# The Grail **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 17, 2008, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922 "2008-09-17T01:04:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/321 "2008-10-03T09:45:54Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > 3…This is good time to stop. You can’t stop until after you start. I’ve been watching this thread with some interest, but still don’t really think you’ve communicated the substance of what it is that you’re apparently quite keen for people to know about. Why not just explain yourself in really simple, straightforward terms? Or if you don’t want to share your beliefs, that’s fine, but don’t be a tease. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/322 "2008-10-03T11:31:14Z")
**Mangetout** I don’t think **Maatorc** is evangelizing or “Quite keen for people to know about” it. I think that he’d be very pleased if some of us began researching occult anatomy on our own, but that’s secondary to his purpose here. I think he originally posted here hoping to contact a member of the Inner School. So, he isn’t testifying to the average Doper. He’s demonstrating his knowledge to somebody even more versed in the subject than him. He’s not trying to explain the myth to the layman. He’s giving signs in hopes of receiving countersigns. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/323 "2008-10-03T11:33:09Z")
Fair enough - I guess if we had one of those here already, we’d know about it by now. ---
**Author:** ![nd\_n8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/439d5e/32.png) [@nd\_n8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nd_n8)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/324 "2008-10-03T12:54:13Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > **Mangetout** I don’t think **Maatorc** is evangelizing or “Quite keen for people to know about” it. > > I think that he’d be very pleased if some of us began researching occult anatomy on our own, but that’s secondary to his purpose here. I think he originally posted here hoping to contact a member of the Inner School. So, he isn’t testifying to the average Doper. He’s demonstrating his knowledge to somebody even more versed in the subject than him. He’s not trying to explain the myth to the layman. He’s giving signs in hopes of receiving countersigns. If that’s his agenda it has at least partially worked. I have been searching high and low for any reference to “occult-anatomy” and the other “One-ring-to-bind-them-all” stuff maatorc has been talking about and found diddley squat. Although it has expanded my base knowledge of Abrahamic, Vedic and Pagan practices and histories some, so I guess that’s a good thing. I’m not sure posting aparently original thoughts, proselytizing them, then standing back while the observers scramble to find out what the hell you’re talking about is exactly an ethical method of fighting ignorance but, c’est la guerre. On the other hand, some of my personal misconceptions about the commonalities (or lack of commonalities) of classic theological mythology have been corrected or tweeked in a little. I personally could have done without all of the Mr. Miyagi stuff though and been a little more straight forward with it. ---
**Author:** ![NineToTheSky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5a626/32.png) [@NineToTheSky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NineToTheSky)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/325 "2008-10-03T13:43:52Z")
I honestly think that after nine pages of asking and cajoling **maatorc** to elucidate, without \*any \*success, coupled with > [@](#): > > 3…This is good time to stop that it’s not likely that he is going to help us. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/326 "2008-10-03T15:02:28Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Except that Kabbalah does no such thing. And neither does mainstream Christian mysticism. There _is_ an anatomical myth of sorts in Charles Williams’ _Taliessin_ poems, but it has nothing to do with ventricles or the pineal gland, serving, rather, as a unifying image of the Roman Empire in the days of King Arthur. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/327 "2008-10-03T15:14:21Z")
I wasn’t referring to the myth of occult anatomy. Rather I was countering **Maatorc** ’s assertion that Kaballah has > [@](#): > > body centered attention-meditation-focus procedures as the central activity. First, Kaballah has too many branches to have a single central activity. Second, I know of no branch that has ‘body centered meditation’ as its central activity. ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/328 "2008-10-03T15:36:56Z")
> [@InvisibleWombat](#): > > [Moderating] > Excellent point. This thread stopped being a “Comment on Cecil’s Column” long ago. > > Off to Great Debates… > [/Moderating] I’m not sure this is the place to ask this, but isn’t it a little late in the game for a change of venue? Is there really an expectation that people will wade through hundreds of admittedly insipid posts in order to get a feel for this thread and post anything substantive or meaningful? Would you take a roomful of stoned college Juniors from an after bar and put them in a courtroom? Is there anyway this can become a “Great” debate? I understand that **maatorc** ’s claims have been demonstrated to be nothing more than witnessing, but how can a 300+ post thread viably continue in a wholly different forum? It’s as though we were in the last two minutes of a game, 4th and 2 with **maatorc** deep in his own territory with no time outs and someone put up a net and gave everyone tennis rackets. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/329 "2008-10-03T17:24:21Z")
> [@SiXSwordS](#): > > I’m not sure this is the place to ask this, but isn’t it a little late in the game for a change of venue? “The game,” as it were, will continue for a long time, due to our archives and the opening of these boards to search engines. There’s really no question that this belongs in Great Debates, despite not being very great (of course, many of our other debates ain’t so great, either), and that’s where it should live for the long term. That’s why I moved it now. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/330 "2008-10-03T23:02:59Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > **Mangetout** I don’t think **Maatorc** is evangelizing… I think he originally posted here hoping to contact a member of the Inner School. This is not how it would be done. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/331 "2008-10-03T23:07:37Z")
Since you’re not a member of the Inner School, how can you be sure what the proper way to make contact is? ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/332 "2008-10-03T23:25:19Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Since you’re not a member of the Inner School, how can you be sure what the proper way to make contact is? Those who reject its existence do not need to know. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/333 "2008-10-03T23:27:34Z")
You didn’t answer the question. You are not a member of the Inner School. How then do _you_ know what they consider the proper method to contact them? ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2008, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/334 "2008-10-03T23:53:50Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > You didn’t answer the question. > > You are not a member of the Inner School. > > How then do _you_ know what they consider the proper method to contact them? I’m willing to take him at his word that he’s not trying to contact the illuminati. He’s just fishing for converts (following the ‘peek-a-boo-it’s-a-secret-spend-money-on-the-books’ rules of his odd belief system)- but he’s throwing out sucker-bait into a pool full of cynicfish. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2008, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/335 "2008-10-04T00:16:23Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > Those who reject its existence do not need to know. fnord ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2008, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/336 "2008-10-04T01:55:21Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > …How then do _you_ know what they consider the proper method to contact them? You do not need to know. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2008, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/337 "2008-10-04T02:02:13Z")
This time, you may have actually answered the question I asked. I’m honestly not sure. I’m not asking to know the proper method to contact the Inner School. I am asking _how you know_ that it is the proper method. How do you know, not being a member of the Inner School yourself, what the proper method to contact them is? How can you be sure you’ve met a member of the Inner School? How can you be sure that there aren’t members of the Inner School posting in this very thread, feigning ignorance to test you? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2008, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/338 "2008-10-04T02:08:29Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > You do not need to know. This is a non-answer. It appears to the outside observer to be the classic response of a loon who has no way to actually defend his or her position. I would prefer to not have to look upon you as a loon, so I would suggest that you refrain from making loon-like declarations. It is many hours since you acknowledged that it would probably be a good time to stop. I would urge you to consider that point. ---
**Author:** ![Uncle\_Brother\_Walker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f08c70/32.png) [@Uncle\_Brother\_Walker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uncle_Brother_Walker)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2008, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/339 "2008-10-04T02:58:57Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > …and don’t even get me _started_ on the significance of the number 23. Let’s go simpler…what about the number 3 ??? ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2008, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/340 "2008-10-04T05:32:57Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > This is a non-answer. It appears to the outside observer to be the classic response of a loon who has no way to actually defend his or her position. > I would prefer to not have to look upon you as a loon, so I would suggest that you refrain from making loon-like declarations. > It is many hours since you acknowledged that it would probably be a good time to stop. I would urge you to consider that point. I am acknowledging he denies the existence of an inner school. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922.md?page=18)