# The Great Ongoing Aviation Thread (general and other) (Part 1)
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [October 23, 2011, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499 "2011-10-23T02:17:01Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 308
### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [June 7, 2024, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6143 "2024-06-07T23:21:40Z")
The pilot of the helicopter brought fire works into California where they are banned. The flight was over a restricted area. Firing them from the cabin area presented a chance that one of the fireworks exploded in the interior or just human error from being jostled while in the air.
The pilot lost his license and isn’t in a good spot to defend the other circumstances. But it made for a good video of things not to do in an airplane. What is an interesting thought experiment would be if it was from an air vehicle that didn’t require a license and was in an area that allowed fireworks.and stupid people.
---
### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2024, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6144 "2024-06-08T01:20:06Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#):
>
> Just a referral, see Walter Lord’s book “The Longest Day” or the movie of the same name to see what JRDelirious was getting at (if you already knew, then nevermind…)
We do 't know and aren’t going to read the book to find out. What’s the explanation.
---
### Author:  [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2024, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6145 "2024-06-08T02:12:20Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#):
>
> see Walter Lord’s book “The Longest Day” or the movie of the same name to see what JRDelirious was getting at (
> **Private John Marvin Steele** (November 29, 1912 – May 16, 1969) was the American paratrooper who landed on the pinnacle of the church tower in Sainte-Mère-Église
> On the night before D-Day, two planeloads of paratroopers from the 1st and 2nd battalions 505th Parachute Infantry Regiment were dropped in error directly over the village.
> The paratroopers were easy targets, and Steele was one of the few not killed. He was wounded in the foot by a burst of flak. His parachute caught in one of the pinnacles of the church tower, leaving him hanging on the side of the church. Steele hung there limply for two hours, pretending to be dead,
Meanwhile a small plane went down off San Juan County, WA. The pilot and sole occupant was a very special flyer …
> [@RIP Apollo 8 Astronaut William Anders](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-apollo-8-astronaut-william-anders/1002619):
>
> The former astronaut and General Dynamics CEO, who took the iconic Earthrise photo from lunar orbit, has died in a small plane crash on San Juan Island in Puget Sound.
---
### Author:  [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2024, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6146 "2024-06-08T11:20:59Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#):
>
> Kind of aviationish — a group of members of Congress commemorated D-Day as reenactors by donning period paratroop gear and jumping out of a Dakota over France
3 Dakotas flew low over my village last Sunday on their way back from dropping parachutists over Normandy. Those things are big, noisy and slow!
---
### Author:  [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2024, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6147 "2024-06-08T14:46:27Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#):
>
> > [@JRDelirious](#):
> >
> > Everyone walked away from the LZ and nobody got stuck dangling from a church tower, apparently.
>
> > [@Spiderman](#):
> >
> > Not at all surprised; don’t crosses repel those types?
>
> Just a referral, see Walter Lord’s book “The Longest Day” or the movie of the same name to see what JRDelirious was getting at (if you already knew, then nevermind…)
That _WOOSH_ sound wasn’t from the skydivers going past.
Vampires are repelled by crosses so I wasn’t at all surprised when no congresscritters didn’t get hung up on a church steeple; like two same-poled magnets, they’d be repelled away.
---
### Author:  [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2024, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6148 "2024-06-08T14:54:08Z")
I don’t believe it was about a whoosh of your comment but about those, as **Magiver** , who are unfamiliar with the event so they would not get neither your nor my comment.
---
### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6149 "2024-06-10T06:30:35Z")
News story:
> **[Flying blind: Austrian plane flies into hailstorm, loses half of cockpit...](https://today.rtl.lu/news/world/a/2203468.html)**
>
> An Austrian Airlines Airbus, operating as flight OS434 from Palma de Mallorca to Vienna, encountered severe weather approximately 150 kilometers southwest of Vienna.
Pictures of the damaged jet:
>
That must have been some _serious_ hail.
---
### Author:  [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6150 "2024-06-10T08:31:48Z")
Now this is what I call **efficiency**! Why wait to land just because another plane is still taking off on the same runway? 😅
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nddb2UAs4FI)
---
### Author:  [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6151 "2024-06-10T11:52:19Z")
Hey, you’ve got your end of the runway and I’ve got mine. At least they were both going the same direction.
As to Austrian’s hail encounter …
Once again it’s just ~~great~~ dumb when news articles from legit sources throw in a photo that has nothing to do with the actual incident. The damaged airplane was an A320. The file photo they picked was an A380. Which type Austrian has never operated.
I’m not criticizing @Cervaise for the cite. I’m criticizing the article writers / editors.
While Googling for more info on the hail incident I ran across this Austrian mistake from back in April:
> **[Austrian Airlines Airbus A320neo severely damaged in ground collision at...](https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/lufthansa-group/austrian-airlines/airbus-a320neo-severely-damaged-in-ground-collision-at-vienna-airport/)**
>
> A recent incident at Vienna Airport in Austria has left a brand new Austrian Airlines Airbus A320neo severely damaged after it reportedly collided with
Evidently somebody set neither brakes nor chocks and the empty airplane later rolled backwards from wherever they’d left it until it crunched tail first into a building. Oops.
Austrian only has 67 airplanes. They’d better up their game or they’re gonna run out.
And of course the article about an Airbus ground crunch is illustrated by a picture of an airborne Boeing 737 operated by TUI Airways, a pan-European charter operator that doesn’t cover Austria.
---
### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6152 "2024-06-10T13:07:05Z")
How much do you want to bet, if I go looking for other news articles on the incident, they’ll all feature a different model of passenger jet in their stock image? 😆
(Seriously, though, how much of a pants-wetting moment is it for a pilot if a sudden blast of hailstones smashes your windshield and turns your front view into an opaque glass spiderweb?)
---
### Author:  [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6153 "2024-06-10T14:12:09Z")
> [@Cervaise](#):
>
> (Seriously, though, how much of a pants-wetting moment is it for a pilot if a sudden blast of hailstones smashes your windshield and turns your front view into an opaque glass spiderweb?)
No sweat! Just push that button that says “Autoland,” sit back, and relax.
Right, @LSLGuy, @Richard_Pearse, @Llama_Llogophile?
---
### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6154 "2024-06-10T15:11:21Z")
> [@wolfpup](#):
>
> Now this is what I call **efficiency**! Why wait to land just because another plane is still taking off on the same runway? 😅
Maybe they thought they were at Oshkosh. At least it wasn’t on a taxiway.
---
### Author:  [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6155 "2024-06-10T15:19:16Z")
> [@wolfpup](#):
>
> Now this is what I call **efficiency**! Why wait to land just because another plane is still taking off on the same runway?
Interesting video, but the voiceover is terrible. It says both pilots took evasive action. One took off, one landed; I’m not seeing anything evasive from either of them.
And both planes are described as “a 320”.
---
### Author:  [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6156 "2024-06-10T15:28:13Z")
> [@Cervaise](#):
>
> (Seriously, though, how much of a pants-wetting moment is it for a pilot if a sudden blast of hailstones smashes your windshield and turns your front view into an opaque glass spiderweb?)
That’s right up there. One of a handful of puckering scenarios I’m glad to have avoided. That’s a noise they’ll be hearing in their dreams for years to come.
It would also not be surprising to have leading edge flap damage and engine damage as well. If the radome is trashed you also get buffeting, insane cockpit noise levels, and (depending on where the pitot tubes and AOA vanes are) airspeed indication problems, spurious stall warnings, etc.
In all, a really shitty day at work.
---
### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6157 "2024-06-10T15:46:07Z")
Isn’t there a correlation between lightning and hail? It sounds like they knew they were flying into known conditions that were predictive.
---
### Author:  [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6158 "2024-06-10T17:40:58Z")
Hail is only created by thunderstorms. But the hail can fall in areas with little radar return. Or it can fall in the bright red DANGER WILL ROBINSON DANGER - Do Not Fly There area.
This happened at ~18K feet near the destination. So someplace on the arrival.
A disproportionate share of turbulence injuries also happen on arrival. Because due to terrain or traffic reasons it’s far more difficult to deviate to avoid the worst of weather. So pilots become habituated to not ask for deviations they really should. There’s a general belief that flying through the lower strata of any given level of radar return is better / safer then flying through the same thing at cruise altitude. Which is a decent rule of thumb, but is not an infallible oracle for predicting what’s about to happen to you. 18 is high enough I’d be real leery of assessing the threat lightly. Down at 5K it’s a different matter.
As well, despite the engineers’ efforts, most radar displays are still calibrated in ways that understate distant precip and overstate close precip. Also lotta ways to diddle the display settings in cruise and forget to reset them for arrival. Resulting in either a display that’s crying “Wolf!” so bad you learn to ignore it, or one that’s in effect hiding stuff it ought to be showing you that you really need to be seeing so you can avoid flying through it.
I’m unfamiliar with the topography and airspace around Vienna, but a quick look at Google maps suggests they might have been terrain constrained, or getting ready to be as they continued the descent.
All speculation on my part.
---
### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6159 "2024-06-10T19:50:10Z")
> **[Seaplane Plows Into Boat During Takeoff Before Immediately Splashing Down](https://autos.yahoo.com/seaplane-plows-boat-during-takeoff-153624003.html)**
>
> A seaplane lifted off directly into the side of a boat while setting off on a Saturday sightseeing flight from a harbor in Vancouver, Canada. The pilot and five passengers onboard De Haviland DHC-2 Beaver escaped the crash uninjured, CBC News...
Once committed to take-off, there’s not much a plane can do. Did the pilot see the boat, and assumed he (the pilot) had the right of way and that the boat would turn away? Did he not see the boat? Did the boat operator not see the aircraft?
---
### Author:  [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6160 "2024-06-10T19:53:36Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#):
>
> Interesting video, but the voiceover is terrible.
Yes, it’s an absolutely terrible video, but the only one I could find on the spur of the moment, sorry!
---
### Author:  [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6161 "2024-06-10T20:52:50Z")
I’ve been a DeHavilland Beaver, and in float planes (though never fron seat); forward visibility isn’t the greatest. Beavers aren’t exactly quiet.
I don’t know who strictly had the right-of-way, but the boat driver probably had more options.
---
### Author:  [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)
#### Post date: [June 10, 2024, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/6162 "2024-06-10T21:18:20Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#):
>
> I’ve been a DeHavilland Beaver
This whole self-identification thing is really getting hard to follow. 😆
[Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499.md?page=307)
[Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499.md?page=309)