papers using my Mac, he had no problems using the software. He set the line spacing to triple-space because it made it a lot easier for him. I suspect the lines above and below caused distraction somehow.

Most kids, when asked to spell a word aloud, say the letters in syllabic groups. Alex would sit and thing for what seemed a very long time, and then the letters would come out very evenly paced. He was almost completely unable to “sound out” a word, which seemed really odd to me.

He never did understand parts of speech. That really confounded me, since it seems so simple: verbs “be” or “do”, nouns “are something”, and adverbs and adjectives modify something else. Easy as pie, right? Any attempt to explain this went in circles.

To this day, whenever someone he knows well sees his writing, they’re amazed that it’s him, since he communicates so clearly and intelligently, but writes like a slow junior-high kid. Fortunately, he uses things like facebook, and believe it or not that helps. (He’s now 32, has an associate’s degree as a chef.) His favorite book is Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. He’s only read a couple others; it’s just too fatiguing.

I’m confident that his brain just doesn’t work the same way mine does, and it’s not lack of overall intelligence. Label it what you want. Dyslexia works as well as any label.

He did need the benefit of special treatment in school, to have more time to show on tests how much he knew of the subject. But he also often wound up spending part of his time in “special” classes, and would often be taken advantage of by the teacher, since he had no emotional or behavioral problems, and could help the other kids with their stuff. I’m sure that helped him too, but it was clear in specific cases that the teacher was going overboard. One of his special-ed teachers was phenomenally good; too bad he couldn’t have had that teacher for more years.

80

Lol