# The Grail **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 17, 2008, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922 "2008-09-17T01:04:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/81 "2008-09-24T05:13:30Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > See “Comte de Gabalis” p. 297 > This summaries > 1…The meaning, > 2…The means, and > 3…The purpose, of the myth of occult anatomy. Er . . . . no it doesn’t. The stuff Exapno Mapcase summarizes what your talking about. So does Wikipedia’s entry on the [pineal gland](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pineal_gland#Cultures.2C_philosophies_and_mythologies). [This page](http://www.strayreality.com/Lanis_Strayreality/thirdtyepinealgland.htm) and [this one](http://www.christslight.org/english/announcements/052706.) also give me good idea. If I had to rely on what you’ve written yourself I would have no fucking idea what you’re on about. Why did you start this thread if you don’t want to explain yourself? ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/82 "2008-09-24T06:29:38Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > Er . . . . no it doesn’t. The stuff Exapno Mapcase summarizes what your talking about. So does Wikipedia’s entry on the [pineal gland]([http://en.wikipedia.org](http://en.wikipedia.org) wiki/Pineal\_gland#Cultures.2C\_philosophies\_and\_mythologies). [This page](http://www.strayreality.com/Lanis_Strayreality/thirdtyepinealgland.htm) and [this one](http://www.christslight.org/english/announcements/052706.) also give me good idea. If I had to rely on what you’ve written yourself I would have no fucking idea what you’re on about. Why did you start this thread if you don’t want to explain yourself? Er . . . . no it doesn’t. There is a group of people who have perfected a mental body and can function consciously while out of there physical vehicle. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/83 "2008-09-24T10:16:25Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > Er . . . . no it doesn’t. > There is a group of people who have perfected a mental body and can function consciously while out of there physical vehicle. 1. What the Hell does that mean? 2. Do you have any evidence that your statement is factual? ---
**Author:** ![LurkMeister](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@LurkMeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkMeister)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/84 "2008-09-24T13:04:08Z")
It sounds like **maatorc** is talking about [astral projection](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astral_projection), or some variation thereof. Once again he is not actually answering questions but merely making vague statements about the topic, and ignoring repeated requests for an explanation of verifiable proof that this “myth” has any basis in what most of us call “reality”. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/85 "2008-09-24T13:40:02Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > Er . . . . no it doesn’t. > There is a group of people who have perfected a mental body and can function consciously while out of there physical vehicle. Ok. Fine. That’s bullshit, but whatever. My question is this: WHAT THE HOLY ASTRAL FUCK DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH THE GRAIL, LEONARDO DA VINCI, OR THE THIRD FUCKING VENTRICLE? The pages I and **Exapno** linked to give me some idea what the answers to that question might be, but you’ve done nothing but piss in your own thread. I mean, seriously, what is your goal here? Why did you start this thread if you won’t connect the dots? ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/86 "2008-09-24T14:20:43Z")
Maybe we’re not worthy; that’s why we just don’t get it. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/87 "2008-09-24T14:59:45Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > There is a group of people who have perfected a mental body and can function consciously while out of there physical vehicle. Okay, we were having a perfectly rational discussion about commonalities in various myths and legends, and suddenly you’ve leaped off the deep end into oxymorons (“mental body”?) and astral projection. I will stop asking for evidence or proof since this stuff is so far out in la-la land that there’s never been an unbiased scientific study that gives it even the tiniest hint of reality. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/88 "2008-09-24T18:23:58Z")
I’m getting really unpleasant _deja vu_. The thread isn’t heading towards NDEs, is it? ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/89 "2008-09-24T18:53:16Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > Something is being missed by posters here. > A ‘legend’ is a device to transmit a myth. > A ‘Myth’ is a knowledge system > I am saying the myth of occult anatomy exists, not that it is true or false. > .. > [@maatorc](#): > > There is a group of people who have perfected a mental body and can function consciously while out of there physical vehicle. I suspect your mental body and your physical vehicle are working at cross purposes. ---
**Author:** ![LurkMeister](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@LurkMeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkMeister)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2008, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/90 "2008-09-24T18:54:14Z")
If **maatorc** comes back and says that all we need to do to understand is to “head towards the light” then I’m outta here. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/91 "2008-09-25T00:04:32Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by maatorc View Post > Er . . . . no it doesn’t. > There is a group of people who have perfected a mental body and can function consciously while out of there physical vehicle. > [@Baldwin](#): > > 1. What the Hell does that mean? > 2. Do you have any evidence that your statement is factual? 1…It means that this idea underlies and drives the myth. 2…All the human-quest-spirituality legends talk about the one-same subject. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/92 "2008-09-25T00:07:13Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > A ‘Myth’ is a knowledge system No it isn’t. If you want to make up a fake religion and pretend to believe in it, that’s your business. But if you use words to mean what they do not, then Reason and you are forever under divorcement. If you wish to know what the word means (apart from the anthropologist’s sense), I suggest you read the relevant chapter of C. S. Lewis’s _An Experiment in Criticism_. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/93 "2008-09-25T00:09:21Z")
**Maatorc** again, could we get more details? I can barely grasp what you are talking about because you give out the merest crumbs of information. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/94 "2008-09-25T00:18:50Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by maatorc View Post > Er . . . . no it doesn’t. > There is a group of people who have perfected a mental body and can function consciously while out of there physical vehicle. > [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > WHAT THE HOLY ASTRAL FUCK DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH THE GRAIL, LEONARDO DA VINCI, OR THE THIRD FUCKING VENTRICLE? The Grail is a legend transmitting the myth of occult anatomy which is driven by this group. Leonardo da Vinci represented the ‘Sacred Marriage’ in his Last Supper. The third ventricle is held in the myth to be the location of the ‘Sacred Marriage’. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/95 "2008-09-25T00:20:17Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > Maybe we’re not worthy; that’s why we just don’t get it. This is unconnected with anything I say. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/96 "2008-09-25T00:21:39Z")
> [@LurkMeister](#): > > If **maatorc** comes back and says that all we need to do to understand is to “head towards the light” then I’m outta here. Relax. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/97 "2008-09-25T00:24:34Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > I’m getting really unpleasant _deja vu_. The thread isn’t heading towards NDEs, is it? No. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/98 "2008-09-25T00:30:48Z")
> [@John\_W.Kennedy](#): > > No it isn’t. If you want to make up a fake religion and pretend to believe in it, that’s your business. But if you use words to mean what they do not, then Reason and you are forever under divorcement. > > If you wish to know what the word means (apart from the anthropologist’s sense), I suggest you read the relevant chapter of C. S. Lewis’s _An Experiment in Criticism_. There is one-only knowledge-system-myth of human perfectibility that underlies ALL religions without exception. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/99 "2008-09-25T00:32:08Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > The Grail is a legend transmitting the myth of occult anatomy which is driven by this group. > Leonardo da Vinci represented the ‘Sacred Marriage’ in his Last Supper. > The third ventricle is held in the myth to be the location of the ‘Sacred Marriage’. An ill-thought-out theory unsupported by established history created by an amateur historian and know only to a small circle of believers is not the same thing as a “myth”. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/100 "2008-09-25T00:35:39Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > There is one-only knowledge-system-myth of human perfectibility that underlies ALL religions without exception. “one-only”? “knowledge-system-myth”? Have you ever talked about this subject before with someone who doesn’t already subscribe to your belief system and/or has prior knowledge of your in-house terminology? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922.md?page=6)