# The Grail **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 17, 2008, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922 "2008-09-17T01:04:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/141 "2008-09-26T09:43:58Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > No pain - no gain! Well, you’re half right. How’s it coming with that third ventricle? Ready to tell us what the Hell that means? ETA: I presume you’re referring to brain anatomy here. If that’s the case, the third ventricle is basically a cavity filled with cerebrospinal fluid. Is that the wondrous realm of which you speak? ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/142 "2008-09-26T09:49:30Z")
You know, ancient Egyptian priests threw away entire brains, ventricles and all. Were they missing something in the one-only myth? ---
**Author:** ![nd\_n8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/439d5e/32.png) [@nd\_n8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nd_n8)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/143 "2008-09-26T11:36:57Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > Oh yeah? Now I’m really intrigued! I’m familiar with Xenu and a lot of the stuff from Operation Clambake, but nothing that reminds of this “occult anatomy” stuff. What’s pinging your meter? > > ETA: I really do wish he’d explain himself better. I love a good crackpot, but this guy’s not even trying. Anyone remember the guy with delusional parasititis? Now that was quality crackpotmanship! As I recall Dianetics had a lot of over-hyphenated double-speak with a confuse-clarify-enlighten-scam air about it. Combine that with the I’ve Got A Secret attitude and the opaque references (specifically biological) and it feels like something Hubbardish, although I’m sure that Hubbard was just another author who wrote around the Myth. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/144 "2008-09-26T18:00:08Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > I believe that was the considerably more three-dimensional Pee Wee Herman. Perhaps (I wouldn’t know), but it’s Bart Simpson, too. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/145 "2008-09-26T18:03:09Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > The third ventricle, as one of several in the brain, lies between the Pituitary gland and the Pineal ganglia. > In the myth the Pituitary is characterized as ‘female’ and the Pineal as ‘male’. > If a certain functional balance is attained between them they are said in the myth to react to each other, which reaction is said to result in a condition in the third ventricle which in its conscious realization is characterized as the ‘Sacred Marriage’. Thank you, thank you! This is the most clear you’ve been on the subject so far. I don’t agree with it, but at least I can understand it. Why don’t you keep elaborating! I’d love to hear more about this “conscious realization” known as Sacred Marriage. I’d also like to know what biochemical changes take place in the pituitary and the pineal glands that lead to this state, and what sort of medical research has been done in this area. > [@](#): > > I am not the least offended. > The myth is the most important knowledge in the world. > It is easy to trivialize it by claiming to know all about it, which I do not presume to do. > I am happy to but point in its direction. You don’t have to pretend to know everything about it, but explaining basic terms, even ones we might know from other contexts like “pituitary gland” can help enormously. Why do you believe this myth is the most important knowledge in the world? You haven’t even claimed that it’s true. (Have you?) ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/146 "2008-09-26T18:09:31Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > Is this what you do all the time? No, but I’ve been looking into the sources of _King Lear_ lately, and, along with the _Historia Regum Britanniae_, Holinshed’s _Chronicles_, and, of course, the anonymous _True Chronical History of King Leir_, Spenser treats of the story. My specialty, of course, is Lewis Theobald’s 1727 _Double Falshood; or, The Distrest Lovers_, his redaction of the since-lost _Cardenio_ by Fletcher and Shakespeare. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/147 "2008-09-26T18:24:28Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > (My God, how did Spenser write thousands of those stanzas?) Some poets actually find it easier to write in difficult forms. I, myself, find it easier to write a good ballade than a sonnet. (For the uninitiated, a ballade is in three stanzas and an additional half-stanza. It must rhyme ababbcbC ababbcbC ababbcbC bcbC, with the entire C line repeated each time. No rhymes may be repeated, which means you need six a’s, fourteen b’s, and five c’s. Each stanza should make one and only one point, and should not break into two quatrains; and the last half-stanza (the _envoi_) should sum it all up. Finally, the 25th line should begin with the word “prince” or “princess”.) ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/148 "2008-09-26T23:33:37Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > Thank you, thank you! This is the most clear you’ve been on the subject so far. I don’t agree with it, …Why do you believe this myth is the most important knowledge in the world? You haven’t even claimed that it’s true. (Have you?) True or not, it has driven, and presently drives every legend based religious system. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/149 "2008-09-26T23:44:07Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > True or not, it has driven, and presently drives every legend based religious system. Could you back up that statement with proof? ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/150 "2008-09-26T23:44:52Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > True or not, it has driven, and presently drives every legend based religious system. Even if this were true (and I’m not sure how it _could_ be true) I don’t see why it would necessarily be more important than, say, how to cure cancer or basic knowledge of arithmetic or the history of the internal combustion engine. If the myth is bullshit (and you haven’t claimed otherwise) then what belief systems it drives just a bit of historical trivia. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/151 "2008-09-27T00:22:56Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > Even if this were true (and I’m not sure how it _could_ be true) I don’t see why it would necessarily be more important than, say, how to cure cancer or basic knowledge of arithmetic or the history of the internal combustion engine. If the myth is bullshit (and you haven’t claimed otherwise) then what belief systems it drives just a bit of historical trivia. And it _doesn’t_ drive all belief systems, anyway. It doesn’t drive Christianity, Judaism, or Islam, to begin with. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/152 "2008-09-27T00:26:50Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Could you back up that statement with proof? All the occult-mystical-esoteric _doctrines and practices_ associated with all past and present legend-based religions, Eastern and Western, are anatomically driven. Why do you think the orthodox Christian legend-based ‘empire-religion’ went to so much trouble to try to exterminate every unorthodox ‘occult-anatomy-based’ group? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/153 "2008-09-27T00:26:54Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > He is only referring to writings that refer to writings referring to the myth! Which means, of course, that your post is a writing referring to a writing that refers to writings that refer to writings referring to the myth. And my own post, this very one, is a writing referring to a writing that refers to a writing that refers to writings that refer to writings referring to the myth. I leave the description of any reply to this post as an exercise for the reader. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/154 "2008-09-27T00:28:54Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > All the occult-mystical-esoteric _doctrines and practices_ associated with all past and present legend-based religions, Eastern and Western, are anatomically driven. Could you provide proof of that statement? Backing up an unproven assertion with another unproven assertion doesn’t really help. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/155 "2008-09-27T00:32:25Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Could you provide proof of that statement? Backing up an unproven assertion with another unproven assertion doesn’t really help. Name one such doctrine or practice that is not anatomically driven. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/156 "2008-09-27T00:34:42Z")
> [@maatorc](#): > > Name one such doctrine or practice that is not anatomically driven. No. That’s not how it works. You made the claim. You back it up. Explain how all mystical/esoteric practices are anatomically driven. ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/157 "2008-09-27T00:46:06Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > No. That’s not how it works. You made the claim. You back it up. Explain how all mystical/esoteric practices are anatomically driven. They are all focused on the human anatomy and the goal of perfection through transformation. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/158 "2008-09-27T00:49:38Z")
Yet again, you back up an unproven assertion with another unproven assertion. Please provide proof of you latest statement. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/159 "2008-09-27T01:09:07Z")
Why has nobody mentioned the Illuminati yet? In the spirit of the OP: “I can explain how all religions, including those that have not been announced yet, are conjoined by the myth (which is not a myth) which clearly shows that the transformation which we are all seeking for (consciously or unconsciously) is already upon us yet mankind is oblivious to it; the evidence for which is clearly shown in the Last Supper, the works of Dan Brown and a piece of toast which bears the mark of God upon it (and came into my possession only yesterday, which shows both the undeniable relevance of it and the inhuman accuracy timewise of those who caused my toaster to act in this way at this key moment in history) and this mass of evidence cannot be refuted by any logic system for the myth previous referred to is beyond such human frailties as it has been implanted in our consciousness at a quantum level by the Omnipotent Being which some refer to as Ra and others as Odin and yet more as Mr. Underhill of Bag End - and this latter has been misinterpreted as a simple yet complex adventure story when in truth it shows those of us who have the power what is really going on; whilst those of you who wilfully refuse to agree with me, demanding your petty cites and references and ludicrously claiming to fight ignorance shall never achieve the state of perfect understanding required to follow my arguments. But I won’t.” ---
**Author:** ![maatorc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@maatorc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maatorc)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922/160 "2008-09-27T01:12:38Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Yet again, you back up an unproven assertion with another unproven assertion. > > Please provide proof of you latest statement. Are you saying you have never heard of meditation? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-grail/463922.md?page=9)