# The Economics of Trolling, the SDMB, and Moderator Decisions. **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [November 15, 2019, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474 "2019-11-15T03:57:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/101 "2019-11-15T21:42:08Z")
The good news **JohnT** is that if this place shuts down due to lack of revenue, you will be one of the people who caused it šŸ™‚ ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/102 "2019-11-15T21:43:22Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#): > > **Moderator Note** > > No, you are not. Everyone is expected to treat other users with respect while in this forum. Letā€™s all knock off the insults and dial back the anger, please. Yes, and I think that the vast majority of posters get that. It just seems like the OP is getting a pass on that, somehow. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/103 "2019-11-15T21:44:59Z")
The business model of the SDMB is not collecting membership fees. Itā€™s selling ads. If you cancel your Charter Membership and go to being a Guest, you will then be just as likely as anyone else to view the ads. So the major part of their revenue stream is unaffected. If you want to argue that more people will sign up as Members if someone is banned, I donā€™t think you have those figures available. Nor is there any reason you should. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/104 "2019-11-15T21:45:25Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Iā€™d like to suggest that your attempt to reduce board membersā€™ contributions to a NPV dollar amount, if successful, is going to do a lot more to drive away members than anything / everything Iā€™ve ever done on the SDMB. No, Iā€™m pointing out to the moderators the **financial impact** of you and your actions. Itā€™s that simple. You cause the SDMB to lose measurable revenue and value, and Iā€™m not sure if Iā€™ve ever seen anyone make this case before. And it needs to be made. Desperately. Before Iā€™m typing this shit on the Giraffe boards in response to ā€œWhat _really_ happened to the SDMB?ā€ ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/105 "2019-11-15T21:46:37Z")
Ok, thatā€™s pretty brilliant šŸ˜ƒ ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/106 "2019-11-15T21:48:05Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Thereā€™s a woman in charge of Publishing at the Chicago Reader named [Tracy Baim](https://www.chicagoreader.com/chicago/readerstaff/Page). Tracy, being the Publisher (i.e., head operations person), has full P&L responsibility for the Chicago Reader, including the issue of monetizing the Straight Dope Message Board, a property which came to the STM Reader, LLC group in a buyout. This isnā€™t merely just an issue of trying to sell ads, Tracyā€¦ or the business executives who work with herā€¦ also needs to prove the worth of the SDMB to the Board (also listed in the above link) and convince the Board that the SDMB is a financially viable property, so they may decide to continue funding operations. This seems to contradict what TD said in her post. > [@TubaDiva](#): > > The management of Sun-Times Media ā€¦ sold the Reader and spun it off to new owners. > > Note that when they sold the Reader, they kept us. This reads to me that Tracy has no connection to the Dope or to Sun-Times Media today. This is more or less irrelevant to your business case, although Sun-Times Media is a zillion percent larger than the Chicago Reader and made a recent decision to keep the place going knowing that it has been slowly dying for years in amounts that make the cost of one troll entirely superfluous. Still, we donā€™t need to add more confusion to a muddled argument. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/107 "2019-11-15T21:49:19Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > This seems to contradict what TD said in her post. > > This reads to me that Tracy has no connection to the Dope or to Sun-Times Media today. > > This is more or less irrelevant to your business case, although Sun-Times Media is a zillion percent larger than the Chicago Reader and made a recent decision to keep the place going knowing that it has been slowly dying for years in amounts that make the cost of one troll entirely superfluous. Still, we donā€™t need to add more confusion to a muddled argument. At the bottom of the Board it says: ā€œCopyright Ā© 2019 STM Reader, LLCā€ Which is what I meant by ā€œReaderā€. Sorry for the confusion, it was an unforced error which I tried to remember to correctā€¦ but forgot. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/108 "2019-11-15T21:50:03Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Yes, and I think that the vast majority of posters get that. It just seems like the OP is getting a pass on that, somehow. Whether or not HDā€™s behavior makes him an ā€œassholeā€ or a ā€œtrollā€, itā€™s definitely driven people off. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/109 "2019-11-15T21:52:58Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > This seems to contradict what TD said in her post. > > This reads to me that Tracy has no connection to the Dope or to Sun-Times Media today. > > This is more or less irrelevant to your business case, although Sun-Times Media is a zillion percent larger than the Chicago Reader and made a recent decision to keep the place going knowing that it has been slowly dying for years in amounts that make the cost of one troll entirely superfluous. Still, we donā€™t need to add more confusion to a muddled argument. Correct. It may be irrelevant to the overall operations of the company and the SDMB mayā€¦ mayā€¦ _may_ā€¦ fly under the radar for years. But when itā€™s noticedā€¦ as it will beā€¦ the questions are going to be asked, the data looked at, and the decision made. And it will be made using business and financial considerations, not ā€œthereā€™s a lot of people there whoā€™ve been there for years!ā€ ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/110 "2019-11-15T21:53:11Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Whether or not HDā€™s behavior makes him an ā€œassholeā€ or a ā€œtrollā€, itā€™s definitely driven people off. Hereā€™s another question for the mods who havenā€™t bothered to answer my earlier one. Can we say that all trolls are assholes, a true statement? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/111 "2019-11-15T21:57:14Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > The business model of the SDMB is not collecting membership fees. Itā€™s selling ads. If you cancel your Charter Membership and go to being a Guest, you will then be just as likely as anyone else to view the ads. So the major part of their revenue stream is unaffected. > > If you want to argue that more people will sign up as Members if someone is banned, I donā€™t think you have those figures available. Nor is there any reason you should. > > Regards, > Shodan Iā€™m not making that case, but your first paragraph is incorrect as the business model has multiple streams of revenue, including the subscriptions, the ads, and the direct paid advertising (ā€œClick this link to advertise on the SDMBā€). Thatā€™s at least three and there are possibly more that Iā€™m not thinking of, or am unaware of. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/112 "2019-11-15T21:57:43Z")
For what it is worth, I let my membership lapse when it ended this year and trolls being allowed so much leeway was a major consideration in not renewing. Iā€™m amazed by how horrible GD has become over the years. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/113 "2019-11-15T22:04:29Z")
Nice, a well written statement. However, message boards in general are declining. Do you have any evidence that the SDMB is declining any faster than others? Conversely, I would accept evidence that only\* some\* message boards are declining and HD posts to those. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/114 "2019-11-15T22:04:56Z")
I wonder what would happen to the board if everyone who is not a Trump supporter stops visiting the SDMB for the next six weeks. NB: just wondering, not advocating. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/115 "2019-11-15T22:07:45Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > I wonder what would happen to the board if everyone who is not a Trump supporter stops visiting the SDMB for the next six weeks. > > NB: just wondering, not advocating. The very definition of cutting off the nose to spite the face. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/116 "2019-11-15T22:12:38Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > I wonder what would happen to the board if everyone who is not a Trump supporter stops visiting the SDMB for the next six weeks. > > NB: just wondering, not advocating. Donā€™t do that. Please. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/117 "2019-11-15T22:12:54Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > So, thatā€™s what Iā€™m asking here. I would like someone to make the **business case** ā€¦ not the ā€œcultureā€ case or the ā€œrules-basedā€ caseā€¦ the **business case** , the **financial case** ā€¦ that Ditka is worth the revenues he is losing for the SDMB. Well, I wonā€™t do that. Itā€™s not that I donā€™t believe your numbers, though I donā€™t really accept them particularly - theyā€™re based on assumptions and extrapolations Iā€™m not willing to take at face value. Itā€™s that I think bottom-dollaring poster value like that is kinda immoral. Iā€™m fine with the cultural and rules-based arguments you donā€™t want to talk about. But I rather despise monetizing everything. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/118 "2019-11-15T22:13:52Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > I wonder what would happen to the board if everyone who is not a Trump supporter stops visiting the SDMB for the next six weeks. > > NB: just wondering, not advocating. Well, there would be 20+ threads in Elections and Great Debates that wouldnā€™t be the usualā€¦ ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/119 "2019-11-15T22:16:12Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > Nice, a well written statement. However, message boards in general are declining. Do you have any evidence that the SDMB is declining any faster than others? Conversely, I would accept evidence that only\* some\* message boards are declining and HD posts to those. I presented evidence that he has cost the SDMB _my_ $64 in NPV. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474/120 "2019-11-15T22:16:28Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Well, there would be 20+ threads in Elections and Great Debates that wouldnā€™t be the usualā€¦ Iā€™d start some polls in IMHO, with end dates prior to everyone elseā€™s return, just to get them in the history of the SDMB. ā€œWow, 100% of the SDMB posters that responded to this poll think \_\_\_\_ā€ (use your imagination). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-economics-of-trolling-the-sdmb-and-moderator-decisions/843474.md?page=7)