# The fastest gun in the West **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 8, 2006, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588 "2006-02-08T20:40:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2006, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/21 "2006-02-10T17:48:31Z")
Perhaps not the fastest gunslinger, but pretty darned fast, quite accurate and one of the most ruthless gunfighters ever - John Wesley Hardin. Attributed with at least 41 killings. Spent some time in my neck of the woods, Jacksonville, Florida. Should have been one of the most notorious, but I suspect not having a memorable nickname kept him reletively obscure. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2006, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/22 "2006-02-10T21:15:43Z")
> [@Dr. PoopiePants](#): > > Perhaps not the fastest gunslinger, but pretty darned fast, quite accurate and one of the most ruthless gunfighters ever - John Wesley Hardin. Attributed with at least 41 killings. Spent some time in my neck of the woods, Jacksonville, Florida. Should have been one of the most notorious, but I suspect not having a memorable nickname kept him reletively obscure. Hardin was fast in the sense of “quick on the trigger” (easily angered and prompted to shoot), but few of his killings were stand-up, face to face encounters between adversaries who were both aware that a gunfight was imminent. (In fact, several of his shooting were from ambush, several more were the result of him responding to the threat of a knife or club with gunfire, and a couple were the result of him hauling out his gun and firing at a person who did not even realize that he had any intention of fighting.) Hardin was dangerous (and was quite famous at the time, as well as among those who read about the West, today), but there is no evidence that he was particularly a “fast draw.” (He _was_ accurate.) Hardin was never _obscure_, although his actual life did not lend itself to romanticizing movies, so he is not well known among those whose only acquaintance with the West is TV or cinema. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2006, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/23 "2006-02-10T22:20:00Z")
\*He was short and fat, and rode out of the West With a Mogen David on his silver vest. He was mean and nasty right clear through, Which was kinda weird, 'cause he was yellow too. They called him Irving. Big Irving. Big, short Irving. Big, short, fat Irving. [The hundred and forty-second fastest gun in the West.](http://ntl.matrix.com.br/pfilho/html/lyrics/b/ballad_of_irving.txt)\* ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2006, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/24 "2006-02-10T22:29:18Z")
Ah, beaten! ---
**Author:** ![Backwater\_Under\_Duck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ba8739/32.png) [@Backwater\_Under\_Duck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Backwater_Under_Duck)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2006, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/25 "2006-02-10T23:41:19Z")
_131 were faster than he,_ _But Irving was looking for 133…_ ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Rieux](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@Dr.Rieux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Rieux)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2006, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/26 "2006-02-11T00:00:34Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Hardin was never _obscure_, although his actual life did not lend itself to romanticizing movies, so he is not well known among those whose only acquaintance with the West is TV or cinema. Ahem. [The Lawless Breed](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0045992/), starring Rock Hudson and (loosely) based on Hardin’s (self-aggrandizing) memoirs. ---
**Author:** ![Valgard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/7feea3/32.png) [@Valgard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valgard)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2006, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/27 "2006-02-11T01:02:20Z")
> [@Johnny L.A.](#): > > Ah, beaten! Darn tootin’ I was quicker on the draw 😃 ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2006, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/28 "2006-02-11T05:23:33Z")
Before his death, young Jimmy Brown was considered one of the fastest actors with a sixgun draw. (no buzzer or go siginal, just stand there and someone moves first.) YMMV ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/29 "2006-02-13T14:24:59Z")
> [@Backwater Under\_Duck](#): > > _131 were faster than he,_ > _But Irving was looking for 133…_ Try… 1 **4** 1 were faster than he, But Irving was looking for 1 **4** 3… Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![jali](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecae2f/32.png) [@jali](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jali)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2006, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/30 "2006-02-14T13:59:45Z")
Sharon Stone. (my idea of funny - I don’t remember her character’s name in the Quick and The Dead) ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2006, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/31 "2006-02-14T19:39:08Z")
Well, there is always Luke Short. Short was not known as a “gunslinger” per se, but he was definitely good with a firearm and was involved in two seperate, well-documented gunfights. In the first one, he shot and killed one Charlie Storms: > [@](#): > > He developed a habit of dressing to the nines, which gave him the reputation of a dandy. He was still living in Tombstone in 1881 when he was involved in a famous gunfight with Charlie Storms in the Oriental saloon. Short was the faster, firing two shots before his enemy could use his pistol. The fight was at such close quarters that Short’s muzzle flash set Charlie’s shirt on fire. In the second, Short killed one Jim Courtright: > [@](#): > > In Fort Worth Short was involved in another of the most famous historical gunfights. He was gambling at the White Elephant Saloon which was owned by another famous gunfighter, and Short’s good friend, Longhair Jim Courtright. When Courtright tried to extort protection money, Short refused and the two drew their pistols. Short fired first, some sources say because Courtright’s gun jammed. The bullet blew off Courtright’s right thumb, rendering him incapable of firing his double-action revolver. As he tried to switch the pistol to his left hand, Short fired several more times killing him. > **[Luke Short](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luke_Short)** > > Luke Lamar Short (January 22, 1854 – September 8, 1893) was an American Old West gunfighter, cowboy, U.S. Army scout, dispatch rider, gambler, boxing promoter, and saloon owner. He survived numerous gunfights, the most famous of which were against Charlie Storms in Tombstone, Arizona Territory and against Jim Courtright in Fort Worth, Texas. Short had business interests in three of the best-known saloons in the Old West: the Oriental in Tombstone, the Long Branch Saloon in Dodge City, and the W... ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2006, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588/32 "2006-02-14T22:31:05Z")
Nobody is saying that nobody ever killed others with guns in the old west. The question was whether there were classic street duels with guns. A guy who pulls a gun in a saloon on someone so close that he set his shirt on fire is a simple murderer. We know they existed. There were dozens if not hundreds, although not nearly as many as Hollywood would have us think. Pulling a gun and killing someone sitting next to him doesn’t make Luke Short a gunfighter any more than Al Capone’s pulling out a bat and beating in somebody’s brains makes him a baseball player. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-fastest-gun-in-the-west/343588.md?page=1)