# The Flash S02E11: The Return of the Reverse Flash **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 27, 2016, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354 "2016-01-27T07:55:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2016, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/1 "2016-01-27T07:55:17Z")
Lots of rather unconnected plot developments in this one: 1. Oooh! Cisco finally got his shades! Now he just needs a [cool costume](http://st3.speedforce.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/vibe-surprise.jpg) and he can go full-on Vibe. OK, maybe not that particular costume but something [more contemporary](http://static.srcdn.com/slir/w786-h393-q90-c786:393/wp-content/uploads/Vibe-New-52-The-Flash-TV-Show-Cisco.jpg). 2. Unless you’re aware of his destiny, the whole Wally West drama seems like an irrelevant side show. It’s odd, though, that he doesn’t want to see his dying mother when his professed reason for illegal street racing was to raise money for her care. 3. I really hope we see Patty again. Maybe after she completes her forensic training? 4. I guess this episode explains why future Barry stopped then-present Barry the past-future Eobard (future past-Eobard?) from preventing his mother’s murder. Doesn’t explain why Gideon seems to have disappeared after last season, though maybe it’s the reason why they haven’t acted on any knowledge gleaned from her. 5. Lastly, Hunter Zolomon?!?!?! ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2016, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/2 "2016-01-27T20:46:59Z")
1. Let’s hope neither of those costumes makes it to the small screen. 2. I don’t think its odd. Hospitals are really depressing, and watching a loved one dying even more so. Wally cares for his mom, but he doesn’t want his memories of her tainted by watching her die. Other than that, it is just another standard CW plot until…well, you know. 3. I’m ambivalent. And Barry is stupid…again. That had set-up written all over it and he still fell for it. Secret identities drive me crazy, and do so twice as much on TV series and movies as in the comics. Everyone and their cousin knows Barry Allen is the Flash on the series, but he won’t tell Patty. Either keep your identity secret from EVERYBODY (see George Reeves Superman) or don’t bother at all (Captain America, Iron Man, Fantastic Four). At least Tobey Maguire’s Spider-man tried, for the most part, to keep his identity secret. 4. Huh? Gah, time travel makes my head hurt! 5. (don’t click the link if you don’t want to be spoiled) - [Hunter Zolomon](http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Hunter_Zolomon_(New_Earth))!They really need to stop using super-speed villians. Not the best episode, not the worst. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2016, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/3 "2016-01-27T21:54:57Z")
The very first villain faced by modern Flash has yet to appear. (The Mirror Master.) ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2016, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/4 "2016-01-27T22:07:19Z")
So if I understand correctly, this Thawn didn’t get erased from history because he happened to be in the Speed force travelling through time the moment the Cop Thawne killed himself. He emerges in the present, has the interaction we see and then goes back to his “present” to begin the chain of events that lead to his erasure from history. That kind of makes sense in a comic booky way. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2016, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/5 "2016-01-27T22:24:36Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > So if I understand correctly, this Thawn didn’t get erased from history because he happened to be in the Speed force travelling through time the moment the Cop Thawne killed himself. He emerges in the present, has the interaction we see and then goes back to his “present” to begin the chain of events that lead to his erasure from history. And that, obviously, results in a nosebleed. In one character. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/6 "2016-01-28T01:22:28Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > The very first villain faced by modern Flash has yet to appear. (The Mirror Master.) Didn’t he debut after Mister Element/Doctor Alchemy? Or am I misunderstanding you? ---
**Author:** ![BrianJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/54ee81/32.png) [@BrianJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrianJ)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2016, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/7 "2016-01-30T03:24:59Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > 1. Let’s hope neither of those costumes makes it to the small screen. > > 2. I don’t think its odd. Hospitals are really depressing, and watching a loved one dying even more so. Wally cares for his mom, but he doesn’t want his memories of her tainted by watching her die. Other than that, it is just another standard CW plot until…well, you know. > > 3. I’m ambivalent. And Barry is stupid…again. That had set-up written all over it and he still fell for it. Secret identities drive me crazy, and do so twice as much on TV series and movies as in the comics. Everyone and their cousin knows Barry Allen is the Flash on the series, but he won’t tell Patty. Either keep your identity secret from EVERYBODY (see George Reeves Superman) or don’t bother at all (Captain America, Iron Man, Fantastic Four). At least Tobey Maguire’s Spider-man tried, for the most part, to keep his identity secret. > > 4. Huh? Gah, time travel makes my head hurt! > > 5. (don’t click the link if you don’t want to be spoiled) - [Hunter Zolomon](http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Hunter_Zolomon_(New_Earth))! > Not the best episode, not the worst. Who was Hunter Zolomon on the show? I don’t remember that name ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2016, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/8 "2016-01-30T04:04:17Z")
> [@BrianJ](#): > > Who was Hunter Zolomon on the show? I don’t remember that name The adopted name of the Jay Garrick of this world. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2016, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/9 "2016-01-30T04:41:41Z")
I still don’t give a shit about Iris. She seems to be completely unnecessary. On the other hand I really like Patty, so it’s a bugger that she’s leaving just because Barry hasn’t learned the lesson of keeping secrets from his friends and family is a really stupid idea that never solves anything. In conclusion, I wish Iris was gone and Patty was back. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2016, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/10 "2016-01-30T12:56:09Z")
By the way, one of the more ridiculous moments of this episode was when Caitlin asked Jay about his missing doppleganger. “Meet me tomorrow,” he responded, “I can’t tell you - you have to see for yourself.” _Tomorrow_ “That guy over there is me and he has a different name.” WHY exactly couldn’t he just tell her that to begin with? ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2016, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/11 "2016-01-30T17:01:07Z")
I know that other speedsters are a big part of the Flash comic books, but I have to wonder if they have introduced too many, too quickly on the show. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2016, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/12 "2016-01-31T09:53:11Z")
While there are indeed a number of speedsters, I think the writers have done a good job of keeping the non-Barry speedsters out of the picture. We really haven’t seen a lot of Zoom. Jay Garrick lost his speed. Reverse Flash got sent back to the future in the same episode he re-appeared. We don’t even know if Wally West is going to get fast this season, let alone Jesse Quick. Of course, they could all be speeding around by the season finale. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2016, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/13 "2016-01-31T12:34:50Z")
I saw a blurb that they are adding at least one more, a woman Speedster. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2016, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/14 "2016-01-31T14:41:16Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > I saw a blurb that they are adding at least one more, a woman Speedster. That’ll be Wells’s daughter, Jesse, aka Jesse Quick in the comics. ---
**Author:** ![Dendarii\_Dame](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbce88/32.png) [@Dendarii\_Dame](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dendarii_Dame)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2016, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/15 "2016-01-31T21:57:45Z")
This episode was kind of “meh” for me. These people have got to stop gloating. As a wise man once said, “It’s tacky.” Somebody should call them on it. On the other hand, the banter between Harry and Cisco is great. ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2016, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/16 "2016-01-31T22:13:11Z")
> [@Terminus\_Est](#): > > 1. I really hope we see Patty again. Maybe after she completes her forensic training? That whole Patty thing puzzles me. When she tells Barry that she got accepted to the forensics school, it’s apparent that this is the first time she’s told him about this interest of hers… which also happens to be what Barry does for a living! Seems like something that might come up on a first date, or even before: “So, you’re a forensic expert. It was always my dream to go into forensics, but I became a cop instead.” It just seems really odd to me, and it was an intentional choice by the writers to have her leave to go study forensics, so I have to hope there is some purpose there. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/17 "2016-02-01T00:11:12Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > That’ll be Wells’s daughter, Jesse, aka Jesse Quick in the comics. No, actually it’s [Trajectory](http://www.cinemablend.com/television/Flash-Just-Cast-Its-First-Female-Speedster-114017.html). ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/18 "2016-02-01T05:07:05Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > That whole Patty thing puzzles me. When she tells Barry that she got accepted to the forensics school, it’s apparent that this is the first time she’s told him about this interest of hers… which also happens to be what Barry does for a living! Seems like something that might come up on a first date, or even before: “So, you’re a forensic expert. It was always my dream to go into forensics, but I became a cop instead.” It just seems really odd to me, and it was an intentional choice by the writers to have her leave to go study forensics, so I have to hope there is some purpose there. She did mention loving forensics when she first met Barry in S02E02: [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BaK-weSiz64&t=59s) > [@](#): > > Barry: You should have gone into CSI work. > Patty: I love the science, but out here is where all the action is. [As we learn later, she had an ulterior motive for foregoing CSI.] Earlier in the clip, she also mentions having read Barry’s forensic reports - all of Barry’s forensic reports - with great interest. The writers apparently set up Barry and Patty’s arc right from the beginning of the season. ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/19 "2016-02-01T05:10:03Z")
Ah, good catch–I didn’t remember that. ---
**Author:** ![BrianJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/54ee81/32.png) [@BrianJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrianJ)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354/20 "2016-02-01T10:48:29Z")
Never mind, misread [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-flash-s02e11-the-return-of-the-reverse-flash/744354.md?page=2)