# The Great Ongoing Aviation Thread (general and other) (Part 1)
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [October 23, 2011, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499 "2011-10-23T02:17:01Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 304
### Author:  [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)
#### Post date: [May 17, 2024, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6063 "2024-05-17T20:54:27Z")
The aircraft earned the nickname “Fork-tailed Doctor Killer”.
Hey, wasn’t the incident pilot in this case a doctor?
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [May 17, 2024, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6064 "2024-05-17T21:00:10Z")
> [@gnoitall](#):
>
> Hey, wasn’t the incident pilot in this case a doctor?
He was.
IIRC, Bonanzas were called ‘doctor killers’ because only doctors could afford them, and doctor-pilots tended to overestimate their flying abilities.
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### Author:  [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)
#### Post date: [May 17, 2024, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6065 "2024-05-17T21:02:21Z")
They’re beautiful aircraft, and originally marketed as much for prestige as function. I could see them becoming magnets for well-off professionals with more confidence than experience, and (as pointed out above) they originally had some structural airworthiness issues when pushed hard.
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### Author:  [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)
#### Post date: [May 18, 2024, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6066 "2024-05-18T18:01:48Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> I wonder what they’re going to do with i?. They have the follow-on Supper Connie Columbine III at the AF Museum. It would be great to have a flying version.
They certainly won’t restore such an historic example of the type to flying condition.
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [May 18, 2024, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6067 "2024-05-18T23:00:16Z")
> **[WWII Triple-Ace Col Bud Anderson Has Passed Away](https://avgeekery.com/wwii-triple-ace-col-bud-anderson-has-passed-away/)**
>
> WWII triple-ace fighter pilot legend Col Bud Anderson (ret.) has passed away. Anderson is credited with shooting down 16 enemies in WWII
> WWII triple-ace fighter pilot legend Col Bud Anderson (ret.) has passed away. He was 102 years young.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [May 19, 2024, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6068 "2024-05-19T01:24:28Z")
When you think of the odds of surviving the war as a fighter pilot that’s some life span.
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### Author:  [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6069 "2024-05-21T13:15:08Z")
I’m not a fan of turbulence, but even less so now. That sounds like a horrific flight, and yes, it was a Boeing.
> **[Singapore Airlines flight live: British man, 73, dies during severe...](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-69044396)**
>
> The Boeing 777-300ER was diverted to Bangkok and landed at 15:45 local (08:45 GMT).
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6070 "2024-05-21T14:08:18Z")
Sounds like he died from Princess Diana syndrome.
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### Author:  [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6071 "2024-05-21T15:46:04Z")
> [@JacobSwan](#):
>
> That sounds like a horrific flight, and yes, it was a Boeing.
This one isn’t Boeing’s fault. One could just as easily use this story in their favor - their plane was sturdy enough to survive severe turbulence.
I say again for the umpteenth time, the best thing you can do as a passenger for safety is **keep your seatbelt on at all times**. According to the story the man who died had a heart attack, but the remainder of the injuries were people being bounced around inside the cabin. It happened in a private jet not long ago, and happens on airliners a few times a year.
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### Author:  [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6072 "2024-05-21T16:05:38Z")
I try to avoid aisle seats after seeing several people injured when the lockers sprung open during turbulence. And I’ve worn my seatbelt religiously on every flight since then. When the FA’s are crying and praying, you know things are bad.
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6073 "2024-05-21T16:11:52Z")
> [@JacobSwan](#):
>
> When the FA’s are crying and praying, you know things are bad.
Wasn’t it in _Airplane_ (1980) that a statue of Mary on the instrument panel covered her eyes?
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### Author:  [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6074 "2024-05-21T17:33:24Z")
Seen pics from inside that flight in other sites. That cabin got **wrecked**. Panels smashed in — not just the detachable ones for the masks popped out, but holes punched in fixed paneling, overhead galley fixtures ripped out and conduits hanging down, the works. This bird is not going to be making revenue for a while.
Yeah, it **is** a testimony that the 777 can take a licking and keep on ticking, but those inside not so much…
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6075 "2024-05-21T17:36:04Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#):
>
> According to the story the man who died had a heart attack
“Likely” heart attack at this point.
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### Author:  [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6076 "2024-05-21T17:51:13Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#):
>
> It happened in a private jet not long ago
Turned out that wasn’t due to turbulence, but rather to some control surface acting weird when some autopilot mode was switched off (the pilots were correct to switch it off, in response to some indicator fault).
From a passengers’ point of view - e.g., keeping your seatbelt fastened — it’s the same deal, that’s true.
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### Author:  [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6077 "2024-05-21T22:08:49Z")
Llama may have been thinking of the Challenger 604 that flipped in wake turbulence from an A380. I don’t seem to find a final report (has it been published?) bit I’m not seeing anything in the Interim Report published by the BFU to suggest an error in aircraft configuration or control system fault for that one. That was in 2017.
Perhaps you’re recalling another event?
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### Author:  [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6078 "2024-05-21T22:18:35Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#):
>
> Llama may have been thinking of the Challenger 604 that flipped in wake turbulence from an A380. I don’t seem to find a final report (has it been published?) bit I’m not seeing anything in the Interim Report published by the BFU to suggest an error in aircraft configuration or control system fault for that one. That was in 2017.
>
> Perhaps you’re recalling another event?
I was thinking of this one from about a year ago:
> **[Jet pitched wildly, killing 1, amid cockpit warnings: NTSB](https://apnews.com/article/private-plane-turbulence-death-business-jet-e6c7186b0dbe89cb03a2af7bf95a3aec)**
>
> A report says a business jet flying over New England violently pitched upward then downward — fatally injuring a passenger — after pilots responding to automated cockpit warnings switched off a system that helps keep the aircraft stable.
As was mentioned earlier, whether it’s turbulence, malfunction, pilot error or something else, keeping a seatbelt on is a great idea. My guess is people think of them as protection in crashes, but (perhaps more often) they’re also for keeping you in your seat when things get sporty. Maybe that’s why so many people apparently take them off during cruise.
My seatbelt stays on when I’m a passenger. After a lav trip it snaps shut the moment I sit down again. I have no intention of being bounced off the ceiling of a plane - just a stupid way to die.
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### Author:  [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6079 "2024-05-21T22:21:20Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#):
>
> they’re also for keeping you in your seat when things get sporty
And just as true for cars.
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### Author:  [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)
#### Post date: [May 21, 2024, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6080 "2024-05-21T22:27:54Z")
I agree, they should always be worn. And I’ll drag out my soap box to state that infants should be seated in approved car seats or CARES harness (it’s not an “extra” seat, it’s a _safe_ seat you’re paying for…I vehemently oppose lap child allowances during taxi takeoff and landing…you cannot hold onto an infant jerked away in a multiple-g event!).
I’m seeing regulatory activity that tells me that the future will have shoulder harnesses (3 point; I expect the shoulder harness will detach and only be required during critical phases) on regular commercial seating and I wouldn’t be surprised if the rules about staying buckled up didn’t expand to general cruise as well. Personally, I’m all for it.
There’s a surprising lack of regulation at all about turbulence occupant safety. It annoys me intensely. Global warming will just make these events more common and people expect a higher level of safety…though they’ll bitch and moan about their comfort.
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [May 22, 2024, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6081 "2024-05-22T20:52:59Z")
Somebody, whose name is Robert, posted on FB, ‘My new flight bag’. The embroidery reads:
DREAD PILOT
ROBERT
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### Author:  [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)
#### Post date: [May 25, 2024, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6082 "2024-05-25T04:11:29Z")
I didn’t see this posted yet. Boeing and the FAA report what sounds like **[a potentially serious flaw in the 777](https://www.travelpulse.com/news/airlines-airports/boeing-reports-new-flaw-found-in-another-series-of-planes)**. A fault in the fuel line in the center tank could potentially be a source of ignition and cause an explosion, which sounds disturbingly similar to what happened to **[TWA Flight 800](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TWA_Flight_800)**. The fix would require electrical bonding and grounding to the fuel lines in nearly 300 planes.
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