# The failure of trans-bashing politics **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 13, 2022, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850 "2022-11-13T12:49:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2022, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/41 "2022-11-15T11:34:29Z")
since the acceptance of gay rights id say trans rights are where gay rights were in the 60s and it’s going to be another 20 years or so before it’s commonly accepted … ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2022, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/42 "2022-11-15T23:09:29Z")
I think that with social media and the ubiquity of information access (both good and bad), things will change a lot faster than they did in the 60s. We do have a generation growing up with the idea that being trans is normal. I didn’t know anyone who was (openly) trans until I was an adult. My daughter is growing up with one of my closest friends (who is also in her life) being trans, and it’s just “whatever”, nothing notable. I expect that in the next decade (the '30s) it won’t be that big of a deal. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2022, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/43 "2022-11-15T23:12:48Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > But you also work at a school, don’t you? Yes, but I’m not even counting my students. Between extended family, neighbors, co-workers, etc, I’m already well over a hundred. ---
**Author:** ![Swords\_to\_Plowshares](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b38774/32.png) [@Swords\_to\_Plowshares](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swords_to_Plowshares)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2022, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/44 "2022-11-21T16:57:52Z")
Thank you for supporting your son, that is really cool to hear. Personally I really do care more about those sorts of experiences than what the media has to say, and I think many others do too, so. maybe I should ignore the media a bit more. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/45 "2023-03-24T14:47:28Z")
The Illinois House of Representatives has passed a bill prohibiting libraries from banning books. This bill apparently spawned from _[Gender Queer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_Queer)_ being pulled from shelves. > **[Illinois House passes bill prohibiting libraries from banning books due to...](https://abc7chicago.com/book-bans-illinois-library-house-of-representatives-politics/12993420/)** > > House Bill 2789 is an initiative of Democratic Secretary of State Alexi Giannoulias, whose office oversees the Illinois State Library and administers several grant programs for public and school libraries as well as adult literacy programs throughout... ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/46 "2023-03-24T15:25:51Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > The Illinois House of Representatives has passed a bill prohibiting libraries from banning books. As an Illinois resident, I applaud the sentiment behind this bill … but I wonder if it also precludes libraries from refusing to stock books that we on the left abhor. If Scott Adams published a Dilbert book that said all LGBTQ people are groomers and “normal” people should remove them from society, would a library be punished for banning it? ---
**Author:** ![NinthAcolyte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ninthacolyte/32/13676_2.png) [@NinthAcolyte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinthAcolyte)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/47 "2023-03-24T15:34:22Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > If Scott Adams published a Dilbert book that said all LGBTQ people are groomers and “normal” people should remove them from society, would a library be punished for banning it? In general, public libraries do not exercise editorial control over the content of the books on our shelves. The vast majority of public libraries in the United States affirm the American Library Association’s [Freedom to Read Statement](https://www.ala.org/advocacy/intfreedom/freedomreadstatement), which affirms the right of Americans to read what they wish to read and the duty of Libraries to provide access to those materials. Naturally, this doesn’t mean we _must stock_ a copy of _every book_ - we make editorial decisions based on budget and space constraints. But if there was a reasonable level of demand among our patrons for that anti-LGBTQ+ Dilbert book, yeah, we would have it on the shelf. As a personal example, my old library had a series of “historical fiction” _children’s books_ written by _Rush Limbaugh_. They are exactly as bad as you might imagine. All we librarians would have been utterly delighted to remove them, but… They had a really solid checkout rate. They were in-demand among our patrons, so on the shelf they stayed. The fact that most libraries have “challenge policies” that allow the public to object to a book and get it removed is a _failure_ of Librarianship ethics. It’s a compromise that we have to have because we’re publicly funded. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/48 "2023-03-24T15:49:12Z")
> [@NinthAcolyte](#): > > As a personal example, my old library had a series of “historical fiction” _children’s books_ written by _Rush Limbaugh_. OMG. Thanks for the informed perspective. So is it accurate to say libraries have a fair amount of discretion about selecting what gets in, but once something is in they should be able to resist efforts to take it out? (Apologies if this is a hijack from the trans-bashing topic.) ---
**Author:** ![NinthAcolyte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ninthacolyte/32/13676_2.png) [@NinthAcolyte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinthAcolyte)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/49 "2023-03-24T15:58:09Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > So is it accurate to say libraries have a fair amount of discretion about selecting what gets in, but once something is in they should be able to resist efforts to take it out? This is called “collection development” and it’s a whole area of study in librarianship (it also happens to be my area of focus!) The absolute bare bones of it is that library collections should be developed so as to best meet the needs of the persons using that library. So if I am developing collections at a small Tribal College library (which is the case now) then I would not select (by which I mean “purchase with library money”) Scott Adam’s hypothetical gay-bashing book, nor would I keep it on the shelf if I found it there, or accept it as a donation. I would make these decisions not because the content of the book is objectionable, but because it is not useful to the patrons and purposes of the library. Conversely, if I am a _public_ librarian doing col. dev. in a _public library_ in a deep-red city or town that also happens to be home to the Scott Adams Fan Club Headquarters… Yeah, that population is probably going to want that book. It would be my ethical responsibility as a librarian and my duty as a steward of public funds to buy that book using library acquisitions money and keep it on the shelf, and to vigorously oppose any attempt to get it removed on the basis of its content. I say all this as a practicing librarian with a Master’s degree in Library & Information Science (okay almost, graduation is in May!) _and_ as a super duper lefty trans lady. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/50 "2023-03-24T16:10:30Z")
> [@NinthAcolyte](#): > > It would be my ethical responsibility as a librarian and my duty as a steward of public funds to buy that book using library acquisitions money and keep it on the shelf, and to vigorously oppose any attempt to get it removed on the basis of its content. > > I say all this as a practicing librarian with a Master’s degree in Library & Information Science (okay almost, graduation is in May!) _and_ as a super duper lefty trans lady. Thanks for fighting my ignorance, and for your dedication to doing such an important job with impartiality. And congrats! /hijack ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/51 "2023-03-24T17:11:39Z")
Of course, while I’m sure librarians do a good job of gauging what the public in their community wants, they must make mistakes sometimes. If you put a book on the shelves that isn’t actually in demand, then you’ll see in your records that it almost never gets checked out, and so is a good candidate for removal, but what about errors the other way? Is there a standard process for petitioning the library to add a book they don’t have? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/52 "2023-03-24T17:51:14Z")
You can always donate a book. That doesn’t mean that they _will_ put it on their shelves, but it does mean that they don’t have to decide if it is worth purchasing. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/53 "2023-03-24T18:36:00Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > Anyway, might this be a factor in the failure of trans-bashing politics? Whether or not trans-bashing politics have succeeded in winning votes for the Republican party, they have succeeded in making life difficult and dangerous for a lot of trans people and their families right now. 😢 ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/54 "2023-03-24T18:41:07Z")
Yeah, the people behind this don’t see it as “failing”. It’s hurting those they want to hurt. ---
**Author:** ![NinthAcolyte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ninthacolyte/32/13676_2.png) [@NinthAcolyte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinthAcolyte)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/55 "2023-03-24T19:05:43Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Of course, while I’m sure librarians do a good job of gauging what the public in their community wants, they must make mistakes sometimes. If you put a book on the shelves that isn’t actually in demand, then you’ll see in your records that it almost never gets checked out, and so is a good candidate for removal, but what about errors the other way? Is there a standard process for petitioning the library to add a book they don’t have? Yeah, most public libraries will have a request form. To be clear - we tend to be _really_ good at getting what our patrons want. Staying in tune with what people in our communities are reading is a big part of the public col. dev. job. But if we don’t have an item that someone asked for, we’ll make a note of it and investigate to see if it would be worth acquiring. That itself is a balancing act! If someone with a weird niche interest asked for a big expensive book that probably nobody else would want, well… We probably won’t get it. But if it’s an item with reasonable likelihood of general usage, we will! At my former library we also had a “patron directed acquisitions” process. The State Library gave us a grant to basically let patrons directly request items. The item would get bought through Amazon and shipped to the patron. When the patron was done with it, they returned it to the library and we’d evaluate whether to catalogue and shelve it or sell it through our Friends of the Library bookstore. Apologies for the continual off-topic! Y’all think an “I’m a librarian, ask me anything” thread would be a good idea? ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/56 "2023-03-24T19:10:23Z")
> [@NinthAcolyte](#): > > Apologies for the continual off-topic! Y’all think an “I’m a librarian, ask me anything” thread would be a good idea? Yes, please. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2023, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/57 "2023-03-25T03:48:36Z")
> **[Nebraska Dem with trans son vows to block all bills: "No one in the world...](https://www.salon.com/2023/03/24/nebraska-dem-with-trans-son-vows-to-block-all-bills-no-one-in-the-world-holds-a-grudge-like-me/)** > > "No one in the world cares less about being petty than me. I don't care. I don't like you," said Sen. Megan Hunt. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2023, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/58 "2023-03-25T03:59:35Z")
All of this controversy swirling around what books are available or not available in school libraries has had me rolling my eyes from the very beginning of when it blew up the news (I think it was sometime last year, although I don’t doubt it’s been an ongoing issue for years if not decades.) Everything is out there online and kids can and will access whatever they want. It’s totally idiotic for these parents to work themselves into a tizzy because their kid’s school library has a certain book, and it’s also kind of equally idiotic for people to be up in arms that a school library _doesn’t_ have a certain book. Everything is online. Everything can be found. Kids are experts at finding contraband, taboo, the forbidden fruit - they’re fucking EXPERTS at it. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2023, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/59 "2023-03-25T04:15:47Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > Kids are experts at finding contraband, taboo, the forbidden fruit - they’re fucking EXPERTS at it. And these parents are making sure that when they DO find it they will have NO guidance or advice as to how to take it. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2023, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850/60 "2023-03-25T04:26:31Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > All of this controversy swirling around what books are available or not available in school libraries has had me rolling my eyes… Your eyes will really roll at this: > **[Principal resigns after Florida students shown Michelangelo statue](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-65071989)** > > One Florida parent complained Michelangelo's iconic statue amounted to pornography. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-failure-of-trans-bashing-politics/974850.md?page=4)