# The employment situation **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 31, 2010, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922 "2010-12-31T06:01:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![phouka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c5a1d2/32.png) [@phouka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phouka)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/21 "2011-01-05T02:36:22Z")
No effing kidding. I moved out to California to live with/help out my parents right when the economy went in the toilet. I looked for months before finding a customer service job for an online gaming company paying $10/hr. I hated it. So, I lined up a job as a substitute teacher - which you must have a teaching credential to work as - and left the CS job. Turned out, the school district which hired me had more subs than they had teachers. I went through two school years sending out resumes, answering ads, and I got two interviews and no offers. I took the test to earn a general science credential, as science teachers are usually in high demand. Half the people at that test were taking it for the same reason as me - to expand their marketability. One of them was a math teacher who was laid off after eight years with his district. I think you have to be in education to get the full horror of that one. A math teacher. Only special ed and bilingual teachers are in higher demand. And he’d been at his district for eight years, which meant he had tenure and some seniority. Which meant they must have laid off every other English, History, Science, Fine Arts, PE, and Foreign Language teacher with ten years before they looked at him. Right now, I’m working as a sub at another district where there’s actually enough work to go around. But, there’s absolutely no chance of being hired on full time. The district is loading up all the classes to the max of 39 kids per class to cut down on the number of teachers needed. Principals are heroes if they manage to keep their entire staff through the budget cuts. And on top of that, my particular district is shrinking in size. Fewer students, less money, no new teachers. They used to say you could always get a job as a teacher. That hasn’t been true for at least five years. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/22 "2011-01-05T03:08:31Z")
> [@phouka](#): > > No effing kidding. > > I moved out to California to live with/help out my parents right when the economy went in the toilet. I looked for months before finding a customer service job for an online gaming company paying $10/hr. I hated it. So, I lined up a job as a substitute teacher - which you must have a teaching credential to work as - and left the CS job. > > Turned out, the school district which hired me had more subs than they had teachers. > > I went through two school years sending out resumes, answering ads, and I got two interviews and no offers. I took the test to earn a general science credential, as science teachers are usually in high demand. Half the people at that test were taking it for the same reason as me - to expand their marketability. One of them was a math teacher who was laid off after eight years with his district. > > I think you have to be in education to get the full horror of that one. A math teacher. Only special ed and bilingual teachers are in higher demand. And he’d been at his district for eight years, which meant he had tenure and some seniority. Which meant they must have laid off every other English, History, Science, Fine Arts, PE, and Foreign Language teacher with ten years before they looked at him. > > Right now, I’m working as a sub at another district where there’s actually enough work to go around. But, there’s absolutely no chance of being hired on full time. The district is loading up all the classes to the max of 39 kids per class to cut down on the number of teachers needed. Principals are heroes if they manage to keep their entire staff through the budget cuts. And on top of that, my particular district is shrinking in size. Fewer students, less money, no new teachers. > > They used to say you could always get a job as a teacher. That hasn’t been true for at least five years. As a former social studies teacher that’s really scary. Math is supposed to be the holy grail of teaching jobs. Go into it and you’re supposed to be set for life. Thirty-nine kids in a classroom is almost even scarier. I had one term with 31 seventh graders and I thought I’d lose my mind. ---
**Author:** ![Briny\_Deep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/briny_deep/32/17188_2.png) [@Briny\_Deep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Briny_Deep)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/23 "2011-01-05T06:01:50Z")
> [@FasterThanMeerkats](#): > > A few notes on why this question is asked: > > - It’s an absolute layup… you know you’re going to be asked it. The interviewer is just checking to make sure you know how to prepare for the obvious. > > - It’s an honesty test. The interviewer knows you aren’t going to deep-six yourself, but expects a certain level of honesty. Failure to be somewhat candid is a bad sign. Hence as you observed, “I work too hard” doesn’t cut it. > > - It gives you the chance to show initiative in improving yourself. (e.g. “I’m very analytical, sometimes too much. I think this position would force me to grow out of that comfort zone and become more of team member and leader rather a straight numbers guy/gal, and I look forward to that opportunity.”) > > So it seems to be a reasonable question to ask given the it’s a simple question that establishes a individual’s ability to prepare, level of honesty, and initiative. Agree with almost all of this (see below)\*. We did interview one person who was knocked speechless by the question - literally dead silence for at least a minute - and that finished her, because how could you be totally unprepared for it? Another was disliked and disbelieved because she would not admit to any weaknesses at all. I have to say as appalled as I was by the process, I learned a tremendous amount about how to interview, and how not to. I’m still not at all convinced the best interviewer is the best person for the job, though. It’s a strange ritual. \*An interviewer told me years ago I didn’t get the job because I mentioned what I wanted out of it. They only wanted to hear what I had to offer, and weren’t at all interested in what I thought were my opportunities for growth, etc. ---
**Author:** ![wheresmymind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/91b2a8/32.png) [@wheresmymind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wheresmymind)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/24 "2011-01-05T16:48:37Z")
> [@Nobody](#): > > What is a good answer? You’re asking them to give you a reason not to hire them. Of course you’ll get a lot of, “my weakness is that I work too hard.” or such other B.S. I think the question should be eliminated from interviews. I’ve always wanted to throw them off, and answer completely stonefaced with something like “I’ve always had a weakness for anything in a Cuban heel. Especially redheads,” or “Well, I was very shy as a child but my Mom always insisted I put on a good front and be sociable, so now I over-compensate and although I seem very social and outgoing, I’m actually reticent to open up on a personal level and have few close friends.” ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/25 "2011-01-05T17:26:18Z")
> [@phouka](#): > > They used to say you could always get a job as a teacher. That hasn’t been true for at least five years. Ditto nursing. I’m graduating in five months, and if I hear one more person say, “Oh, hell, nursing is a sure bet! They’ll always need nurses…isn’t there a nursing shortage?” … _sigh_ Yes, there’s a nursing shortage. There’s also a hiring freeze nearly everywhere. Just because they’re understaffed and \*need \*more nurses everywhere doesn’t mean they have the money to hire them. Rather terrifying, just about to enter the job market when my RN friends with 10 and 20 years of experience are getting nothing but silence. Maybe they’re just overqualified? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/26 "2011-01-05T17:39:54Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Ditto nursing. I’m graduating in five months, and if I hear one more person say, “Oh, hell, nursing is a sure bet! They’ll always need nurses…isn’t there a nursing shortage?” … > > _sigh_ Yes, there’s a nursing shortage. There’s also a hiring freeze nearly everywhere. Just because they’re understaffed and \*need \*more nurses everywhere doesn’t mean they have the money to hire them. Rather terrifying, just about to enter the job market when my RN friends with 10 and 20 years of experience are getting nothing but silence. Maybe they’re just overqualified? 😃 Given the age demographics right now, I think you’ve made a superb career choice. Hang in there and you’ll be in very high demand in a short number of years. Jeez, this is on the Ottawa Hospital website at the moment: “The Ottawa Hospital is currently recruiting Experienced Nurses and Nursing Graduates to fill 500 Permanent Full-Time and Part-Time positions.” ---
**Author:** ![kushiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbce88/32.png) [@kushiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kushiel)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/27 "2011-01-05T19:25:45Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Well, I was a _bit_ higher than file clerk… administrative assistant. Laid off November 2007. I’ve gotten jobs with > > 1. A general contractor, cleaning job sites, painting stuff, and occasionally wielding a hammer I’ve been reading your posts for a long time, and damn, if immigration laws were the same as back in the day where you could sponsor someone to come over, I’d sponsor you. You’d be able to find an admin job easily and if you wanted the good money, you could do construction, where there are absurd waiting times for people to build homes. People here are waiting 6 months-1 year to get their house built because there’s such a backlog. I never thought I’d be in the one damn place that actually _grew_ in the last couple of years. Our newspapers are talking about skilled labour shortages, not high unemployment. ---
**Author:** ![FasterThanMeerkats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/278dde/32.png) [@FasterThanMeerkats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FasterThanMeerkats)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/28 "2011-01-05T21:09:16Z")
> [@Briny\_Deep](#): > > \*An interviewer told me years ago I didn’t get the job because I mentioned what I wanted out of it. They only wanted to hear what I had to offer, and weren’t at all interested in what I thought were my opportunities for growth, etc. Dude that sucks. Hope you’re better off not working with such douchebaggy people.☹ I guess the hope/dreams piece might depend on the type of job, but still… ---
**Author:** ![Briny\_Deep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/briny_deep/32/17188_2.png) [@Briny\_Deep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Briny_Deep)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2011, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922/29 "2011-01-08T19:20:04Z")
> [@FasterThanMeerkats](#): > > Dude that sucks. Hope you’re better off not working with such douchebaggy people.☹ I guess the hope/dreams piece might depend on the type of job, but still… I think it just shows that you can’t know what the people interviewing you are thinking. A lot of the evaluation (far too much IMO) boils down to “do I like the person?” And that’s pretty subjective, making interview results a crapshoot. I once got a job because I bullshitted my way through a conversation about college football, which I care nothing for. The boss happened to be a big fan of my college team, but perhaps more importantly, we hit it off personally. He _wanted_ to hire me from the start, and I doubt if he more than glanced at my c.v. after he read what school I went to, and that didn’t impress him for its academics but its athletics, which I had nothing to do with and no interest in. It’s not fair. But we knew that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-employment-situation/565922.md?page=1)