# The Great Ongoing Aviation Thread (general and other) (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 14, 2026, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892 "2026-06-14T14:38:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/61 "2026-06-25T12:34:37Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > There’s a small airline that flies out of Boston to Provincetown, Nantucket, Rockland Maine, Rutland Vermont, and quite a few other small towns in New England. They have operations in Montana and the Caribbean, and have expanded their fleet recently. Cape Air BTW does do a number of EAS-subsidized routes in their system (e.g. locally Mayagüez MAZ). But for Cape Air it **is** a viable business case to fly little airplanes on short hops between small cities/towns and islands and eventually feeding into regional hubs. When it only takes 5 people to be half-full, the crew is 1, and your plane did not cost 40 million it’s slightly easier to make it. Things get iffy though if you get a situation where there is a location that may require more capacity than that, but not enough to justify a dedicated mainline-brand service. As mentioned a whole bunch of US locations are on a similar boat, at best retaining one 40-seater at 6am as the only way to get to somewhere a major carrier serves. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/62 "2026-06-25T12:47:05Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > What are they doing that other airlines can’t? They’re flying mostly to vacation destinations (Nantucket, MV, Provincetown, Bar Harbor, Saranac Lake, Bar Harbor, Hyannis) from some major starting points (Boston, Islip, JFK). The other destinations (Lebanon, Rutland, Augusta) are apparently big enough to support some traffic. The few other oddballs (New Bedford, Norwood) only fly to Nantucket, so that’s probably easier for folks who don’t want to travel into Boston. Their Carribean routes all look like vacation travel destinations. I don’t know enough about their Montana routes. I suspect they have some higher price points due to their passengers and destinations. For example I looked at a Boston/Martha’s Vineyard route where they compete against JetBlue. The Cape Air flights are 2-4x more expensive than JetBlue, but there are 10 per day versus 1 for JB. For the Boston/Nantucket route they compete against AA and JB, and they offer 10 flights versus 3 for their competitors, but the prices is about 2x. I also checked Boston/Rutland VT where they have no direct competitors and the prices are quite low. Same with Boston/Augusta ME. ---
**Author:** ![Llama\_Llogophile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/63 "2026-06-25T13:36:36Z")
> **[Pilot’s medical emergency forces flight to divert | CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2026/06/25/us/video/air-canada-flight-diverted-to-boston-pilot-medical-emergency-ldn-digvid)** > > An Air Canada flight operated by PAL Airlines from Newark to Halifax diverted to Boston after the captain suffered a medical emergency in the cockpit, prompting the first officer to safely take control and land the aircraft. The pilot was taken to a... ---
**Author:** ![Llama\_Llogophile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/64 "2026-06-25T13:41:38Z")
Regarding the Essential Air Services routes… I used to fly for an airline that did a lot of EAS and I agree that it’s a necessary solution for many cities that would be otherwise not be served at all by an air carrier. As for determining whether a route would be profitable if it were run “at risk” (which is the term of art), it’s not as simple as it may sound. One airline that did EAS also had an at risk route between Boston and Islip on Long Island. Sounds good, right? It turned out they misunderstood the market needs. The flights weren’t timed well for someone trying to get to Boston early for business, and there wasn’t enough demand for Islip as an alternate NYC destination (which is what they’d really been betting on). It didn’t last long. In my airline experience I went to quite a few small cities that would have had very few options without EAS. Edit: Many of the crew at my company were pretty right wing, some of them vocally anti-government. So it was fun to poke at them: “Hey, how do you like all this government funding that our airline basically survives on?” ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/65 "2026-06-25T13:50:08Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > I don’t know enough about their Montana routes. [EAS-subsidized routes.](https://www.capeair.com/theme/single-news.html?id=1579) Same for Augusta, Rockland, Bar Harbor, Rutland, Saranac and Lebanon in New England. > **[Essential Air Service | Subsidized EAS communities](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_Air_Service#Subsidized_EAS_communities)** > > \*Service includes flag stop(s) > The Alternate Essential Air Service program grants funds directly to the municipality or airport authority instead of the air carrier. This allows the community to recruit air service that would not otherwise meet EAS guidelines, such as more frequent service with smaller aircraft, less-than-daily service, flights to differing destinations at different times of the year or week, on-demand air taxi service, scheduled or on-demand ground surface transportation, regio... And yes their Caribbean routes mostly involve connecting people whose flights from or to CONUS arrive or depart SJU or STT to short hops to the smaller islands or to resort town airports. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/66 "2026-06-25T14:07:16Z")
Can anyone identify this aircraft? I can’t tell if it’s a Cessna 195, or a De Havilland. (Cessna’s my first guess.) > **[2 bodies recovered from Columbia River plane crash, NTSB investigating](https://www.nbcrightnow.com/news/2-bodies-recovered-from-columbia-river-plane-crash-ntsb-investigating/article_72f6659f-7210-4289-b525-afab511973f7.html)** > > UPDATE: June 24 at 10:30 p.m. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/67 "2026-06-25T14:24:23Z")
Cessna 195 > **[Wirestrike Accident Cessna 195 N3877V, Wednesday 24 June 2026](https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/572940)** > > A float equipped Cessna 195 struck a power line and crashed into the Columbia River, near Pasco, Washington. Both occupants perished and the aircraft was written off. Pre-crash photo > **[Photo of Cessna LC-126 (N3877V) - FlightAware](https://www.flightaware.com/photos/view/12577177-b07626487f8674311601305a5215e0f58d3d3b2c/aircrafttype/C195)** > > FlightAware Aviation Photos: Cessna LC-126 (piston-single)(N3877V), Napa Valley Marina KAPC ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/68 "2026-06-25T14:26:53Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > …What are they doing that other airlines can’t? Their routes are mostly pretty short, which would keep fuel costs low. Nantucket, Martha’s Vineyard, and Provincetown are popular hard to get to by car… Is “popular hard” like “wicked smart”? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/69 "2026-06-25T14:40:00Z")
> [@Pork\_Rind](#): > > > Both occupants perished and the aircraft was written off. How many crashes occur with fatalities and the aircraft not written off? ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/70 "2026-06-25T14:47:52Z")
Well, taking the question semi-seriously, vintage warbirds typically get rebuilt from devastating crashes. The rarity and value are so high that it doesn’t make sense to just throw them away, even after horrific damage. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/71 "2026-06-25T15:09:48Z")
Something people may be missing in this discussion of service to local airports. The local airport is only going to fly to a couple or so other airports and you have to do a transfer (with perhaps a several hour wait) to fly everywhere else, while the more distant big city airport flies direct to dozens of locations. And as mentioned the local airport is going to be more expensive. So driving to the big city airport can be both significantly cheaper and also have a shorter end to end travel time [because no transfer wait]. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/72 "2026-06-25T15:43:41Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > I suspect they have some higher price points due to their passengers and destinations. Long ago we were contemplating joining with friends from Chicago in Flagstaff, about 200 miles north of Phoenix. I think they were figuring the trip would be like driving 200 miles in Illinois because at first they wanted to fly to FLG but on checking it cost more to fly between Phoenix and there than it did for the Chicsgo to Phoenix leg. They decided to get picked up at Sky Harbor and ride up with us and were suitably impressed at the climb up to the Rim.. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/73 "2026-06-25T16:02:17Z")
**Inches From Disaster: Qatar-Bound 777F’s Wing Nearly Strikes Ground In Risky Low Pass** > The pilot initiated a right bank at the aircraft’s lowest point, bringing the 777F’s wingtip within feet, or perhaps even inches, of contact with the ground. While the flyover was already questionably low, the banking maneuver at such an altitude was incredibly dangerous. Even a slight gust of wind at the wrong moment could have led to disaster. > > Horseshoe Bay’s airport features a 6,000-foot runway designed primarily for private jets and smaller regional aircraft, and also sits right next to a residential community. [https://simpleflying.com/qatar-777-freighter-wing-low-pass-near-disaster/](https://simpleflying.com/qatar-777-freighter-wing-low-pass-near-disaster/) Watch the video. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2026, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/74 "2026-06-25T22:15:26Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Cape Air BTW does do a number of EAS-subsidized routes in their system (e.g. locally Mayagüez MAZ). But for Cape Air it **is** a viable business case to fly little airplanes on short hops between small cities/towns and islands and eventually feeding into regional hubs. When it only takes 5 people to be half-full, the crew is 1, and your plane did not cost 40 million it’s slightly easier to make it. Things get iffy though if you get a situation where there is a location that may require more capacity than that, but not enough to justify a dedicated mainline-brand service. As mentioned a whole bunch of US locations are on a similar boat, at best retaining one 40-seater at 6am as the only way to get to somewhere a major carrier serves. The list I checked showed expiration dates for the EAS subsidies to different towns, some of them as early as this year. Is that a permanent expiration, or is this one of those things that’s routinely extended? I saw references to Cape Air expanding their fleet (don’t know if they were purchase or lease), so they seem like they’re expecting their business to be sustainable long-term. And if Lethbridge doesn’t have enough demand for air service to keep a 40-seater in business, how about 20, or 11, or 9? Lower the supply until it matches the demand. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2026, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/75 "2026-06-26T02:24:12Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > The list I checked showed expiration dates for the EAS subsidies to different towns, some of them as early as this year. Is that a permanent expiration, or is this one of those things that’s routinely extended? The award to a specific carrier to be the provider at a location has a fixed time duration and upon ending a new RFP must be issued for renewal or replacement. The continued existence of EAS itself, like all other FAA/DOT activities, and what are eligible destinations, are usubject to the periodic FAA reauthorization legislation in Congress. It’s one of those items that “budget hawks” regularly propose eliminating and the Congress regularly extends anyway. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2026, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/76 "2026-06-26T02:32:29Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > And if Lethbridge doesn’t have enough demand for air service to keep a 40-seater in business, how about 20, or 11, or 9? You still need a pilot and staff so the cost per passenger is going to skyrocket the lower the number of passengers you carry. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2026, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/77 "2026-06-26T02:54:17Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > You still need a pilot and staff so the cost per passenger is going to skyrocket the lower the number of passengers you carry. The cost of labor (the pilot) will be spread across 10 passengers, rather than 40, so that goes up; but the cost of the plane and fuel goes down with a smaller aircraft. My dad worked for a regional airline for a while. To hear him tell it, the pilots there got paid peanuts. I always thought it was like professional baseball; you can barely scratch out a living until you get called up to the majors and cash in. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2026, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/78 "2026-06-26T03:11:31Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > To hear him tell it, the pilots there got paid peanuts. I always thought it was like professional baseball; you can barely scratch out a living until you get called up to the majors and cash in This is notoriously so in the US regionals, even those brand-affiliated with the majors. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2026, 9:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/79 "2026-06-26T09:26:59Z")
Cape Air pays a bunch less than any RJ airline does. Or at least did 15-20 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2026, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892/80 "2026-06-26T12:32:03Z")
Question as I sit on my flight from BOS to BZN—on a full A320 flight at cruising altitude is the cabin being heated or cooled? I know it’s-50 out but the pax are putting off a lot of heat… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-aviation-thread-general-and-other-part-2/1030892.md?page=5)