# The food bank problem: Your solutions **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 4, 2008, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715 "2008-12-04T19:19:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/81 "2008-12-09T11:09:07Z")
> [@Carol\_Stream](#): > > I think the 37,000 figure you found “oniline” may have been exagerated just a bit. From your link in this post, the population of McHenry county was 312,373, while the % of people living below the povery line was 4.5% (both figures as of 2006). That would be roughly 14,000 people below the poverty line. It seems unlikely then that 37,000 people would need to use a food bank. The census figures are a couple years old. I’m pretty sure the 37,000 are current numbers and reflect the current economic situation. ---
**Author:** ![norinew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb9ed0/32.png) [@norinew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/norinew)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/82 "2008-12-09T11:48:14Z")
> [@Sleeps\_With\_Butterflies](#): > > So you’re using this program to stretch your family’s food budget? A week or so ago you told us all that you spend a couple of hundred dollars a month on booze. > > I mean, if you can spend that much money on booze in a month, isn’t it a little like taking the Angel Food’s resources away from people who use it because they actually don’t **have** any extra money for non-essentials like booze, let alone a couple of hundred dollars a month? No, I’m not taking resources away from anyone. As I think I said, there are _no_ qualifications for this program. In fact, what it really is, when it comes right down to the base, is a huge food co-op. In that sense, the _more_ members they have, the more they can do, because it gives them _more_ buying power. I don’t use this program because I _can’t_ afford to buy food for my family (though I’ve been in that position, it was some years ago), I use the program because it’s there for anyone and everyone, and when I stretch the grocery budget we can afford to do more of other stuff. > [@Broomstick](#): > > How heavy is the religious propaganda that comes with it? Is it just a single Bible tract or a note identifying the church, or would I be assaulted by hordes of missionaries insisting I and my husband haul ourselves out of bed multiple times per week to go to their church? This may sound petty, but the last time I was depending on food pantries to eat regularly it was a really big problem, to the extent some churches wouldn’t help you unless you became a member of their church, attended services, had their people trooping through your home, and generally being intrusive bastards. Others, of course, didn’t care, they really did just want to help out folks in trouble and they were very, very cool people. Not heavy at all, IME (though I only deal with one local church). Every month when I go to pick up my order, there is a religious-themed magazine in my box, along with the following month’s menu. One time the guy who was helping me carry stuff out to my car invited me to come to the Sunday service, I just smiled and said “no, thanks”, and nothing more was said of it. If you look at the website, not all of their distribution centers are churches (though most are). ---
**Author:** ![Cub\_Mistress](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea666f/32.png) [@Cub\_Mistress](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cub_Mistress)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/83 "2008-12-09T12:31:31Z")
I ran a local food pantry for about 20 years in a small, rural, poor county. Luckily, I was able to build it up and put away some cash resources for a rainy day, because yes, that rainy day has arrived. Donations are down, but they are not out for the count. One current effort involves a pottery class that has made bowls in which they are serving a chili supper. $5 gets you the chili, $3 bucks more and you get the handmade bowl to take home. That’s a constant reminder of how you helped others and promotes a warm, fuzzy feeling. Win-win IME, the problem with most appeals is that the message is "we need your help to survive(as an organization)’ when it should be “look what we are able to do, we help people, would you like to help us do that?” I have found that the second statement is much more effective in getting cash donations. That being said, I also found that more people are likely to reach into the cabinet for a few cans than to reach for their wallet and pull out a five. Door to door food drives by the Boy Scouts (Scouting for Food) and the rural mail carriers food drive (in May) have yielded literally tons of cans and boxes of food in my county. Some years it has been so much food that we had to scramble to find storage places. I have had long weary meetings with volunteers and board members of the issues of quality of food and the deserving poor. Yes, some people do make poor choices with their money and their lives, but I can’t fix that. I can, however, feed them today. Many of my clientele are working poor, those for whom missing a week of work or a $300 car repair is financially devastating. Someone who lost their job 2 months ago still has a 3 year old car that is nicer than the volunteer’s? So what? Did you expect him to sell the car? The one he needs to go on job interviews and to get to work in when he does find a job? :rolleyes: Yes, it’s cheaper to make meals from scratch, but you just can’t hand somebody 10 pounds of cornmeal and 5 pounds of pinto beans and say “Go, and be poor no more.” It’s just not realistic. People in America don’t eat like that anymore. We do give flour and cornmeal and dried beans, but it’s as part of the food package, not the whole thing. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/84 "2008-12-09T12:46:02Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > If I recall, you can make up to 120% of the poverty line income and still qualify for food stamps - are you assuming that you _must_ be under “poverty line” to need food assistance? Because you don’t - you can be over that line and still need help. And food shelves are self reporting about these things. I’ve known of people (on this board) who have admitted to using food shelves to cover income gaps - though they are relatively well off. If you are 200% above the poverty line, but the mortgage payment, car payment and credit card bills leave you with little left over, you might turn to the food shelf - particularly at this time of year when gifts need to go under the tree. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/85 "2008-12-09T13:01:42Z")
> [@Cub\_Mistress](#): > > I > > I have had long weary meetings with volunteers and board members of the issues of quality of food and the deserving poor. Yes, some people do make poor choices with their money and their lives, but I can’t fix that. I can, however, feed them today. Many of my clientele are working poor, those for whom missing a week of work or a $300 car repair is financially devastating. Someone who lost their job 2 months ago still has a 3 year old car that is nicer than the volunteer’s? So what? Did you expect him to sell the car? The one he needs to go on job interviews and to get to work in when he does find a job? :rolleyes: Yes, it’s cheaper to make meals from scratch, but you just can’t hand somebody 10 pounds of cornmeal and 5 pounds of pinto beans and say “Go, and be poor no more.” It’s just not realistic. People in America don’t eat like that anymore. We do give flour and cornmeal and dried beans, but it’s as part of the food package, not the whole thing. This is good work and obviously it’s necessary for some people on an ongoing basis. I agree that “temporarily down and out” people get a bad rap when they take advantage once or twice in a year due to layoffs, illness, or whatever reason. Hunger is hunger. Children need to eat. I don’t think anyone who complains about this has ever had to face a temporary setback. You don’t need to go on food stamps, but you have no food RIGHT NOW and need to feed your kids. That’s not a situation I wish on anyone, but if it happens, a food pantry can fill the gap and tide you over until you can get your bearings again. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/86 "2008-12-09T15:31:55Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > If I recall, you can make up to 120% of the poverty line income and still qualify for food stamps - are you assuming that you _must_ be under “poverty line” to need food assistance? Because you don’t - you can be over that line and still need help. The food pantry I’m talking about has a 200% of the poverty line cutoff. In this county, that covers the majority of residents, but there are only 30000 people in the county to start with. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_Stream](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@Carol\_Stream](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_Stream)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/87 "2008-12-10T02:51:16Z")
> [@Kalhoun](#): > > The census figures are a couple years old. I’m pretty sure the 37,000 are current numbers and reflect the current economic situation. The poverty rate, even at 130% above, went up more than double in only two years? Again, that sounds unlikely. Do you have a cite? For that matter, do you have a cite for the 37,000 number you referenced in post #34? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/88 "2008-12-10T03:02:43Z")
Kalhoun misread the stats, I think. The Northern Illinois Food Bank says they serve over 37,000 people each week. However, the NIFB covers 13 counties. (Cite [here](http://www.northernilfoodbank.org/menu-side-aboutus.asp).) ---
**Author:** ![code\_grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@code\_grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/code_grey)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/89 "2008-12-10T04:56:02Z")
economics says, if we don’t have money for standard good, we buy substitution good. That is, if you cannot feed the hungry with bread and meat, how about buying rice and potatoes in bulk? If rice is too expensive, how about buying corn? If corn is too expensive, how about buying feed corn and milling it yourself? This is like the whole “affordable housing” run around. If you insist on high standards, it wouldn’t be affordable. But people can do with low standards too, much better than with nothing at all. Just ask a typical homeless if by any chance he would prefer living with 5 roommates in a single warm room with decent plumbing. Meanwhile when the do-gooders require that everybody have his very own personal room we end up with tent cities. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_Stream](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@Carol\_Stream](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_Stream)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/90 "2008-12-10T05:12:03Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Kalhoun misread the stats, I think. The Northern Illinois Food Bank says they serve over 37,000 people each week. However, the NIFB covers 13 counties. (Cite [here](http://www.northernilfoodbank.org/menu-side-aboutus.asp).) I think so too, which is why I am hoping **Kalhoun** can clarify. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/91 "2008-12-10T12:59:56Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Kalhoun misread the stats, I think. The Northern Illinois Food Bank says they serve over 37,000 people each week. However, the NIFB covers 13 counties. (Cite [here](http://www.northernilfoodbank.org/menu-side-aboutus.asp).) I see that I did misread this. The locations listed in the area of the site I looked at are all in McHenry County, but showed that figure on the same page, which is what confused me. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/92 "2008-12-10T17:48:45Z")
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > As part of a solution to the current problems, I wonder if people could be convinced to donate money rather than goods? > > Presumably, there are people who are donating, just not enough. Maybe if some of those donations could be shifted to cash, it would help. I see barrels of food at the grocery store for donations, and there’s currently one in the lobby of my office building, too. But I also know that my buying a can of tuna at the grocery store is just about the least efficient way of donating food to the hungry. I’d much better off giving the food bank a dollar and letting them pool it with others to buy a whole flat of something at a much better than retail price, and save paying the guy who has to drive around to pick up the canned food in those barrels, too. > > Maybe some advertising to get people to rethink their donation and make one of money rather than canned goods would help. What I’ve heard is that the central (for us, state) food banks can leverage a lot more out of cash than the consumer can, and they distribute what they buy across the state. However, at the very local level, those food banks don’t have the leverage and it’s just as good for individuals to pay for goods as give money. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/93 "2008-12-10T18:40:16Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > What I’ve heard is that the central (for us, state) food banks can leverage a lot more out of cash than the consumer can, and they distribute what they buy across the state. However, at the very local level, those food banks don’t have the leverage and it’s just as good for individuals to pay for goods as give money. The Greater Chicago Food Depository has a virtual food drive that shows the retail cost of food vs. the buying power they leverage when they buy it: [http://www.chicagosfoodbank.org/site/PageServer?pagename=diff\_food\_vfd](http://www.chicagosfoodbank.org/site/PageServer?pagename=diff_food_vfd) I like this approach. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/94 "2008-12-10T18:52:20Z")
> [@code\_grey](#): > > If you insist on high standards, it wouldn’t be affordable. But people can do with low standards too, much better than with nothing at all. Just ask a typical homeless if by any chance he would prefer living with 5 roommates in a single warm room with decent plumbing. Meanwhile when the do-gooders require that everybody have his very own personal room we end up with tent cities. Who are you talking to/about? ---
**Author:** ![Cub\_Mistress](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea666f/32.png) [@Cub\_Mistress](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cub_Mistress)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/95 "2008-12-10T18:58:30Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > What I’ve heard is that the central (for us, state) food banks can leverage a lot more out of cash than the consumer can, and they distribute what they buy across the state. However, at the very local level, those food banks don’t have the leverage and it’s just as good for individuals to pay for goods as give money. This is true, however, in a face-to-face appeal, more people would rather give a few cans than cash, IME. I think it has something to do with the fact that the food is already paid for but cash, is well, _cash._ ---
**Author:** ![code\_grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@code\_grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/code_grey)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/96 "2008-12-10T20:48:04Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Who are you talking to/about? there exist zoning regulations that prevent businesses and/or nonprofits from offering cheaper housing by cramming more people into the same house (what was once called flophouse [Flophouse - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flophouse) ). Today that’s illegal in America and that’s why we have millions of homeless (in China it’s legal, so fewer homeless there) I am using this as analogy to illustrate my suggestion about food. If you cannot afford expensive food, buy cheapest food possible, as long as it is nutritive and will keep people from starving. Fortunately, there are no zoning regulations about what people may and may not eat. Like I said: That is, if you cannot feed the hungry with bread and meat, how about buying rice and potatoes in bulk? If rice is too expensive, how about buying corn? If corn is too expensive, how about buying feed corn and milling it yourself? Any further clarification needed? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/97 "2008-12-10T20:59:13Z")
> [@code\_grey](#): > > I am using this as analogy to illustrate my suggestion about food. If you cannot afford expensive food, buy cheapest food possible, as long as it is nutritive and will keep people from starving. Fortunately, there are no zoning regulations about what people may and may not eat. > > Like I said: > That is, if you cannot feed the hungry with bread and meat, how about buying rice and potatoes in bulk? If rice is too expensive, how about buying corn? If corn is too expensive, how about buying feed corn and milling it yourself? > > Any further clarification needed? I was trying to figure out how you thought your comment was responsive to the discussion–if you thought someone was complaining about the inability to get expensive food from a food bank. I’m still unsure if you felt you were addressing anyone in particular. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Controvert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dec6dc/32.png) [@The\_Controvert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Controvert)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/98 "2008-12-11T18:24:54Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > The question is theoretical, not practical. In times of plenty, people have money to give, but fewer people need charity. In times of want, more people need charity but people have less to give. The answer is the same as in the time of Joseph, store food for the lean years during the fat years. This is difficult to implement since we don’t know how long the fat and skinny years will last, and food does not keep indefinetly. It would probably be good for food banks to solicit some money which can be easily stored to buy food when times get tough. The same could be said for many of the people who find themselves in need of charity food. In times of plenty, those same people likely splurged on unnecessary luxuries like fancy cars (or fancy new rims). Just as bad are decisions to pass on opportunities for financial security, believing similar opportunities will still be available in the future. A bit of foresight and simple planning ensures basic needs can always be secured. As for the OP, I noticed many inexpensive turkeys for sale in the week following Thanksgiving. From a practical standpoint, does it really make sense to feed people turkeys on Thanksgiving, when many times that number can be fed in the week following the Thanksgiving holiday? An argument could be made that needy people want to feel happier on Thanksgiving day, but that’s a rather stupid reason since it’s just as easy to make up a new occasion (a new tradition) that happens to fall on the first week of December. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/99 "2008-12-11T20:09:52Z")
What, Poor Thanksgiving Day? I believe the idea is give turkeys for Thanksgiving so people don’t feel left out, and can have a happy day like everyone else, even if it’s more expensive then. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Controvert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dec6dc/32.png) [@The\_Controvert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Controvert)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715/100 "2008-12-11T20:45:48Z")
While not letting poor people feel left out of Thanksgiving is a grand sentiment, if the food bank is having trouble supplying everyone with food as suggested by the OP, you should ask yourself how those people still waiting in line after the food is gone feel about the sentiment. Somehow, I think a full belly makes up for being called poor or being looked down upon. And perhaps it would motivate them to work harder to lift themselves out of their financial situation so they can have a regular Thanksgiving next year, if that is so important to them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-food-bank-problem-your-solutions/475715.md?page=6)