# The failed Syrian rescue op - why make it public? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 21, 2014, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049 "2014-08-21T00:07:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/1 "2014-08-21T00:07:17Z")
In case you missed it: > **[Official: U.S. attempt to rescue James Foley, others in Syria failed | CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2014/08/20/world/meast/isis-james-foley/index.html?hpt=hp_t1)** > > A recent attempt to rescue American James Foley and others in Syria failed, a U.S. official told CNN on Wednesday A U.S. rescue operation earlier this summer failed to free American journalist James Foley and others being held by ISIS in Syria, a U.S. official told CNN on Wednesday. The Pentagon confirmed a rescue attempt, but did not say whether Foley was among those U.S. officials were hoping to free. “Unfortunately, the mission was not successful because the hostages were not present at the targeted location,” Pentagon spokesman Rear Adm. John Kirby said. A U.S. official, speaking on condition of anonymity, told CNN the mission was to rescue Foley and other American hostages being held at an undisclosed location. What exactly was the point of making this public today? It was secret for a while, there were no rumors of it, it wasn’t about to be disclosed due to a leak AFAIK - what is the point of publicising your failures? ---
**Author:** ![chacoguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@chacoguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chacoguy)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/2 "2014-08-21T00:14:42Z")
So that various politicians and news outlets can’t say that we didn’t do enough to try to save him. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/3 "2014-08-21T02:26:37Z")
It would probably come out somehow, so you might as well put a positive spin on it (hey, we tried.) ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/4 "2014-08-21T02:28:03Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > It would probably come out somehow, so you might as well put a positive spin on it (hey, we tried.) That was my thought on it. Since Benghazi, gotta put it all on the table. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/5 "2014-08-21T03:39:16Z")
Worst case is to have something look later like there had an attempted cover up of a failure. Own it right off. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/6 "2014-08-21T03:42:51Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Worst case is to have something look later like there had an attempted cover up of a failure. > > Own it right off. That’s silly. I am sure there are at least a couple of dozen serious secret ops every year, and not all of them are successful. Yet they remain secret. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/7 "2014-08-21T04:50:26Z")
Ones in which the consequences of having failed had as much press coverage as this? I doubt it. But of course the fact we don’t know may just prove how secret they are! ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/8 "2014-08-21T08:35:51Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Ones in which the consequences of having failed had as much press coverage as this? I doubt it. But of course the fact we don’t know may just prove how secret they are! Right. Sometimes you don’t want anyone to know you attempted something, and sometimes you do. This is a much more public issue, so a public response is more appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 8:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/9 "2014-08-21T08:41:01Z")
In light of this, the dark human demon in me wants to believe that James Foley’s last words were “Thanks, Obama!” ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/10 "2014-08-21T13:38:42Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > It was secret for a while, there were no rumors of it, it wasn’t about to be disclosed due to a leak AFAIK … Out of curiosity, do you typically know about leaks in advance? That’s a very marketable skill. ---
**Author:** ![JustinC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justinc/32/8083_2.png) [@JustinC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JustinC)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/11 "2014-08-21T13:43:56Z")
The family of others who are held hostage will, I expect, be more assured the government is \*trying \*to do something. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/12 "2014-08-25T03:25:37Z")
Well now we find out how Obama missed the opportunity to get Foley: > **[Toby Harnden](https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=732469080123421&id=183613961675605)** > > My Sunday Times piece on the Islamic State murder of James Foley: "Obama’s Iraqi mission impossible" > > It was shortly after midnight on the Fourth of July when the specially modified Black Hawk... Pentagon sources said Foley and the others might well have been rescued but Obama, concerned about the ramifications of US troops being killed or captured in Syria, took too long to authorise the mission. Anthony Shaffer, a former lieutenant-colonel in US military intelligence who worked on covert operations, said: “I’m told it was almost a 30-day delay from when they said they wanted to go to when he finally gave the green light. They were ready to go in June to grab the guy [Foley] and they weren’t permitted.” Another US defence source said: “The White House constantly goes back and forth on these things. These people are a bunch of academics who endlessly analyse stuff and ordering up another deep-thinking paper but can’t decide what to order for lunch.” ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/13 "2014-08-25T03:40:37Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Well now we find out how Obama missed the opportunity to get Foley: > > [Toby Harnden](https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=732469080123421&id=183613961675605) > > Pentagon sources said Foley and the others might well have been rescued but Obama, concerned about the ramifications of US troops being killed or captured in Syria, took too long to authorise the mission. > > Anthony Shaffer, a former lieutenant-colonel in US military intelligence who worked on covert operations, said: “I’m told it was almost a 30-day delay from when they said they wanted to go to when he finally gave the green light. They were ready to go in June to grab the guy [Foley] and they weren’t permitted.” > > Another US defence source said: “The White House constantly goes back and forth on these things. These people are a bunch of academics who endlessly analyse stuff and ordering up another deep-thinking paper but can’t decide what to order for lunch.” Two unnamed sources and a former officer who wasn’t there and was told something. Real reliable sources you got there. Almost makes Fox look legit. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/14 "2014-08-25T03:45:16Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Two unnamed sources and a former officer who wasn’t there and was told something. > Real reliable sources you got there. Almost makes Fox look legit. Its [“The Sunday Times”](http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/focus/article1450512.ece). Take it up with them. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/15 "2014-08-25T03:53:16Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Its [“The Sunday Times”](http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/focus/article1450512.ece). Take it up with them. You used it as if it’s a valid cite. Hey look, your cite is behind a paywall. How _convenient._ ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/16 "2014-08-25T03:59:30Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > You used it as if it’s a valid cite. > > Hey look, your cite is behind a paywall. How _convenient._ That is why the first cite I gave was to the facebook page of the author where you can see the whole article. Convenient enough? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/17 "2014-08-25T04:05:41Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > That is why the first cite I gave was to the facebook page of the author where you can see the whole article. Convenient enough? And the author’s sources are two unnamed persons and a former officer who is claiming to have been told this by persons unknown. That’s got to be one of the most pathetic cites I’ve ever seen. And some people don’t use Facebook. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/18 "2014-08-25T05:32:04Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > And the author’s sources are two unnamed persons and a former officer who is claiming to have been told this by persons unknown. That’s got to be one of the most pathetic cites I’ve ever seen. Again - go complain to “The Sunday Times”. That’s one of the more reputable newspapers in the world, a paper with some standards. Including requiring credible sources from their reporters. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/19 "2014-08-25T06:04:46Z")
Also, I’m not sure to what extent it is editorializing because it only gives the vaguest of information. The story clearly gives the impression that everyone but Obama was united in wanting to do this mission and having few reservations. I would be very surprised if that were the case. Both that an operation this complex and risky would not have any military advisors suggesting caution, and that obama would just ignore their unanimous opinion. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 8:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049/20 "2014-08-25T08:02:10Z")
These things can easily go wrong. Anyone remember President Carter’s rescue mission for the Iranian hostages: "The operation encountered many obstacles and was eventually aborted. Eight helicopters were sent to the first staging area, Desert One, but only five arrived in operational condition. One encountered hydraulic problems, another got caught in a cloud of very fine sand, and the last one showed signs of a cracked rotor blade. During planning it was decided that the mission would be aborted if fewer than six helicopters remained, despite only four being absolutely necessary. In a move that is still discussed in military circles, the commanders asked President Carter for permission to abort and Carter granted the request. As the U.S. force prepared to leave, one of the helicopters crashed into a transport aircraft which contained both servicemen and jet fuel. The resulting fire destroyed both aircraft and killed eight servicemen." > **[Operation Eagle Claw](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw)** > > Logistical support: > Operation Eagle Claw, known as Operation Tabas (Persian: عملیات طبس) in Iran, was a failed operation by the United States Armed Forces ordered by U.S. President Jimmy Carter to attempt the rescue of 52 embassy staff held captive at the Embassy of the United States, Tehran on 24 April 1980. > The operation, one of Delta Force's first, encountered many obstacles and failures and was subsequently aborted. Eight helicopters were sent to the first staging area called Desert One, ... [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failed-syrian-rescue-op-why-make-it-public/696049.md?page=2)