Well, it’s the French you’ll have to convince of that. You’ve got your work cut out.
This would have to go through the European Parliamnent like the other case did. I’d imagine that they’d have a much harder time getting a law blocking strikes by ATC’s across the EU than they did for laws about toxic spills.
A large block of the parliament are left wing groups (that’s real left wing for the Yanks reading not your right wing Dems 
).
In Ireland the police and army can’t strike. That’s a national security issue though not a don’t inconvienence Capt. Ridley’s Shooting Party issue.
It’s good to see that you are so cavalier with the rights of other workers. Should anyone who can possibly inconvenience you be legally banned from striking?
You’re right. I am cavalier. I sincerely and profusely apologise to all the French air traffic controllers who have had their feelings hurt by me implying they should knuckle down to work, and perhaps, just perhaps, five strikes in ten months, causing chaos throughout the EU, potential losses of hundreds of millions of pounds in revenue, hell, perhaps even small cute kids not being able to see their dieing Grandparent for the last time due to delays, is a little excessive. Most of all, I hope villa, keen to share his solidarity with the oppressed professionals operating French ATC, and posting from the other side of the Atlantic, completely unaffected by the latest in a string of strikes that has plagued Europe all summer, accepts my sincerest apologies.
Better?
What about all other forms of transport?
People can lose a lot of money and be very inconvenienced by people like train drivers, bus drivers, hauliers etc. going on strike.
What about luggage handlers or food suppliers for planes, security at airports etc. etc. etc.
Where do you draw the line?
Another thing to take note is that during the Heathrow strike not too long ago and during this strike I’ve yet to hear a politician of any stripe call for the removal of strike rights for ATC’s.
Not in the slightest. The right to strike is the single most important weapon a worker has. And because you are mildly inconvenienced, you think it acceptable to remove that weapon from the worker.
It doesn’t matter if this strike, or the one before it, is justifiable according to you. What matters is that it is justifiable to those who choose to go out on strike.
Anything that impacts him. Those workers should suck it up, bend over, and take whatever they have coming to them.
These statements reflect your opinion on a question of sovereignty. As a sovereign people, the French public is empowered to decide for itself whether it agrees with you, and you don’t get veto power over it.
Preservation of sovereignty is a pretty big deal to most of the members of the European Union. In particular, if I may say, the United Kingdom, which is considered the one member that is holding on to its sovereignty the tightest.
So, I’ll bet that not even the U.K. government would be so bold as to forward this proposal, that the E.U. somehow has the power to override territorial sovereignty based on a finding of inconvenience.
Another thing that should be considered is that because of Britain’s historical shyness about surrendering sovereignty to the union, France and Germany together pretty much are the European Union. If France and Germany don’t support something in the E.U., it isn’t going to happen.
Fuck 'em I say. I’m going on holiday on Saturday and if they fuck it up I’m gonna get all Robespierre on their arse.
Then raise the scarlet standard high.
Within its shade we’ll live and die,
Though cowards flinch and traitors sneer,
We’ll keep the red flag flying here.
Didn’t they end up going all Robespierre on Robespierre’s arse.
That’s a minor detail I haven’t yet worked out yet.
In seriousness, it’s not just a domestic issue, it’s affecting the common economy. Not sure what could be done to prevent it, mind you - a fine would, as comrade yojimbo says, play into the strikers’ hands.
There’s also a nearest-neighbour thing going on. The protests in Greece didn’t affect me, but the ones in France do - they damage my country’s economy. I’d imagine if a similar thing happened in the UK, blocking many flights and ports, and reducing the availability of fuel for trans-national freight, we’d have a thing or two to hear about it from people in Ireland.
Now come on!The Irish have always shown nothing but support for our English neighbours?
Train drivers and hauliers going on strike don’t impact other nationalities, for the most part. Specifically, it doesn’t affect travel on a whole continent. The French ATC could have kept the international air corridors open over France, only affecting domestic flights, and those terminating in France. They’ll have made their point; only without pissing off the rest of Europe.
villa, I’m not sure why you’re painting this as a result of me being inconvenienced. I’m not. I’ve no plans to fly until Saturday, when hopefully the damn thing will have blown over.
And, yes, I do think it’s acceptable to remove that weapon from the worker when that “weapon” is being abused. We aren’t talking about nineteenth century coal workers striking because their working conditions are abject. We’re talking about well paid professional air traffic controllers striking because the government is trying to increase the French average retirement age from a whopping 58.8 years. I really can’t work up much sympathy, and comparing it to genuine worker’s rights struggles is more than a little crass.
:rolleyes:
I live in France and am directly impacted by the strikes. I can’t catch a train to and from work so I’ve been riding my bicycle (45 minutes each way through the heart of Paris in terrible traffic).
One thing that I don’t like about transport strikes is that they affect the working stiffs and lower classes who can’t afford to live near work but need to work and need to take public transportation to get there. I’m actually glad that rich people are now being affected by gas shortages and airport strikes. IMO, that’s the way to get the government’s attention.
The thing I like most about the strikes is how amazing it is to see a huge group of people in solidarity to fight for what they perceive to be their rights. For them, it’s not about money or the economic impact but about their livelihood.
French people aren’t scared of their government. The strikes prove it. Like Villa, I believe that striking is the most powerful weapon against perceived injustices and I’m always impressed when people use it, even if it fucks up my day.
I’ll just say this: pointless transport strikes are one of the very few reasons I will never live in Europe again.
My sincere apologies. Based on your potential future inconvenience.
So you can have the right to strike, but only if the government determines your conditions are abject enough to warrant it. Next week, let’s take the right to vote away from those who use it for things we don’t approve.
Now I am no fan of labour law in France (or most of Europe). I like the old British system of voluntarism - if workers strike, they can be fired. But if you fire workers for striking you find yourself picketed out of existence.
No, I gathered you aren’t a fan. After all, it’s pretty easy to preach patience when you are far removed from the situation. How many ATC strikes have there been in the US this year? I’m guessing … precisely zero. Last time I was in Paris (about six weeks ago) I ended up shelling out an extra ~£200 due to yet another strike. Those French ATC folks must have it pretty bad!
Yeah, pretty much. The Government’s responsibility is keeping the country running. As soon as strikes get out of hand it’s time to call the police and/or military in and bring legal sanctions against the subversives trying to destabilise the country, to make sure an otherwise useful tool isn’t being misused.
[quote=“Capt.Ridley_s_Shooting_Party, post:78, topic:557708”]
No, I gathered you aren’t a fan. After all, it’s pretty easy to preach patience when you are far removed from the situation. How many ATC strikes have there been in the US this year? I’m guessing … precisely zero. Last time I was in Paris (about six weeks ago) I ended up shelling out an extra ~£200 due to yet another strike. Those French ATC folks must have it pretty bad!
I have spent the majority of my life in the UK. I am well aware of the effects of strikes, both the inconvenience, and the effect on the strikers and their families. I’ve stood on more picket lines than I can remember, and still to this day have a gut reaction that makes it very hard for me to cross them (whatever the inconvenience to myself).
That I am not in the UK now is completely and utterly irrelevant.
A person on the one hand claims that the unions aren’t as necessary as they were in the nineteenth century, then supports using the army on strikers. Un-fucking-believable.
So, there’s basically no such thing as constitutionally limited powers of government.
I don’t mean to Godwinize this thread, but isn’t this a pretty good summary of a key aspect of fascism?