# The evil that is Ashcroft: Gvt. report says detainees were abused **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 23, 2003, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869 "2003-06-23T21:27:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/21 "2003-06-24T00:19:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mtgman \* > \*\*Gah! A guy can’t even be sarcastic anymore! Do you know how it feels to have to explain every joke? To include disclaimers? > > It’s almost as annoying as that whole “truth in advertising” and “full disclosure” crapola they’re trying to shove down our throats when we’re writing ad campaigns for used car dealerships. If a car has been stolen five times, it’s still just “one owner” damnit! > > Enjoy, > Steven \*\* Indeed. I’ve had to include more smilies in my posts. I recommend :dubious: highly. :rolleyes:, an oldie but a goodie, is getting a bit worn. 😛 is useful in humorous situations. It’s easy to type. :o is good for self-deprecation. 😕 is good almost any time. :smack: is ubiquitious also. Anyway, ;). See, it’s all a joke because I winked. I wasn’t kidding about the smilies. Sarcasm is almost impossible to discern over the internet without a hint of some kind. I could use [sarcasm] as a sig or something. I’ve been trying to quit sigs for a long time. :smack: See? Stupid cigarette joke. Ashcroft? :wally ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/22 "2003-06-24T00:27:54Z")
😉 😃 **Beagle** a simple /sarcasm will do if you shun emoticons, or even a _sarcastic voice_ or _tongue in cheek_ will do. As long as you take the trouble to indicate in some way besides sterile typeface that you aren’t serious. _smile_ ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/23 "2003-06-24T00:28:32Z")
**Zabali** , you have my sympathy. I don’t think I’ve run up against that kind of bigotry IRL. Still don’t think it’s a good idea to respond to a possible/probable joke with both barrels, disclaimer or no. When railing against injustice and kangaroo courts it hardly behooves one to practice such acts oneself. Enjoy, Steven **Beagle** I appreciate the advice. In the past I have actually used(abused?) the :rolleyes: smilie in some posts like my first in this thread. Kind of turned away from that though. English is a marvelously expressive language, being a bastard of virtually every known tongue gives it a breadth of expressions few can match, and I think the meaning comes across clearly enough in most cases. Occasionally such a style causes disconnects without the aid of body language and other clues. I’m willing to live with it rather than substitute the remarkably bland emotions represented by smilies. ---
**Author:** ![presidebt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c37758/32.png) [@presidebt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/presidebt)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/24 "2003-06-24T02:10:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Larry Mudd \* > \*\ ***Zabali\_Clawbane** , Sacco & Vanzetti predated the McCarthy Era by more than twenty years… although the analogy is good. \*\* On par with McCarthy was a little man by the name of Harry Anslinger and another little man called Andrew Comstock, the latter pre-dated S&V by thirty years. The first went after marijuana smokers, the second after those who sought a free exchange of sexual information, specifically birth control. And the list could go on… What a mess, and what a lie that America has ever been free of tyranny. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/25 "2003-06-24T03:08:15Z")
> [@](#): > > Beagle I appreciate the advice. In the past I have actually used(abused?) the :rolleyes: smilie in some posts like my first in this thread. Kind of turned away from that though. English is a marvelously expressive language, being a bastard of virtually every known tongue gives it a breadth of expressions few can match, and I think the meaning comes across clearly enough in most cases. Occasionally such a style causes disconnects without the aid of body language and other clues. I’m willing to live with it rather than substitute the remarkably bland emotions represented by smilies. ☹ It wasn’t really serious “advice.” Having some experience with sarcasm, just thought I’d give you my .01 (investments are down). I figured you were making an absurdist / sarcastic observation. On the actual topic… I’m not “sanguine,” by the way. I would describe myself as alarmed. I’ve been watching the slow (now fast) erosion of our civil liberties for years, IMO. Let’s see what the government tries next. Bugs in our cell phones? :eek: [sub]I don’t think they’re so bland…[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/26 "2003-06-24T09:43:57Z")
Re: **Andrew Comstock** It’s Anthony, not Andrew, and he managed to impose his sexual demons on the entire population of the United States of America. ---
**Author:** ![Read\_Neck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e19b73/32.png) [@Read\_Neck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Read_Neck)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/27 "2003-06-24T11:12:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*Is that the best you can do? The Washington Post is just making stuff up? How thick is the layer of denial that it takes to make yourself believe that? \*\* Not at all. I’ve a habit of being skeptical of any article, no matter what it’s author, if it doesn’t “qualify sources”. Thanks,SmackFu,for doing my homework. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/28 "2003-06-24T12:33:58Z")
[ol][_]One must read the WaPo article carefully, because it mixes allegations by the detainees with what the Government Report said. The detainees alleged that they were abused, but the government report didnt say that detainees were abused. According to the cite in the OP, the Gov’t. reports said it found “significant problems” with the treatment of nearly 800 detainees nationwide, including abusive conditions. I’m not sure what “abusive conditions” means.[_]There’s no indication that Ashcroft intended alleged abuse to occur, so it seems unfair to blame him personally for the Gestappo tactics. In fact, there’s no indication that Ashcroft even knew that the abuse took place. But, he’s such a useful whipping boy.[/ol] ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/29 "2003-06-24T12:56:31Z")
You’re grasping at straws now. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/30 "2003-06-24T13:10:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*I swear that if a state of martial law were declared and Bush were made president for life, most Americans wouldn’t care as long as their regular TV shows weren’t interrupted. Hell, the majority of Americans are so apathetic that they don’t even bother to vote, so they wouldn’t miss not being able to. \*\* Whatever. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/31 "2003-06-24T14:42:30Z")
> [@](#): > > [http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/06/05/ashcroft.terror/index.html](http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/06/05/ashcroft.terror/index.html) > > Attorney General John Ashcroft defended his department Thursday, responding publicly for the first time to a report from the Justice Department’s inspector general that strongly criticized the handling of detainees after the September 11, 2001 attacks. > > In testimony before the House Judiciary Committee, Ashcroft also asked Congress for expanded powers in dealing with suspected terrorists, even as some lawmakers questioned how a new anti-terrorism law is being applied. > > Ashcroft was called to task – at times even excoriated – by lawmakers who took issue with what the report described as the incarceration of illegal immigrants with no proven links to terrorism for as long as 200 days, deportations of more than 500 of them, and mistreatment of prisoners. > > Ashcroft staunchly defended his department, but said that any claims of abuse would be investigated ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/32 "2003-06-24T14:52:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Beagle \* > \*\*☹ > > It wasn’t really serious “advice.”\*\* [sub]I didn’t really take it seriously. See how annoying these disclaimers can be?[/sub] Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/33 "2003-06-24T14:58:08Z")
So the solution to Ashcroft’s abuses is to give him more authority? Jesus, Ashcroft is scary. He really is a new McCarthy except he has more power. What’s especially disturbing is that he won’t be held accountable by the public or by the White House. The media sure doesn’t help and we know how stupid the public is (25% of Americans think that Iraq used WMDs on US and UK troops during the invasion). Things are going to get worse before they get better, This has been the most anti-American administration in living memory but they’re doing it under a guise of jingoistic patriotism and the people snap it up like seals taking fish, clapping and barking all the way. I fear the next election will be the last. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/34 "2003-06-24T15:01:54Z")
> [@](#): > > I fear the next election will be the last That’s assuming there will even be a next election. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/35 "2003-06-24T15:04:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*I fear the next election will be the last. \*\* Yes, I fear Ashcroft, think he’s dangerous. Yes, I understand that one generally won’t go broke by underestimating the gullibility of the American Public. But. damn. that’s just plain silly. **even** the nimrods who think WoMD were used on Americans in GWII would notice if there weren’t an election. They may not always vote in 'em , but us 'Mericans would **not** be in favor of suspending elections and would notice it if they were gone. I understand hyperbole, but not when it gets that silly. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/36 "2003-06-24T15:08:17Z")
Wow, **tdn** , what an intelligent refutation of my statement. I’m in awe at your command of logic. Putz. So, are you saying that I’m worn, that the majority of American DO vote? That right this minute they are heavily engaged in public discourse, aghast at what the government is doing in their name? Is that what you’re saying? 'cause it’s really hard to discern from your post. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/37 "2003-06-24T15:08:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*I fear the next election will be the last. \*\* Wrong. The last one was! I have been selected by the EBA (Evil Bush Administration) to take over the Great Dope. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/38 "2003-06-24T15:10:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*I fear the next election will be the last. \*\* Oh, for crying out loud. Yes, Ashcroft’s attempts to extend his powers and control are deeply worrying, but do you _really_ stand by this ludicrous statement? You trivialise everything being discussed (and these are important issues) by constantly pronouncing doom like this. I’m genuinely interested - do you really think this? Really? preview: damn you, wring… ---
**Author:** ![Lucki\_Chaarms](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lucki\_Chaarms](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucki_Chaarms)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/39 "2003-06-24T15:21:08Z")
**december** , you _are_ the Great Dope. LC ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869/40 "2003-06-24T15:25:10Z")
**Wring** and **Dead Badger** , there are no magic guarantees of our freedom. The only obstacle in the way of government encroachment upon our rights is the watchfullness fo the people and their lected representatives., but right now the people are asleep and their represenatives are either colluding Republicans or craven Democrats. Nobody cares about the Arab men who were apprehended after September 11 and still languish in jail without charges being brought, a clear violation of the Constitution. Nobody cares that the military is slowly taking away the sovereignty of the civil courts by establishing military tribunals to try suspected terrorists. Nobody cares that the Bush administration conned honest citizens like me to trust them as they fomented a war on forged evidence. If Bush declared martial law tomorrow, do you honestly think that anyone[/u would mount a significant resistance? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-evil-that-is-ashcroft-gvt-report-says-detainees-were-abused/183869.md?page=3)