# The Great Ongoing Aviation Thread (general and other) (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 23, 2011, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499 "2011-10-23T02:17:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 393
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2025, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7843 "2025-05-20T03:08:35Z")
Medical helo makes emergency landing in SE PA. I heard it lost it’s tail rotor & I don’ see one in the Fox flyover.. - Local Fox station [coverage](https://www.fox29.com/news/helicopter-emergency-lands-whitemarsh-twp-reports) - Local ABC station [coverage](https://6abc.com/post/medical-helicopter-makes-emergency-landing-whitemarsh-pa/16474857/) The ABC coverage has a bystander capturing the landing. It doesn’t look like the blades are moving at all. Don’t they still spin if you’re in autorotation, or is this an artifact of frame rate on their phone syncing with the rotor turn rate? Paging @Johnny_L.A ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2025, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7844 "2025-05-20T03:22:21Z")
It was a recommendation after the Germanwings murder/suicide. My employer at the time had always had a two-in-the-flightdeck policy so I didn’t pay a lot of attention to it. It has since been relaxed by the authorities and some airlines. (Mine still requires two in the cockpit at all times). > **[Germanwings Flight 9525 | Regulatory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanwings_Flight_9525#Regulatory)** > > In response to the incident and the circumstances of the co-pilot's involvement, aviation authorities in some countries implemented new regulations that require the presence of two authorised personnel in the cockpit at all times. Three days after the incident, the European Aviation Safety Agency issued a temporary recommendation for airlines to ensure that at least two crew members—including at least one pilot—were in the cockpit for the entire duration of the flight. Sev The British Psychologic... ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2025, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7845 "2025-05-20T03:35:01Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > The ABC coverage has a bystander capturing the landing. It doesn’t look like the blades are moving at all. Don’t they still spin if you’re in autorotation, or is this an artifact of frame rate on their phone syncing with the rotor turn rate? It’s just an artefact of the video. The rotor RPM happens to synch with the video frame rate. The blades are still turning. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2025, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7846 "2025-05-20T16:25:51Z")
A DoorDash delivery driver got lost and somehow made it onto the airside portion of O’Hare Airport. Or maybe some passenger decided they didn’t like any of the meal options on their flight and ordered DoorDash. > **[DoorDash Driver Mistakenly Drove on O'Hare Airport Tarmac, Video Shows](https://www.yahoo.com/news/doordash-driver-mistakenly-drove-ohare-044344062.html)** > > A DoorDash delivery driver accidentally drove into a restricted area at O'Hare International Airport, and the bizarre incident was captured on video. The red vehicle belonging to the driver was stopped on a tarmac, right next to a large plane,... ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2025, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7847 "2025-05-20T20:21:51Z")
You and I both posted vids highlighting that artifact upthread starting here: > [@The Great Ongoing Aviation Thread (general and other)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other/600499/1358): > > Correct. The frame rate of the video vs the rotation rate of the blades happens to coincidentally line up making for almost stop-motion photography. Here’s one of my favorites for that: [[- YouTube] ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Is0k0mCdeDk) It’s a vid of a Czech Air Force Mi-24 Hind attack helo doing an airshow demonstration. Throughout the demo you’ll see the blades barely turning. No helicopter could fly, much less maneuver aggressively, with the blades barely moving. The actual Hind has 5 equally spaced blades on th… My cited vid upthread has since been pulled down, but this current one shows a similar effect: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/QUOzS90xAbs/maxresdefault.jpg "4Kᵁᴴᴰ Czech AF Mi-24V Hind Attack Helicopter @100 Years of the Polish Air Force Airshow RADOM 2018") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUOzS90xAbs) As I noted upthread, for most of this vid the Hind’s rotors appear to be rotating backwards. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2025, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7848 "2025-05-20T20:53:27Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > As I noted upthread, for most of this vid the Hind’s rotors appear to be rotating backwards. Hinds’ rotors _do_ rotate backwards! 🤡 Explanation: In most Western helicopters, the rotors rotate counterclockwise when viewed from above. The rotors on Russian and French helicopters rotate clockwise when viewed from above. If you look at the rotor blades in the video, you can see the leading and trailing edges that show they spin ‘backwards’. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![JacobSwan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7849 "2025-05-22T13:36:37Z")
[https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cj42ew5zy7et](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cj42ew5zy7et) Cessna 550 crashed into houses in San Diego. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7850 "2025-05-22T14:41:57Z")
‘Small plane’ is correct, for a given definition of ‘small’. 😉 When I hear ‘small plane’, I automatically do not think of anything with a turbine. ---
**Author:** ![JacobSwan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7851 "2025-05-22T14:55:09Z")
The fire chief quoted as worrying about jet fuel made me look up the plane type. I’m used to thinking of Cessnas as small prop planes used by flying schools. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7852 "2025-05-22T15:06:32Z")
> [@JacobSwan](#): > > I’m used to thinking of Cessnas as small prop planes used by flying schools. My mom worked at Gibbs Flying Service. My dad bought his first plane (N84573) from Gibbs. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7853 "2025-05-22T15:31:53Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > ‘Small plane’ is correct, for a given definition of ‘small’. 😉 > > When I hear ‘small plane’, I automatically do not think of anything with a turbine. Maybe they’re referring to the size of the pieces of the plane post-crash. 🥴 At first I was thinking 15 is a lot of houses to take out but then I was thinking back to the one in NE Philly a couple of months back; where there’s video of a medical Learjet 55 coming in nose-first, where it left a 10’ deep crater & how many houses that one took out. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7854 "2025-05-22T16:02:18Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > When I hear ‘small plane’, I automatically do not think of anything with a turbine. But for most people, when they hear the name “Cessna” they think “small plane”, without knowing what type of plane it actually was. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7855 "2025-05-22T16:23:11Z")
Fair point, heck, around where I live there is a tendency to genericize “un cesna” to mean any GA prop single regardless of make or model. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7856 "2025-05-22T16:25:10Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > Maybe they’re referring to the size of the pieces of the plane post-crash. 🥴 Pilot humour! > [@WildaBeast](#): > > But for most people, when they hear the name “Cessna” they think “small plane”, without knowing what type of plane it actually was. All small airplanes used to be Pipercubs (one word). ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7857 "2025-05-22T16:59:00Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > > [@WildaBeast](#): > > > > But for most people, when they hear the name “Cessna” they think “small plane”, without knowing what type of plane it actually was. > > All small airplanes used to be Pipercubs (one word). Well, according to the Journalist’s Guides… [![](https://i0.wp.com/live-nr-2017.pantheonsite.io/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/BUYCQ_tCAAA0JYk.jpg-large-6.jpeg) ](https://i0.wp.com/live-nr-2017.pantheonsite.io/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/BUYCQ_tCAAA0JYk.jpg-large-6.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7858 "2025-05-22T17:03:07Z")
The last one is a Flintglock. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7859 "2025-05-22T17:07:41Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > All small airplanes used to be Pipercubs (one word). And it may have fallen out of use, but it seems like at one time small private jets (like the Cessna 550) were all Learjets. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7860 "2025-05-22T19:36:05Z")
That’s a great article with lots of updates. Sure be nice of the authorities had given an address, even if it was just the rough centroid of the debris field. “Murphy Canyon” isn’t much to go on. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7861 "2025-05-22T20:34:10Z")
Here’s Murphy Canyon Rd. MYF is to the left. [Google Maps](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Murphy+Canyon+Rd+%26+Aero+Dr/@32.8113654,-117.1369003,2934m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m6!3m5!1s0x80d95587f60a07db:0x183db905c424387e!8m2!3d32.8088278!4d-117.1158121!16s%2Fg%2F1tj52wwq?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDUxNS4xIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D) I’ve been working, so I haven’t studied any footage. But just eyeballing the map, it looks like the crash could have happened anywhere between the neighbourhood just east of the 15, to Aero Drive south of the runway. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2025, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499/7862 "2025-05-22T20:43:18Z")
Thanks. The BBC article eventually includes a Google aerial photo. My complaint is with the spokepeople. Murphy Canyon is apparently an area. Murphy Canyon Road might or might not be in Murphy Canyon. Or might be many miles longer than any area that’s relevant to the mishap. I know that you personally know their relationship because you lived and drove around there. My point is spokespeople giving out unactionably vague information. Switching to the mishap, not the yak-yak … Given the time of day (0400), the dense fog / cloud, the impact position along the extended centerline, this sure smells like a tired crew botching an approach and falling out the bottom. There’s an ILS and an RNAV to runway 28R [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499.md?page=392) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-1/600499.md?page=394)