# The GIVE Act (HR 1388): Expand opportunities to serve, or create Obama's Brownshirts? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 17, 2009, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741 "2009-03-17T13:12:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/1 "2009-03-17T13:12:12Z")
The right-wing blogosphere is buzzing with venom towards H.R. 1388, The GIVE Act (Generations Invigorating Volunteerism and Education Act), characterizing it as mandatory conscription into a leftist army aimed at destroying all that is good about America. But in reading [a summary of the bill](http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h111-1388&tab=summary), I don’t see anything that makes service mandatory, and it certainly doesn’t create child slavery, which is how it is being characterized in the conservative echo chamber. So what is the deal with this bill? Does it encourage volunteerism, or create a sinister cadre of Obama youth that will turn in their parents for clinging to guns and god? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/2 "2009-03-17T13:41:46Z")
It is pretty clear that the right wing simply made crap up about Obama wanting a gestapo like force of volunteers. So no, there’s nothing in this bill to threaten the Republic. Nor are there black helicopters conducting recce missions on farmhouses in Montana, nor are there secret symbols written on the back of road signs that tell the Red China Army which way to go, nor does the fact that Yosemite is a UN World Heritage Site mean that our park rangers are going to be replaced by a blue helmeted peacekeeping force. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/3 "2009-03-17T14:34:59Z")
> [@](#): > > Dorothy: Now which way do we go? > Scarecrow: Pardon me, this way is a very nice way. > Dorothy: Who said that? > [Toto barks at scarecrow] > Dorothy: Don’t be silly, Toto. Scarecrows don’t talk. > Scarecrow: [points other way] It’s pleasant down that way, too. > Dorothy: That’s funny. Wasn’t he pointing the other way? > Scarecrow: [points both ways] Of course, some people do go both ways. Just thought that since we were talking about strawmen, we should hear from one of the more famous ones. I’d be interested an an actual quote from one of the detractors of the bill, followed by the OP’s rebuttal of those claims. He has quite convincingly rebutted the claim that this bill would “create a sinister cadre of Obama youth,” but since I don’t know who made that claim, it’s not all that impressive. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/4 "2009-03-17T14:59:26Z")
Well, there is this: [H.R.1388 “The Give Act” Mein Führer Requires YOU to SERVE 3 Years](http://goptechsummit.ning.com/profiles/blogs/hr1388-the-give-act-mein) > [@](#): > > This is the equivalent of brown shirts and the “Arbeit macht frei” It has provisions for youth as well as seniors and everybody in between. This bastard (Hussein) has got to be stopped! and this: [Hr 1388 “The GIVE Act” - creation of American “Brown Shirts”? ? ?](http://www.resistnet.com/forum/topics/hr-1388-the-give-act-creation) > [@](#): > > The 'p’resident The Marxist Imam Obama talked about a “Civilian Security Force” on a par with the US Military to react to Natural Disasters, and “Civil Unrest”. > > Is this that “Civilian Security Force” created by a “Judas Goat Bill” that will if enacted will result in a USSR of America Brown Shirt Organization? ? ? ? or this: [Obama’s Civilian Army Begins](http://theconservativedominion.blogspot.com/2009/03/obamas-civilian-army-begins.html) > [@](#): > > There is nothing - NOTHING - in the Constitution of the United States that warrants, mandates or permits this. Chances are this will be voted down, but it is still scary to think that the Obamafurhen has this idea of a modern day Sturmabteilung in his head. If you would like more, I can google all day. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/5 "2009-03-17T21:40:08Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > So what is the deal with this bill? Does it encourage volunteerism, or create a sinister cadre of Obama youth that will turn in their parents for clinging to guns and god? Makes me think of the hoovervilles that are currently operating in California right now offer any youths a way to get into work on federal projects and keep em off the street. Maybe a repeat of FDR’s new deal Declan ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/6 "2009-03-17T22:03:06Z")
And yet, every word of this dribble will be accepted here in Tennessee. Pity me, for I will have to listen to it, & no amount of reasoning will stop it, for **The Louder You Are, The Righter You Are™**.:smack: ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/7 "2009-03-17T22:21:40Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > The right-wing blogosphere is buzzing with venom towards H.R. 1388, The GIVE Act (Generations Invigorating Volunteerism and Education Act), characterizing it as mandatory conscription into a leftist army aimed at destroying all that is good about America. Were people this upset about Bush’s [2002 formation of the USA Freedom Corps](http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/infocus/bushrecord/factsheets/needs.html)? > [@](#): > > Following 9/11, President George W. Bush called on all Americans to serve their communities, their Nation, and their world. In his 2002 State of the Union Address, he announced the creation of USA Freedom Corps to connect Americans with more opportunities to serve their country and to foster a culture of citizenship, responsibility, and service. > > Nearly 61 million Americans have answered the President’s Call to Service by volunteering. These volunteers are helping feed the hungry, house the homeless, aid the addicted, mentor at-risk youth, and offer critical care to those in need at home and around the world. > > USA Freedom Corps Is Helping Americans Answer The President’s Call To Service By Strengthening National Service Programs > > Citizen Corps, created by President Bush following 9/11 to build a culture of preparedness, now has nearly one million volunteers nationwide, and their efforts reach more than three-quarters of the American people. Citizen Corps fosters collaboration among government and civic leaders to achieve broader participation in disaster preparedness and response. > > Volunteers for Prosperity, also created by President Bush, mobilized more than 43,000 doctors, teachers, engineers, and other skilled Americans this year to address critical needs abroad. The program matches skilled American professionals with service opportunities in the developing world. Both Citizen Corps and Volunteers for Prosperity have proven to be effective, and President Bush calls on Congress to make these programs permanent. > > Peace Corps has been provided its highest level of funding in history under President Bush. The Peace Corps has opened or re-opened programs in 13 countries. It currently supports about 8,000 Americans who commit to serve two years in communities overseas. > > AmeriCorps provides opportunities for more than 74,000 people to serve their fellow Americans. > > Senior Corps connected approximately 500,000 older Americans with opportunities to serve their communities and country through Retired and Senior Volunteer Program (RSVP), Senior Companions, and Foster Grandparents programs. Last year, Senior Corps members provided approximately 116 million hours of service. > > Learn and Serve America supported 1,700 grantees for service-learning programs in schools last year alone, engaging more than 1.4 million students from kindergarten through college in nearly 28 million hours of service. > > Take Pride in America was re-launched at the U.S. Department of the Interior and is supporting more than 400,000 skilled volunteers through meaningful service opportunities preserving America’s public lands and National Parks. > > USA Freedom Corp’s website [www.volunteer.gov](http://www.volunteer.gov) created a volunteer network that has become the Nation’s largest clearinghouse of volunteer opportunities. [Volunteer.gov](http://Volunteer.gov) offers more than four million volunteer opportunities, both in the United States and abroad. Now, I’ve encountered some fairly wild-eyed leftists in my time, and they did not become noticeably less wild-eyed during the Bush Administration, but I swear I never heard anybody suggest that the formation of a national youth volunteer organization was the first step in Bush’s building himself a fascist army. > [@Loony right-wing nutbar on teh intarwebs](#): > > This is the equivalent of brown shirts and the “Arbeit macht frei” It has provisions for youth as well as seniors and everybody in between. This bastard (Hussein) has got to be stopped! I mean, what the duck??? Are folks like this actively **trying** to win the Nuttiest of Them All award, or what? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2009, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/8 "2009-03-17T23:54:58Z")
Thanks for the links. Since none of them are to any source I would remotely consider taking seriously, I have to say I have no real comment on them… except to say I wouldn’t take any of them seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/9 "2009-03-18T00:31:03Z")
I’ll be the first to say that the summary of the act is incomprehensible. It seems to mostly just refer to other, preexisting acts and organizations with different acronym names, none of which I know and so my eyes glaze over as it says what it intends to do in regards to those. Could anyone offer a human summary for the acronym-impaired? > [@Bricker](#): > > Thanks for the links. > > Since none of them are to any source I would remotely consider taking seriously, I have to say I have no real comment on them… except to say I wouldn’t take any of them seriously. The OP did specifically say that he was talking about the reactions in the **blogosphere**. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/10 "2009-03-18T00:32:21Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Thanks for the links. > > Since none of them are to any source I would remotely consider taking seriously, I have to say I have no real comment on them… except to say I wouldn’t take any of them seriously. You have avoided the real question in the OP, and instead merely hand-waved away the naysayers, without saying that they are wrong, just that they aren’t very credible. Are they wrong? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/11 "2009-03-18T00:39:50Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > So what is the deal with this bill? Does it encourage volunteerism, or create a sinister cadre of Obama youth that will turn in their parents for clinging to guns and god? Hey, now! There’s no need to choose! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/12 "2009-03-18T01:01:09Z")
> [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > Are they wrong? 😕 Didn’t **Bricker** say that in his first post? > [@Bricker](#): > > [The OP] has quite convincingly rebutted the claim that this bill would “create a sinister cadre of Obama youth,” In other words, I think everybody here is agreed that nobody with two brain cells to rub together is likely to take the “AmeriCorps Brownshirts” menace terribly seriously. So there’s not likely to be much of a lively debate on that. What _I_ would like to know is: Given that starting or expanding a citizen volunteers program seems to have been pretty much par for the course for every Administration since [George H. W. Bush signed the National and Community Service Act of 1990](http://www.nationalservice.gov/about/role_impact/history.asp), why are people making a fuss about it now? Why wasn’t this a looming fascist menace every other time a President did it? (Is it because…you know…the “Obama youth” types are…you know… “b”?) :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/13 "2009-03-18T01:43:40Z")
I didn’t realize that **Bricker** was saying that they were wrong. I just got that he was commenting on the fact that **Fear** had a more convincing argument. My apologies for not getting all the subtext, if indeed I missed it. As to your question **Kimstu** , I have a feeling it has something to do with the fact that Obama is a Dem. When the right wing talks about volunteerism, it’s charity, goodness, and the backbone of a moral society (to the right wing, that is). When the left wing talks about volunteerism, it’s communism, forced labor, and the trappings of a fascist dictatorship (to the right wing, that is). ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/14 "2009-03-18T01:59:43Z")
> [@](#): > > This bastard (Hussein) > [@](#): > > The 'p’resident The Marxist Imam Obama > [@](#): > > the Obamafurhen I am guessing that these are the same people who thought that calling Bush names was the ultimate act of treason. They really need to seek professional help. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/15 "2009-03-18T02:09:21Z")
I realize we’re focused on the right-wing blogosphere here, but didn’t **Sam Stone** start a thread inqiuiring about mandatory participation in one of these programs over in GD when this was first proposed? – thogh, to be fair, **Sam** was asking if there was any truth to the allegation. ---
**Author:** ![Kevbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e47774/32.png) [@Kevbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kevbo)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/16 "2009-03-18T02:09:47Z")
Silly righty tightys have no appreciation of history. “Brown Shirts” were the SS, not the Hitler Jungen that they mean to compare this to. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/17 "2009-03-18T02:24:09Z")
SA. Not the SS. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/18 "2009-03-18T02:28:00Z")
> [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > When the left wing talks about volunteerism, it’s communism, forced labor, and the trappings of a fascist dictatorship (to the right wing, that is). Ya ok, but Clinton signed the National and Community Service Trust Act of 1993, and I don’t remember there being so much as a peep out of the righties about the forced-labor thing. What has inspired this explosion of nuttitude at Obama in particular? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/19 "2009-03-18T02:32:47Z")
Hell, never mind that, his jack-booted thugs are taking over college hoops! > [@](#): > > President Barack Obama is picking Louisville, North Carolina, Memphis and Pittsburgh for the Final Four in the NCAA men’s basketball tournament… [http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/bkc\_espn\_obama](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/bkc_espn_obama) No more playing the game to win, oh, no, that’s too competitive! Now the President decides whos going to the Final Four! Wake up, America! Wake up! ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741/20 "2009-03-18T02:44:16Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Hell, never mind that, his jack-booted thugs are taking over college hoops! > > [http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/bkc\_espn\_obama](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/bkc_espn_obama) > > No more playing the game to win, oh, no, that’s too competitive! Now the President decides whos going to the Final Four! Wake up, America! Wake up! OK, I actually laughed out loud at that, **'luci**. 😃 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-give-act-hr-1388-expand-opportunities-to-serve-or-create-obamas-brownshirts/489741.md?page=2)