# The Galveston City Government: What Fuckups!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 13, 2008, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438 "2008-09-13T14:38:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/41 "2008-09-14T05:09:07Z")
Like I said in another thread, when blues singers talk about how crappy your weather can be, LEAVE when the authorities tell you to! Reference: “When the Levee Breaks” (Kansas Joe McCoy and Memphis Minnie), about the 1927 Mississippi Flood, and “Wasn’t That a Mighty Storm” (Traditional), about the 1900 flooding of Galveston that killed between 6000 and 12,000 people. I quoted a few lines in another thread, but it’s fallen out of copyright: [Chorus:] Wasn’t that a mighty storm Wasn’t that a mighty storm in the morning, well Wasn’t that a mighty storm That blew all the people all away You know the year of 1900 Children, many years ago Death came howling on the ocean Death calls, you got to go Now Galveston had a seawall To keep the water down, and a High tide from the ocean Spread the water over the town [Chorus] You know the trumpets give them warning You’d better leave this place Now, no one thought of leaving 'til death stared them in the face And the trains they all were loaded The people were all leaving town The trestle gave way to the water And the trains they went on down [Chorus] Rain it was a’ falling Thunder began to roll Lightning flashed like hell fire The wind began to blow Death the cruel master When the wind began to blow Rode in on a team of horses T cried, “Death, won’t you let me go”. [Chorus] Hey, now trees fell on the island And the houses give away Some they strained and drowned Some died in most every way And the sea began to rolling And the ships they could not stand And I heard a captain crying “God save a drowning man”. [Chorus] Death your hands are clammy You got me on my knee You come and took my mother Won’t you come back after me And the flood it took my neighbor Took my brother too I thought I heard my father calling And I watched my mother go [Chorus] You know the year of 1900 Children, many years ago Death came howling on the ocean Death calls, you got to go [Chorus 2x] ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/42 "2008-09-14T17:46:09Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Reference: “When the Levee Breaks” (Kansas Joe McCoy and Memphis Minnie) Hey, Led Zeppelin has a song by that name. Led Zep wouldn’t . . . ? Nah . . . 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![photopat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e95f7d/32.png) [@photopat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/photopat)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/43 "2008-09-14T18:10:55Z")
I have compassion for those who want to leave and are having trouble doing so, (infirm, homeless, locked in jail). I have zero compassion for idiots like the one on the news this morning who was standing on the seawall waving an American flag at the storm like it was an invading enemy. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/44 "2008-09-14T18:53:43Z")
Lou Dobbs was quick to point out that both Katrina and Ike made their entry across the Gulf of _ **Mexico** _… ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/45 "2008-09-14T19:00:02Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > …Because black people can read minds? Speaking as a black person, I can attest that I, at least, lack telepathic abilities. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/46 "2008-09-14T19:57:00Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Speaking as a black person, I can attest that I, at least, lack telepathic abilities. But can you give help to a small white boy with telepathic abilities? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/47 "2008-09-14T20:00:04Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > But can you give help to a small white boy with telepathic abilities? :: checks self :: Sorry, still evil. Any small white boys with telepathic abilities I happen to come across with either be (a) exploited for use in my schemes to conquer the United States, (b) exploited in my schemes to conquer the Earth, or (c) exploited in my schemes to conquer the Galaxy. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/48 "2008-09-14T20:26:13Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Speaking as a black person, I can attest that I, at least, lack telepathic abilities. Drinking coffee under a tent makes those abilities flourish. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/49 "2008-09-14T20:31:59Z")
> [@Sapo](#): > > Drinking coffee under a tent makes those abilities flourish. Thus proving you don’t know me in the real world. I drink so much coffee that, were it involved in the generation of psionic powers, I would long since have gone mad with power and had to be taken down by other X-Men. ---
**Author:** ![fisha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@fisha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fisha)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/50 "2008-09-14T20:43:43Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Speaking as a black person, I can attest that I, at least, lack telepathic abilities. That’s what they all say. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/51 "2008-09-14T20:45:48Z")
> [@vinyl turnip](#): > > lou dobbs was quick to point out that both katrina and ike made their entry across the gulf of _ **mexico** _… Never mind… WTF happened to my smilies? ---
**Author:** ![Clovernook](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ec9cab/32.png) [@Clovernook](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clovernook)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/52 "2008-09-14T22:12:52Z")
> [@](#): > > Clovernook, I hear Clear Lake was mostly OK, hope things are alright for you. We haven’t left San Antonio to return yet but reports from our neighbors is that our area (Taylor Lake Village) made it through with some tree damage but no major structural problems. Thanks for the kind thoughts. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/53 "2008-09-14T22:58:08Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > [In a city that knows what hurricanes can do, many Galveston citizens did not evacuate.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/13/AR2008091300843.html?hpid=topnews) > > That’s a much higher percentage than stayed in New Orleans during Katrina, by all accounts. > > JFTR, I’m not actually Pitting the Galveston city manager. Why the fuck not? She has primary responsibility. Oh, quelle surprise! She’s a DEMOCRAT! [http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:d-3aEotNFg0J:www.galvestoncountydemocraticparty.com/newsletter\_downloads/GCDP-Newsletter-June-2006\_PRINT.pdf%3FPHPSESSID%3D6c108b08eb077e774622a3c29d37f94f+Lyda+Ann+Thomas+party&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us&client=firefox-a](http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:d-3aEotNFg0J:www.galvestoncountydemocraticparty.com/newsletter_downloads/GCDP-Newsletter-June-2006_PRINT.pdf%3FPHPSESSID%3D6c108b08eb077e774622a3c29d37f94f+Lyda+Ann+Thomas+party&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us&client=firefox-a) > [@](#): > > I’m Pitting the GOP apologists who blamed the loss of life in NOLA during and after Katrina on Mayor Nagin’s having failed to evacuate everyone. Some of 'em [still do](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10165627&postcount=96). But since there’s no evidence that the evacuation of NOLA was less thorough than that of other cities similarly threatened - and now, here we’ve got a VERY similar case where the evacuation rate apparently was a good deal worse - maybe it’s time to bury that bit of bullshit for good. Just another stick to beat up the GOP. Draws attention away from blaming those actually responsible like, you know, DEMOCRATS. Some of it is definitely not bullshit. What turned non-Democrats against Nagin was the fact that he angrily blamed the entire rest of the US for not helping him **immediately** when he actually had over 100 buses available. Add to that that the fair and balanced BBC described him as “genuinely heroic”. [BBC NEWS | Americas | Viewpoint: New Orleans crisis shames US](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4210674.stm). What a fucking joke. Face it, Nagin fucked up big time. And so did the then Democrat LA governor. So fuck you, you partisan, lying piece of crap. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2008, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/54 "2008-09-15T02:27:01Z")
So idiots refuse to evacuate, and instead of blaming the idiots, you blame the Galveston City Government that advised them to evacuate? Methinks you need another drink. ---
**Author:** ![meara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@meara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/meara)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2008, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/55 "2008-09-15T02:49:33Z")
I actually have compassion even for the folks who choose to stay. I think there are a lot of people out there who can’t comprehend losing everything and figure that they may as well go down with the ship if the unthinkable happens. Then, when the water starts rising, they realize that they screwed up and that their lives _are_ more valuable than their collection of material things. Humans do stupid things sometimes. I’ll still help pay to rescue them. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2008, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/56 "2008-09-15T03:19:24Z")
I tend to think the proof’s in the pudding. Katrina: ~1500 dead in New Orleans. Ike: 8 dead at last count, 3 from Galveston. I’d be willing to bet the total number will be under 15 for Galveston. You can’t pillory the Galveston city government for having a different attitude when the cities are very different. Galveston (at least the “City of” part) is roughly 15 feet above sea level and has a major seawall facing the gulf intended to withstand at least Category 3 storms, and has ridden out Category 3 storms in the past successfully. Alicia in particular, where the eye passed over the western part of the island, putting the city in the thick of it, comes to mind. Galveston’s only about 60,000 people also. New Orleans is a city predominantly below sea-level, hadn’t been hit by a storm in a long time. That’s what makes the difference… when you live somewhere that’s essentially a giant bowl, you have to make that extra effort to get people out. At this point post-Katrina, the city was still under water, people were dying and being rescued. Galveston, on the other hand, is probably starting to clear shit out and rebuild, because I doubt there’s any storm-surge flooding left. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2008, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/57 "2008-09-15T05:10:52Z")
> [@bump](#): > > That’s what makes the difference… when you live somewhere that’s essentially a giant bowl, you have to make that extra effort to get people out. At this point post-Katrina, the city was still under water, people were dying and being rescued. > > Galveston, on the other hand, is probably starting to clear shit out and rebuild, because I doubt there’s any storm-surge flooding left. Well… comparing the two cities is one of those apples-and-oranges things. The dangers which Galveston face from hurricane aren’t the same as the ones New Orleans faces, and vice versa. The danger in Galveston is not from long-term flooding, as you mentioned, since the drainage of the city isn’t blocked by levees. The danger lies in the surge. Now, in this case, the predicted surge did not materialize at Galveston and things were relatively O.K.; the homes had been built to a certain standard which proved to be effective protection from what they got. And yes, the seawall protects from the ocean surge; but the other end of town (west end) is lower in elevation and vulnerable to surge. Go along the coastline a bit to what they call the Bolivar Peninsula. There is a very different story there. The community called Crystal Beach has been swept almost clean. Think slabs. Or in this case, piles - sticking up like combs. It looks much the same as the Bay St. Louis-Waveland-Pass Christian area of MS did post Katrina. Obviously the surge was higher here. Building performance reports from Katrina say that if the surge/wave combination is higher than the first floor of a home, it is likely to fail. That tells me that the surge at Bolivar Pen. was higher than the pile foundations of these houses. Worst-case scenario for Galveston: Surge is greater than what Ike pushed there; people who refuse to evacuate are forced to their attics or rooftops; the ocean takes over. I mean, it would all be part of the ocean - waves would take care of anyone on a rooftop. This is probably what happened in Bolivar Pen. - people were already being rescued from rooftops on Friday, before the high surge came. Others were waiting when the search had to be halted for the storm. That could easily have been Galveston. Then you’d be seeing the high death numbers. The city is very, very lucky that the storm shifted. That is what my point is, that the City administration gambled and won - I don’t think they should have gambled. Just my HO. Here’s some Crystal Beach photos. [before](http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c47/cnc66/camera%20stuff/hurricane%20stuff/CrystalBeach1.jpg), [after](http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c47/cnc66/camera%20stuff/hurricane%20stuff/393.jpg). [before,](http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c47/cnc66/camera%20stuff/hurricane%20stuff/CyrstalBeach3before.jpg)[after](http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c47/cnc66/camera%20stuff/hurricane%20stuff/388.jpg). Incidentally I’ve heard rumor that areas around Rollover Pass are restricted to all but search & rescue - no reporters allowed in, and no aircraft flying over. It’s possible that there is destruction there which we don’t know about yet. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2008, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/58 "2008-09-15T05:44:54Z")
> [@NinetyWt](#): > > Again, they knew it was coming, and they knew that most coastal communities can hold up pretty good to a normal Cat 1 or 2. They did not know that the roads would be cut off and the winds would be up to 40mph 14 hours before the storm. They didn’t? I used to live in SW Louisiana, not near the coast, but everyone who did live near the coast was very aware of the danger of getting cut off. We used to visit a friend in Bridge City. If anyone in Galveston wasn’t aware that getting cut off wasn’t a real possibility, they were very stupid. The Weather Channel did interview one guy who stayed. The reason - he wanted to surf the next day. :rolleyes: At least he admitted that he screwed up. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2008, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/59 "2008-09-15T15:08:34Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > They didn’t? I used to live in SW Louisiana, not near the coast, but everyone who did live near the coast was very aware of the danger of getting cut off. We used to visit a friend in Bridge City. If anyone in Galveston wasn’t aware that getting cut off wasn’t a real possibility, they were very stupid. Just non-believing, I guess. It does boggle the mind, especially when you look at the landforms… an ISLAND fer cryin’ out loud. People being interviewed said things like “I just didn’t think it would get this bad”. The story is, that they didn’t get a mandatory evac until Friday a.m., and that the water was already up and it was impossible to get out. I’m halfway wanting to blame stupid residents and halfway wanting to blame stupid authorities for the lack of stern warnings. Ya know? People must be aware of their surroundings, but don’t we expect leaders to, well, lead? > [@](#): > > The Weather Channel did interview one guy who stayed. The reason - he wanted to surf the next day. :rolleyes: At least he admitted that he screwed up. I heard that the surfing was acutally great in FL due to Ike. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2008, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438/60 "2008-09-16T01:52:43Z")
> [@NinetyWt](#): > > To paraphrase someone from this afternoon, residents did not know the surge would be cutting them off (roads inundated) by Friday morning. News in the area didn’t report that; they were emphasizing the winds, that it was going to be Cat 1 or 2. The surge was not emphasized. Somewhere between the local government, the NHC and the news media the word has to get out … my opinion is that the Mayor was in disbelief and downplayed it. She wanted everything to be OK - tough call but she got it wrong. Wow, are you serious?\* Your local media did downplay it that much? Here in the Boston area, our TV weather people were hammering at how deadly this could be, not only because of the winds but also with clear explanations of storm surge and tides on top of that, and what that could do – and they were talking about it as much as two-three days before the hurricane hit. Now, maybe that was driven by sensationalism to some degree, but I had been given a very sharp picture of how bad it could be while Ike was still clearing Cuba, and while the probability paths had yet to converge on Galveston. \*Not meaning to be snarky, I really am gobsmacked. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-galveston-city-government-what-fuckups/463438.md?page=4)