# The federal government made a serious mistake by caving in to Cliven Bundy **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 13, 2014, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993 "2014-04-13T05:03:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/461 "2014-04-24T19:57:46Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Someone trying to save face, for one. If Bundy’s racial remarks had come out on day 1 of the standoff, instead of day 16 or so, there’d be much less of a need to defend him. But after 16 days, there’s been a lot of investment in Bundy, and rationalizing his remarks feels a lot better than admitting you were backing a racist. The Senators have no choice but to repudiate him, but no one elected Sean Hannity or Dana Loesch, and no one runs against them. > > Because their viewers are probably experiencing the same need to save face, and want to be reassured. It makes sense but it still makes me want to punch something. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/462 "2014-04-24T20:05:23Z")
You guys are all missing Bundy’s point, which is that accepting government subsidies destroys character. It’s much better to simply steal from the government, like he does. ---
**Author:** ![standingwave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@standingwave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/standingwave)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/463 "2014-04-24T20:08:04Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > He’s not a racist man, he just wonders whether those negroes were better off as slaves. :rolleyes: Jesus, what is wrong with these people? And that right-wing correspondent upthread. What the hell are people like that doing on the news?! Seriously, someone help me out here! I’m totally lost! It’s political correctness run amok! It’s getting so bad that you can’t even ask the question! \<.sarcasm\> ---
**Author:** ![racepug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@racepug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racepug)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/464 "2014-04-24T20:20:13Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Here’s my favorite one: > > It’s funny because Nevada County is in California; the county seat is Nevada City. The state of Nevada does not have a Nevada County (or a Nevada City). Bunkerville is located in Clark County. I think I’ve seen that Dana Loesch. Once. On a YouTube video of her yelling at Chris Matthews (who, admittedly, can be a bit grating at times, even if I generally agree with his views on things). At that very moment I knew I wouldn’t like her. And what you posted just seems to confirm about her what I already figured I knew: that she’s a lamebrain trying to make herself out to be somebody who knows what she’s talking about. In her defense, she has PLENTY of company. ---
**Author:** ![racepug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@racepug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racepug)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/465 "2014-04-24T20:22:25Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > It makes sense but it still makes me want to punch something. If you want to punch something why don’t you start with Sean Hannity (he’s a “something,” isn’t he?)? Wasn’t there someone else in this thread who, at some point, declared that Sean Hannity has The World’s Most Punchable Face, or something like that? That was CLASSIC!! ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/466 "2014-04-24T20:44:53Z")
> [@racepug](#): > > If you want to punch something why don’t you start with Sean Hannity (he’s a “something,” isn’t he?)? Wasn’t there someone else in this thread who, at some point, declared that Sean Hannity has The World’s Most Punchable Face, or something like that? That was CLASSIC!! I think that was Al Franken. But yeah, that would be a good place to start. I mean… Wow. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/467 "2014-04-24T21:08:04Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > It makes sense but it still makes me want to punch something. Like . . . cattle? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Donald\_Rump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Donald\_Rump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donald_Rump)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/468 "2014-04-24T21:30:05Z")
Fox [awakens](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/04/24/bundy-under-fire/)from its dogmatic slumbers… Randomly sampled comment: “Amazing how the media has turned this into a racial issue!” ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/469 "2014-04-24T21:37:18Z")
> [@Enginerd](#): > > Not much political support. But I don’t think any of his freedom-loving militia supporters are going to be put off by his words. I’d wager 100% of his gun-rights anti-government pro-militia revolutionaries already hold the exact same beliefs and they probably love him even more now for being brave enough to “speak the truth.” Whenever these guys talk about the coming revolution what they really mean is the coming race war. At least the rest of us get to point and laugh, but I doubt this will discourage any of his militia friends from turning up at the next stand-off. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/470 "2014-04-24T21:41:06Z")
> [@TonySinclair](#): > > You guys are all missing Bundy’s point, which is that accepting government subsidies destroys character. It’s much better to simply steal from the government, like he does. at least he is an honest thief ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/471 "2014-04-24T21:45:29Z")
> [@Donald\_Rump](#): > > Fox [awakens](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/04/24/bundy-under-fire/)from its dogmatic slumbers… > > Randomly sampled comment: “Amazing how the media has turned this into a racial issue!” From the comments I learned that [if] you claim he said African Americans were better off as slaves, you’re a liar. See, he didn’t say they WERE better off, he just ASKED if they were. So he’s not a racist, he’s just very, very dumb. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/472 "2014-04-24T22:07:40Z")
I see you do not know what a rhetorical question is. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/473 "2014-04-24T22:12:27Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > I think that was Al Franken. But yeah, that would be a good place to start. I mean… Wow. Al Franken might have been the first. I am however on the record on this very board and will re-iterate my pledge that, when I’m God-Emperor of Mankind, there will be a cushy government job for Guy Who Punches Sean Hannity In His Smarmy Face Any Time It Looks Like He’s Gonna Open His Mouth. Job security unparalleled. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/474 "2014-04-24T22:34:29Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > See, he didn’t say they WERE better off, he just ASKED if they were. It’s always respectful to ask first! ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/475 "2014-04-24T22:35:11Z")
Give that job to Mike Tyson. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/476 "2014-04-25T00:01:19Z")
[MediaMatters points out that Bundy’s racial remarks were pretty much the same thing RW pundits have been saying for years.](http://mediamatters.org/blog/2014/04/24/lawless-ranchers-slavery-comments-echo-conserva/199006) ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/477 "2014-04-25T01:53:06Z")
Now that I’ve had time to reflect, I’m not so sure that his words are quite the high quality information about the Negro I was hoping for. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/478 "2014-04-25T12:58:48Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [MediaMatters points out that Bundy’s racial remarks were pretty much the same thing RW pundits have been saying for years.](http://mediamatters.org/blog/2014/04/24/lawless-ranchers-slavery-comments-echo-conserva/199006) Sort of. Bundy’s comment flat out implies that slavery was a good thing for blacks, as opposed to those quotes which say slavery was bad but modern “slavery” is worse. And nobody informed him that he should leave “negro” and references to cotton-picking out of his comments. His dog whistle made a noise that everyone heard. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/479 "2014-04-25T14:25:23Z")
[Now Bundy has some thoughts about “the Spanish people” and they are more interesting than you might expect.](http://www.vox.com/2014/4/25/5651432/cliven-bundy-spanish-people) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993/480 "2014-04-25T14:32:03Z")
Ah, the little-remembered “Mexicans can’t come here” Clause of Article I. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-federal-government-made-a-serious-mistake-by-caving-in-to-cliven-bundy/685993.md?page=25)