# The Gold King mine disaster and the Animas River. **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 11, 2015, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526 "2015-08-11T05:19:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![chacoguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@chacoguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chacoguy)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/1 "2015-08-11T05:19:56Z")
[Many of you have probably heard of this.](https://www.rt.com/usa/312105-animas-river-spill-gallons/) My Factual Question is this: What precedents do we have for this? How many times has someone contaminated more than 100 miles of riparian areas? How often was this done by the government itself? ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/2 "2015-08-11T05:32:24Z")
> [@](#): > > A crew looking to pump out wastewater accidentally breached a debris dam that had formed inside the mine, triggering the release of waste into Cement Creek If all that was holding it all back was an accidental jam, then it was probably set to break at any time. There are a number of sites where this sort of stuff flows regularly. [Mount Polley mine - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Polley_mine_disaster) for example; googling is difficult because almost everything is about the Mt. Polley spill > **[Tailings.info ▪ Stava tailings dam failure](https://www.tailings.info/casestudies/stava.htm)** > > Stava tailings dam failure, Trento, Italy. One of the worst tailings disasters in history Or a list - [Chronology of major tailings dam failures](http://www.wise-uranium.org/mdaf.html) ---
**Author:** ![bluezooky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e8c25b/32.png) [@bluezooky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bluezooky)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/3 "2015-08-11T06:12:41Z")
Ok Tedi Mine Disaster in Papua New Guinea contaminated more than 600 miles of river. Many mines in that part of the world don’t bother with a tailings dam and hope the high rainfall is able wash waste out to sea, PNG has a long history of this type of problem created by multinational miners. The first issue is Government’s that allow the initial mining, afterwards the mining company has as to stay in business to keep up the maintenance and so use this as leverage to open more mines. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/4 "2015-08-11T13:45:22Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > If all that was holding it all back was an accidental jam, then it was probably set to break at any time. There are a number of sites where this sort of stuff flows regularly. That’s what makes me so mad about the whole thing. The rightwinger/libertarian crowd is crowing that “this is why we don’t need the EPA!”, but conveniently ignoring the fact that all that was keeping this from happening was an already leaking earthen dam. They’re blaming the EPA, but not the company that set up the situation. ---
**Author:** ![Kelevra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/97f17d/32.png) [@Kelevra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelevra)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/5 "2015-08-11T15:31:28Z")
There was a [coal slurry spill](http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/12/23/tennessee.sludge.spill/) in Tennessee in 2008. That was 500 million gallons of waste into a tributary of the Tennessee River. In 2000 the [Martin County (Kentucky) spill](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/10/11/inez-coal-slurry-spill-to_n_757900.html) released 180 million gallons into a local trib. [Acid mine drainage](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acid_mine_drainage) is a serious problem. I worked on a stream in eastern Kentucky that had untreated sewage running into it. There was no bacteria problem because the receiving stream had a pH of 3-4 from an upstream mine discharge and nothing could live in the stream. There are an [estimated 500,000 abandoned](http://www.abandonedmines.gov/ep.html) mines in the US. When in operation mines continually run pumps to keep up with accumulating water. Once abandoned they start filling up. This water eventually breaks out of the mine and pollutes streams with heavy metals and very acidic water. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/6 "2015-08-11T16:17:34Z")
> [@Lightnin](#): > > That’s what makes me so mad about the whole thing. The rightwinger/libertarian crowd is crowing that “this is why we don’t need the EPA!”, but conveniently ignoring the fact that all that was keeping this from happening was an already leaking earthen dam. They’re blaming the EPA, but not the company that set up the situation. Was it even an earth dam? The line “debris dam” suggests the total blockage was accidental, the release was just waiting to happen. not exactly the same thing, but I recall something about a major landslide burying a town (Wales?). The mountain of tailings from some coal mine turned to mud and flowed over the local town. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/7 "2015-08-11T19:34:49Z")
I am curious what sort of fine the EPA would impose on a mining company who did this? ---
**Author:** ![somepumpkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7feea3/32.png) [@somepumpkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/somepumpkin)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/8 "2015-08-11T20:19:57Z")
> [@Lightnin](#): > > That’s what makes me so mad about the whole thing. The rightwinger/libertarian crowd is crowing that “this is why we don’t need the EPA!”, but conveniently ignoring the fact that **all that was keeping this from happening was an already leaking earthen dam.** They’re blaming the EPA, but not the company that set up the situation. Bolding mine. Do any of you guys have additional info on this aspect? It’s not that i don’t believe you, just looking for more data. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/9 "2015-08-11T23:11:46Z")
I’m pretty sure the corporation that did the mining is now defunct and long gone. Hey accidents happen all the time, and people get criminally prosecuted and heavily fined all the time for allowing those accidents to happen. Do you really think that BP purposefully allowed the Deep Horizon well to leak all of that oil into the Gulf? It was an accident. Sounds like the States of New Mexico and Colorado, and the Navajo Nation all intend to take legal action against the EPA for their part in this accident. ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/10 "2015-08-11T23:28:54Z")
Generally speaking, what causes mines to be full of such toxic stuff? ETA, thread title = folk song ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/11 "2015-08-11T23:43:35Z")
> [@outlierrn](#): > > Generally speaking, what causes mines to be full of such toxic stuff? When they mined for gold, silver or other metals, etc. you not only release the metals you are seeking but a lot of other things like lead, arsenic, other toxic heavy metals that were trapped in the ground. Also as you dig deep into the earth many times you encounter water. The _leavings_ those minerals that you left behind (the toxic stuff) sometimes mixes with the water that was found as well. Also when they mines are closed, they also tend to fill up with rain water, snow melt, etc. After they fill up the toxic metals and water slurry then slough out with every rain/ snow melt and leach into the rivers, tributaries, etc. There are hundreds of closed mines like this all over Colorado and other states that started and closed, some of them hundred or more years ago. They are an ongoing problem for states and the EPA. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/12 "2015-08-11T23:58:49Z")
> [@somepumpkin](#): > > Bolding mine. Do any of you guys have additional info on this aspect? It’s not that i don’t believe you, just looking for more data. [Here’s an article that mentions it](http://www.vox.com/2015/8/10/9126853/epa-mine-spill-animas): “On August 5, EPA contractors were assessing leaks from the nearby Gold King mine, abandoned since 1923, when they inadvertently shook loose a debris dam that had been holding back a massive amount of water laced with arsenic, lead, and other toxins.” ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2015, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/13 "2015-08-12T05:51:37Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > I’m pretty sure the corporation that did the mining is now defunct and long gone. > > Hey accidents happen all the time, and people get criminally prosecuted and heavily fined all the time for allowing those accidents to happen. Do you really think that BP purposefully allowed the Deep Horizon well to leak all of that oil into the Gulf? It was an accident. > > Sounds like the States of New Mexico and Colorado, and the Navajo Nation all intend to take legal action against the EPA for their part in this accident. Yep. There’s a whole bunch of really angry people down that way. ---
**Author:** ![Ken001](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/43a26b/32.png) [@Ken001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ken001)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2015, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/14 "2015-08-12T07:41:51Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > not exactly the same thing, but I recall something about a major landslide burying a town (Wales?). The mountain of tailings from some coal mine turned to mud and flowed over the local town. Aberfan. 1966. I was a little boy at the time living on the other side of the world and was deeply affected by this tragedy for the simple reason that school was supposed to be a safe place for children. The newspapers were full of wire photos of the colliery slagheaps which collapsed. I’ve never forgotten it. > **[Aberfan disaster](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberfan_disaster)** > > The Aberfan disaster was the catastrophic collapse of a colliery spoil tip on 21 October 1966. The tip had been created on a mountain slope above the Welsh village of Aberfan, near Merthyr Tydfil, and overlaid a natural spring. Heavy rain led to a build-up of water within the tip which caused it to suddenly slide downhill as a slurry, killing 116 children and 28 adults as it engulfed Pantglas Junior School and a row of houses. The tip was the responsibility of the National Coal Board (NCB), a... ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2015, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/15 "2015-08-12T16:10:36Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > I am curious what sort of fine the EPA would impose on a mining company who did this? In a similar recent case, there were several convictions for [criminal](https://www.fbi.gov/pittsburgh/press-releases/2015/freedom-industries-pleads-guilty-to-environmental-crimes) [negligence](http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2014/12/23/epa-climate-justice-blog-delivering-promise-clean-water-act-158418), and the company entered bankruptcy. ---
**Author:** ![chacoguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@chacoguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chacoguy)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2015, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/16 "2015-08-13T06:19:01Z")
The EPA said the spill was a million gallons, then, well three million. Here’s the thing, I watch the river flow everyday and [it looked like this.](http://137.227.241.67/nwisweb/data/img/USGS.09361500.01.00060..20150804.20150813.log.0.p50.gif) The toxic plume hit the North end of town around 8-10 PM on the fifth. The actual gauge is South of town, down by the BMX track. That makes it more smeared out along time; so it showed up on the sixth and seventh. So, the river went from a flow of around 600 Cubic Feet per Second to 630 CFS. 30 Cubic Feet per second. 180 Cubic feet per minute; 10800 cubic feet per hour, 259,200 feet per day times 7.48 gallons per foot is 19,4 million gallons. To come at it from the other end, an Olympis Swimming Pool holds 660,000 gallons. So, five of these fucking things foul 150 miles of rivers? I call bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Ken001](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/43a26b/32.png) [@Ken001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ken001)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2015, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/17 "2015-08-13T10:22:45Z")
Good man, it always pays to check the facts. I’m not sure why US authorities (or maybe its the media) refer to spills in gallons rather than cubic feet or meters. Anyway everything is relative. A spill into your house water system would be fatal. Into a substantial river, not so much. Nevertheless that is no help to the fish, invertebrates, and biota of the river. A concentrated flush of cadmium, arsenic, copper for ten minutes = dead. All the way downstream for a long way. ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2015, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gold-king-mine-disaster-and-the-animas-river/727526/18 "2015-08-13T13:48:14Z")
> [@Ken001](#): > > Good man, it always pays to check the facts. I’m not sure why US authorities (or maybe its the media) refer to spills in gallons rather than cubic feet or meters. Um. . . Maybe because gallon is the only unit of measurement that makes sense in such a case?