# The EU bans credit card surcharges **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 14, 2018, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-eu-bans-credit-card-surcharges/806621 "2018-01-14T19:34:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-eu-bans-credit-card-surcharges/806621/41 "2018-01-15T18:46:55Z")
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > I think we should let individual buyers and sellers decide what kind of payment to accept, and what prices to set for each type of payment. > > As long as the terms are clear and no one is being tricked, why should we have to legislate this? > > Forcing businesses to accept credit cards without any additional costs is a major support to Visa and Mastercard, giving them legal enforcement for their rentier status. I don’t think that’s a good thing. I agree with this completely. I would think legislators should step in more if the opposite is happening. If credit card companies try to prohibit vendors from choosing a differential pricing model for credit card transactions, that’s what should be illegal. When direct costs are hidden from the consumer, market forces cannot operate. Now, there may be an argument that the true costs of using cash are also being hidden from consumers, since we presumably support some aspects of the cash economy through higher taxes (direct cost of minting currency; tax evasion in the cash economy). If so, perhaps that should be addressed, but I don’t think the right way to address market inefficiency due to one type of hidden costs is hide _another_ set of costs. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-eu-bans-credit-card-surcharges/806621/42 "2018-01-15T19:14:33Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > So you never pay by card, unless you’re staying a hotel, booking airline reservations, or buying something on the internet. > > That’s hardly “never in my entire life”. I’m not sure how relevant this digression is, but FTR: (1) I wrote “almost never” rather than “never.” (2) My Internet purchases have been, perhaps, amazingly few. For example, I’ve never bought from EBay nor Amazon. The only on-line bookstore purchase was _once_, from the Kinokuniya Book store in Bangkok. (A relative sometimes assisted me, reimbursed, with U.S. purchases.) (3) A _very_ large majority of my hotel stays in Thailand have been paid with cash. (4) I had a phobia about typing my card details online. My only U.S.-issued credit/debit card required a phone-call every 4 years or so to activate. The operator was surprised to note, when I finally called to activate it (to book a BKK hotel online), that _I’d waited about 2 years to activate it_. Does this help? ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-eu-bans-credit-card-surcharges/806621/43 "2018-01-15T20:15:55Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Sure, of course _for you_ the costs are higher. But if all your business was in cash instead? How much is a armored truck daily pick up? How much does you bank charge for cash deposits? How much extra would your hold up insurance be? A extra hour or two a day to count, recount and deposit that cash? How much? > > I saw a analysis once and yes, it did show cash was, net- a little cheaper. But only a little. I don’t think I’ve ever seen an armored truck at a small business. Looking at our business policy, it covers more cash than we’d have on hand at any one time even if all our business was in cash. I assume it’s just part of the package we’re currently in with them since in the past we’d raise and lower that number as need be, so the amount of insurance wouldn’t change. As for counting, I’ve been counting the money here for more years than I care to remember, I’ve been counting it since it _was_ mostly cash. I can count cash pretty quickly. Simply converting the credit cards to cash for me (and the cashiers, I suppose) to count isn’t going to add any significant amount of time. And, as I stated, the bank fee works out to something like a a third of a percent. That’s a long way to go to get to 3%. If we make it easy and say $100k was deposited in checks and $100k in credit cards. That’s $3000 in credit card fees and $300 in bank fees. All the nickel and dime charges you mentioned for going all cash aren’t going to add $2700/mo to my expenses. Yes, they’ll add some. There will be additional bank fees, there will be additional time involved, there will be other things. But I can’t think of a way in which it would cost me nearly a hundred dollars a day. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-eu-bans-credit-card-surcharges/806621/44 "2018-01-16T03:18:17Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > European credit cards don’t come with points programs? One of my banks has a points program but it applies to all their cards and transactions: I get points for getting my invoices paid there, and for paying stuff via direct charge to that account. I normally don’t like their physical offerings so my points go to charity. My mother uses that bank as well and she’s more likely to pick a charity than a physical item, but she got a nice shopping cart once. My other bank (the ones whose cards aren’t contactless yet) doesn’t have a points program. ETA: Spain ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-eu-bans-credit-card-surcharges/806621/45 "2018-01-16T05:41:32Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > And, as I stated, the bank fee works out to something like a a third of a percent. That’s a long way to go to get to 3%. > If we make it easy and say $100k was deposited in checks and $100k in credit cards. That’s $3000 in credit card fees and $300 in bank fees. All the nickel and dime charges you mentioned for going all cash aren’t going to add $2700/mo to my expenses. Yes, they’ll add some. There will be additional bank fees, there will be additional time involved, there will be other things. But I can’t think of a way in which it would cost me nearly a hundred dollars a day. But the average Visa fee is only 2%, not 3%. Bank fees for cash deposits are usually 1%. So that is only $1000 a month difference, or 30 a day, which is one hours work. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-eu-bans-credit-card-surcharges/806621.md?page=2)