# The First Commandment: What did He say? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 29, 2004, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161 "2004-03-29T21:03:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/1 "2004-03-29T21:03:18Z")
Does the First Commandment allow room for polytheism? Have any significant Jewish or Christian sects or biblical scholars interpreted it this way? I’d always known it as: “You shall have no other gods before me.” I have a hard time seeing that as an absolute prohibition against polytheism. “You shall have no other gods” would have communicated that, so why add “before me” unless you mean something different like: “You shall give no other gods higher precedence than me” or “You shall worship no other gods in my holy places”? But today I saw that my NIV Bible has “or besides” in a footnote. “You shall have no other gods besides me” does not allow for ambiguity in the same way that the more familiar version does. Does this footnote represent a better translation of the original term, or an editorial interpolation? ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/2 "2004-03-29T21:18:49Z")
Interesting point. I have a similar question: when in the history of religion did the notion that there _were_ no other gods arise? ---
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/3 "2004-03-29T21:48:18Z")
Except that’s not the First Commandment. The First Commandment is thus: > [@](#): > > Obey what I command you today. I will drive out before you the Amorites, Canaanites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites. Be careful not to make a treaty with those who live in the land where you are going, or they will be a snare among you. ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/4 "2004-03-29T22:17:22Z")
Judaism has always interpreted it as a negative commadment (a “Thou shalt not…”) against believing in any other being as Divine. This includes an outright rejection of God in favor of the other being or a partnership/pantheon of God with other “deities.” Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/5 "2004-03-29T22:23:22Z")
> [@Dogface](#): > > Except that’s not the First Commandment. The First Commandment is thus: I’m presuming you are refering to the argument that Exodus 34:10-26 are the Ten Commandments. You’re certainly free to believe that, but it does not fall into traditional Jewish thought, nor (to the best of my knowledge) does it fall into the traditional thought of any Christian sect. In any event, Deuteronomy 5:18 explictly states that the contents of the tablets are the “traditional” TC. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/6 "2004-03-29T22:28:24Z")
Two more minor points with regard to Jewish tradition and the TC: Firstly, the Hebrew term for the “Ten Commandments” is _Aseres HaDibros_. As anyone familiar with Hebrew (and many who aren’t) knows, the word for “commandment” is _mitzvah_. Thus, if these were the “Ten Commandments” then they would be the _Aseres HaMitzvos_. The more proper translation of _Aseres HaDibros_ would be “The Ten Sayings.” Secondly, in Jewish tradition (and in a number of Christian sects as well) “Thou shalt have no other gods…” is the second “Commandment.” The first is the first portion of Exodus 20:2. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/7 "2004-03-29T23:05:28Z")
> [@zev\_steinhardt](#): > > I’m presuming you are refering to the argument that Exodus 34:10-26 are the Ten Commandments. You’re certainly free to believe that, but it does not fall into traditional Jewish thought, nor (to the best of my knowledge) does it fall into the traditional thought of any Christian sect. O, foo. I was yanking his chain on this one. ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/8 "2004-03-30T17:12:47Z")
> [@Dogface](#): > > O, foo. I was yanking his chain on this one. Um, OK. I guess you could argue the first commandment is “Let there be light!” But I chose to follow an age old convention that says the **F** irst **C** ommandment is the one that prohibitis polytheism – or _does_ it? Eh. Apparently I’m the only who sees wiggle room there. Maybe I should start my own heresy. [quote=zev\_steinhardt] Secondly, in Jewish tradition (and in a number of Christian sects as well) “Thou shalt have no other gods…” is the second “Commandment.” The first is the first portion of Exodus 20:2.[/zev\_steinhardt]Now that’s interesting. I found a Web page that discusses some of the differences among traditions. Although the site’s creator is a Catholic, he prefers the Jewish version. [http://www.cin.org/users/james/files/numberng.htm](http://www.cin.org/users/james/files/numberng.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Aldebaran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Aldebaran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aldebaran)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/9 "2004-03-30T19:30:40Z")
What I recall as the First commandment in the religion of my (atholic) mother is: In French: **Tu n’auras pas d’autre Dieu que moi.** Translation: You shall have no other God then Me. In Flemish : **Bovenal bemin Eén God** = Above all love One God or in an even clearer Flemish version: **Gij zult geen afgoden vereren maar Mij alleen aanbidden en boven alles beminnen** = You shall not worship idols but only adore and love Me above all. Salaam. A ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/10 "2004-03-30T19:59:31Z")
> [@Aldebaran](#): > > What I recall as the First commandment in the religion of my (atholic) mother is: > > In French: **Tu n’auras pas d’autre Dieu que moi.** > > Translation: You shall have no other God then Me. > > In Flemish : **Bovenal bemin Eén God** > > = Above all love One God > > or in an even clearer Flemish version: > > **Gij zult geen afgoden vereren maar Mij alleen aanbidden en boven alles beminnen** > > = You shall not worship idols but only adore and love Me above all. > > Salaam. A oops, should have looked like this: and in Martian =kjhkmj kjehf ksdwkiur khfwjyr hjkihyudlw sheesh, the posters are clearly talking about English translations… A. Salaami ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/11 "2004-03-30T20:55:11Z")
Since I don’t happen to believe God spoke to Moses in English, I think it’s interesting that all the translations Aldebaran offered are less (IMHO) ambiguous than the familiar (to me) English version. But the question remains: Is the ambiguity (a) all in my head, (b) the result of a poor translation, © an artifact of a shift in meaning in certain English words, or (d) something that appears in the original text but has been glossed over in subsequent translations? ---
**Author:** ![flight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbce88/32.png) [@flight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flight)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/12 "2004-03-30T21:03:49Z")
It seems from my reading of the bible (granted a while ago) that they never say that no other Gods exits, but that Jehovah is better and worshiping him means you can worship no other. Take, for example, Moses and the Pharoah. When one of the Pharoah’s men turns a rod into a serpent to show the power of his god, Moses turns his staff into a serpent that eats the other one showing the greater power of his god (as I recall it). It seems that the denial of even the existence of other gods is more recent, but I could be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/13 "2004-03-30T21:13:45Z")
> [@flight](#): > > It seems from my reading of the bible (granted a while ago) that they never say that no other Gods exits, but that Jehovah is better and worshiping him means you can worship no other. Dueteronomy 5:35 & 5:39 would seem to contradict that. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/14 "2004-03-30T21:27:48Z")
> [@zev\_steinhardt](#): > > Dueteronomy 5:35 & 5:39 would seem to contradict that. > > Zev Steinhardt Not to be an ass, but just curious. The version of Deuteronomy that I have stops at 5:33 > [@](#): > > (33) Ye shall walk in all the ways which the LORD your God hath commanded you, that ye may live, and [that it may be] well with you, and [that] ye may prolong [your] days in the land which ye shall possess. Am I missing several chapters? (I probably am just stupid, but it is an honest question) ---
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/15 "2004-03-30T21:27:54Z")
> [@askeptic](#): > > oops, should have looked like this: > > and in Martian =kjhkmj kjehf ksdwkiur khfwjyr hjkihyudlw > > sheesh, the posters are clearly talking about English translations… I will presume you are intentionally pretending to be remarkably obtuse in an attempt a humor. That the discussion began with English translation in no way means that the English translation is the sole possible source of authoritative interpretation–that’s just daffy. Any worthwhile exegetic study must refer to a broad range of materials, and one way to elucidate the intended meaning of an original language passage is to see how it was translated in a variety of languages, ESPECIALLY if we are talking about English translations of Scripture, which have long had problems with being overly-tied to word-for-word renderings that do not necessarily reflect idiomatic meaning. ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/16 "2004-03-30T21:43:33Z")
> [@askeptic](#): > > The version of Deuteronomy that I have stops at 5:33 I’m sorry. My fault. That should be Dueteronomy 4, not 5. (where’s the “smack” smilie when you need it?) Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/17 "2004-03-30T21:47:32Z")
> [@Dogface](#): > > I will presume you are intentionally pretending to be remarkably obtuse in an attempt a humor. That the discussion began with English translation in no way means that the English translation is the sole possible source of authoritative interpretation–that’s just daffy. Any worthwhile exegetic study must refer to a broad range of materials, and one way to elucidate the intended meaning of an original language passage is to see how it was translated in a variety of languages, ESPECIALLY if we are talking about English translations of Scripture, which have long had problems with being overly-tied to word-for-word renderings that do not necessarily reflect idiomatic meaning. Well \*\*Dogface \*\* while I am often obtuse, I am never intentionally obtuse. I was not aware that this was a discussion of actual interpretation of the Bible. Even if it were I seriously doubt that **Aldeberan’s** comments would have been relevant. What possible relavence can a Flemmish translation have? Or French? If one wishes to discuss actual literacy of the scripture it seems that one should discuss aromaic [I know, SP] or even early Greek, but certainly not flemmish or french, since they are both just translations as well. I was attempting to make fun of **Aldeberan’s** apparent habit of hit and run, alleged ability to speak 15 languages. ---
**Author:** ![Aldebaran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Aldebaran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aldebaran)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/18 "2004-03-30T22:17:14Z")
**askeptic** , I don’t know… But I have some idea that you think you contribute something that needs to be seen as valuable to this discussion. I apologize for not detecting it … Really. But maybe I have a bit of sand in my eyes. Salaam. A ---
**Author:** ![Aldebaran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Aldebaran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aldebaran)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/19 "2004-03-30T22:22:57Z")
Oh, forgot to ask: If you can not read the OP, then why do you try to interprete it? Or in case you can read it, then why can’t you inteprete it? To help you a bit I shall give a hint: The title alone makes it clear enough what the OP wants to discuss. I don’t see there: What did He say…in English. I don’t detect that intention in the Op itself either. But maybe you have an other reading. Salaam. A ---
**Author:** ![EvilHamsterOnCrack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ab097/32.png) [@EvilHamsterOnCrack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EvilHamsterOnCrack)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161/20 "2004-03-30T22:32:22Z")
Well, this is funny as just today I was in a class at school debating this very issue. Needless to say, I have my sources with me. The issue isn’t only what’s on the first commandment, but whats on the ones following it, assuming you aren’t including everything in the first one. In the Bible itself, it doesn’t actually reference the 10 commandments by name, or even say that there are 10 at all! For all we know, there could be 14, or 9, or anything you make of it. As such, most cultures believe in different versions. I compiled a few for you right here, make of it what you will: > [@](#): > > _Protestant version_ > > 1. Thou shalt have no other gods before > me. > 2. Thou shalt not make unto thee any > graven image, or any likeness of any > thing that is in heaven above, or that > is in the earth beneath, or that is in > the water under the earth: Thou shalt > not bow down thyself to them, nor > serve them: for I the Lord thy God am > a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of > the fathers upon the children unto the > third and fourth generation of them > that hate me; And showing mercy > unto thousands of them that love me, > and keep my commandments. > 3. Thou shalt not take the name of the > Lord thy God in vain: for the Lord will > not hold him guiltless that taketh his > name in vain. > [@](#): > > _Catholic Version_ > > 1. I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt > not have strange gods before me. > 2. Thou shalt not take the name of the > Lord thy God in vain. > 3. Remember thou keep the Sabbath > Day.\* > [@](#): > > _Jewish (accepted by most) Version_ > > 1. I am the Lord thy God, who brought > thee out of the land of Egypt, out of > the house of slavery. > 2. Thou shalt have no other gods before > Me. Thou shalt not make unto > thee a graven image, nor any manner > of likeness, of any thing that is in heaven > above, or that is in the earth beneath, > or that is in the water under the > earth; Thou shalt not bow down unto > them, nor serve them; for I the Lord > thy God am a jealous God, visiting the > iniquity of the fathers upon the children > unto the third and fourth generation > of them that hate Me; And > showing mercy unto the thousandth > generation of them that love Me and > keep My commandments. > 3. Thou shalt not take the name of the > Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will > not hold him guiltless that taketh His > name in vain. So now you see where the difficulties exist. According to my opinion the catholic version is edited as such in order to allow the idea of “The Trinity” to exist, which seems like some form of polytheism. Make of this what you will. 🙂 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-first-commandment-what-did-he-say/237161.md?page=2)