# The Final, Ultimate, Supreme Bush v. Kerry Thread! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 14, 2004, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144 "2004-10-14T02:33:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144/161 "2004-11-02T08:10:28Z")
> [@JillGat](#): > > I keep hearing about this block of “undecided” voters and I can’t imagine who these people are. What scares me most are the people - many of them young - who are so disgusted by the politics, smearing and pandering that goes on in the campaigns that they don’t want to vote at all. For God’s sake, pick ONE issue you care about and compare the records or positions stated by Bush and by Kerry and vote based on that. You care about drilling in Alaska and other environmental issues? Support for education? Health insurance? Women’s rights? These two candidates are two VERY different people on most of these issues. > > Sure Kerry initially supported the war in Iraq. That’s because he - like 70% of the American people - believed… Oh God! Bush’s people too out Jill. ---
**Author:** ![JillGat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9fc29f/32.png) [@JillGat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JillGat)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144/162 "2004-11-02T08:17:12Z")
I keep hearing about this block of “undecided” voters and I can’t imagine who these people are. What scares me most are the people - many of them young - who are so disgusted by the politics, smearing and pandering that goes on in the campaigns that they don’t want to vote at all. I saw these sentiments being expressed here on the SDMB and it made me want to scream or puke. For God’s sake, pick ONE issue you care about and compare the records or positions of Bush to those of Kerry and vote based on that. You care about environmental issues? Support for education? Health insurance? Women’s rights? Giving breaks to the ultra rich and the most powerful corporations while the middle and lower classes continue to tank? These candidates are two VERY different people on most of these issues. The Iraq issues are important, sure, but this scary situation is not the only thing at stake here. Look at the domestic scene. Pick anything you care about. If you know anybody living in any other part of the world, ask them how they view us right now. If you don’t, then look up some international newspapers on the internet. It’s rather eye-opening. Jeez, learn about your local candidates and issues on your ballet. And vote. Don’t make me sick. Jill ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144/163 "2004-11-02T08:30:55Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > OMFG > > Look, a true leader could overcome such minor adversities. Even with someone holding policies with which they disagreed, after 9/11 a huge majority of the people in this country were crying out for a leader to unify behind… > > **Bush failed to be that leader. Period.** > > Are you just too damn partisan to see that? No, I just don’t agree with it. > [@Knorf](#): > > I can’t believe you’re trying to suggest that if it weren’t for the Internet, Bush would be happily looking forward to reelection. Damn! Can’t I ever get out of here and call it a night without having to log back in to refute something I never said? Kindly point to where I suggested that if it weren’t for the Internet, Bush would be looking forward to reelection, happily or otherwise. If you have interpreted this from my comment about the electronic media, I guess I’m going to have to explain to you that I’m talking about satellite images, pictures and video; broadcast television; cable television; newspapers; etc., etc…of which the Internet is only a relatively small part. > [@Knorf](#): > > That mightily deserves a :rolleyes:. This mistaken interpretation by you, my friend, certainly does. > [@Knorf](#): > > And guess what, without adversarial political parties, you have a single party system. What do you think you call a state with a single political party? Did I not point out my own self ( 😛 ), in the post to which you’re responding, that this is intentional on the part of our founding fathers and as such, it’s a good thing overall that it is so? > [@Knorf](#): > > If a president can’t overcome that adversarial relationship to a significant degree, he is no leader, and does not deserve to be reelected. Please, this is just your opinion. It is not a fact. Unless, of course, you can show me somewhere in the Constitution or in case law where it says a person’s permission to serve as president is contingent upon his overcoming the two-party adversarial relationship in such a way as to have the broad support of both parties. > [@Knorf](#): > > “Civil war.” Talk about meaningless hyperbole… Oh, there is quite a cultural civil war going on in this country right now. There have even been threads devoted to it. On the one hand ya got yer conservatives; and on the other hand ya got yer liberals. The libs, with the help of a heretofore unfettered news and entertainment media, have been coming on strong since the sixties, and they now represent roughly half the population. But the conservative contingent, which now has a voice thanks to talk radio and cable news, is beginning to assert itself and grow as well. So we now have a dynamic tension in this country in which, amazingly, we are split virtually 50/50 on most cultural issues. Which side will prevail? Who knows? Probably neither, with an eventual hodge-podge of intermixed values becoming predominant. But the war goes on nonetheless. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144/164 "2004-11-02T08:32:24Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > This would be a tough case to prove, but I think it is probably right. Thanks. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144/165 "2004-11-02T08:33:38Z")
Okay, I’m out of here. Good night, **roger**. Good night, all. ---
**Author:** ![ShockingAlberto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ea924/32.png) [@ShockingAlberto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShockingAlberto)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144/166 "2004-11-02T08:59:07Z")
On an, I guess, slightly more upbeat note, I’d just like to mention that tomorrow will be my first election voting. Not going to say who for (I’ve lurked here long enough to know who would jump on me the first chance they get), but I have to say that there’s a reason so many young voters like myself are motivated to get out there and vote for the first time. I truly wonder sometimes if the media ever takes us in to account. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144/167 "2004-11-02T09:12:19Z")
Congratulations, **Alberto**! Welcome to the fray. (And don’t feel too alone there about the media…most of us feel that way, no matter what our age or demographic.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-final-ultimate-supreme-bush-v-kerry-thread/269144.md?page=8)