# The Great Ongoing Guitar Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [January 31, 2010, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172 "2010-01-31T23:20:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 133
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2012, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2643 "2012-07-08T17:46:07Z")
Might as well ask here: What’s a good capo? I keep meaning to pick one up, and always forget, since I never use them. But I may at some point need one, so who makes good ones? ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2012, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2644 "2012-07-08T18:10:32Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > Might as well ask here: What’s a good capo? I keep meaning to pick one up, and always forget, since I never use them. But I may at some point need one, so who makes good ones? I use the Dunlop or Keyser type that have the extended bits so you can squeeze and put them on one handed. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2012, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2645 "2012-07-08T20:15:26Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > Might as well ask here: What’s a good capo? I keep meaning to pick one up, and always forget, since I never use them. But I may at some point need one, so who makes good ones? I’ve got a Shubb that works fine. I like it because the profile behind the neck is really low, so it doesn’t get in the way of my hand. I had one (maybe WordMan’s Dunlop, not sure) that had a big handle and I found it really got annoying when you’re trying to play close to it and you keep bumping into the thing. But that may just be me. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2012, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2646 "2012-07-08T22:05:52Z")
I have several, all with different advantages. Keysers are great for their one-handedness; I also have a Keyser that I’ve cut in half so it only covers the bottom 3 strings. (There are three songs that I do where I have to use the half capo on the fly…) I’m also experimenting with Keysers that have notches cut out of them. A Shubb is much more effective as a ‘leave it on for the entire song’ capo, though you can get Keysers of different shapes and softnesses. I have a Spider capo, but it isn’t as useful as I thought it was going to be - you’re still left with this spikey bar that seems to always be in the way. And my favourite for the classical guitars is still the old-fashioned caterpillar elastic job. ( **Squeegee** - do you keep the squeeze grip on the up- or the down- side of the neck? It’s just I’ve never found the grip particularly in the way…) ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2012, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2647 "2012-07-08T22:32:41Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > ( **Squeegee** - do you keep the squeeze grip on the up- or the down- side of the neck? It’s just I’ve never found the grip particularly in the way…) (I’m not sure, I took it back and got the Shubb. I’d bet I tried it both ways, though. Why are we whispering? 😉 ) ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2648 "2012-07-09T01:38:19Z")
(Because I feel like I asked one of _those_ obvious questions, like when tech support used to ask ‘Is the volume all the way up on your screen?’ There was always that one time in a hundred when the person on the other end of the line would start saying ‘Of course; what makes you think I wouldn’t have checked an obvious thing like - hmph - thank you very much’. ‘click’ 😉 ) You asked about the ergonomic advantages of fan-fretting. Here’s the quick and dirty version - hold your hand in front of your face and spread your fingers. For most people, it looks like a letter ‘W’ with four prongs. Now, bend your elbow and rotate your arm at the shoulder with your fingers still spread. You’ll be making an arc with your hand’s motion, and the fingers look a bit like the spokes of a bicycle wheel at its outer rim. Standard frets, on the other hand, would make more sense if your hand looked like an upper-case letter ‘E’ (with four prongs) on its back. And that parallelism of the prongs causes you to have to modify that rotation of the shoulder so that the fingers maintain their parallel position. That’s a gross over-simplification, as curving the fingers to provide support to the tip brings the spread fingers closer together. Also, a totally flat fingered technique would not be a good idea on most acoustic instruments, as the pressure on the joints can cause all sorts of nasty problems like tendinitis, focal distonia, carpal tunnel, etc. Standard frets are what most of us grew up with, and they’re what has worked for the instrument and its cousins for hundreds of years (Okay, lutes, vihuelas, 18th century parlour guitars, ukeleles are all much smaller, but I’m trying to be brief, which doesn’t come naturally to me.) (Also, I think if you’d approached an 18th century guitar maker with the idea of fan frets, they would have said that the math was all but impossible…) and so they persist. They work very well, in fact. But especially for instruments with a longer scale, or instruments with a large range of string thicknesses (I’m thinking of [6-](http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.themusiczoo.com/images/9-01-11/Afterburner_2_Fan_Fret_Bass_Natural_4501_1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.themusiczoo.com/product/11176/CVS/Entries&h=1190&w=800&sz=401&tbnid=Fm1n-_DEHv6erM:&tbnh=102&tbnw=69&zoom=1&usg=__AMd31auxCx1ycexY-JLtFzt3ZfU=&docid=XkW0oXBK9W5uwM&sa=X&ei=tTH6T9iOBbOF0QGsqYj1Bg&ved=0CEIQ9QEwAA&dur=18), [7-](http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://i1135.photobucket.com/albums/m622/Serratus1/Fanfret1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.rig-talk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f%3D3%26t%3D103946&h=684&w=912&sz=94&tbnid=4CABunsoAVWa5M:&tbnh=89&tbnw=119&zoom=1&usg=__ZoJ6Of57xo_ip7dAyzeh8WeXuCU=&docid=2F6wP6hyASPAMM&sa=X&ei=tTH6T9iOBbOF0QGsqYj1Bg&ved=0CFgQ9QEwBw&dur=1653) string basses in particular.) they can solve the problem of bridge compensation. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2649 "2012-07-09T06:19:00Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > (Because I feel like I asked one of _those_ obvious questions 😉 ) (Trust me, I gave it a good workout. It was for my son, and he agreed that the first capo wasn’t working all that well, and that the Shubb worked better, shrug.) > [@](#): > > You asked about the ergonomic advantages of fan-fretting. Here’s the quick and dirty version Thanks for the lengthy summary, Ministre, I very much appreciate it. I do get what you’re saying, but I don’t think I can really “get” it without holding a fan fretted guitar and playing it. I would love to try such an instrument. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2650 "2012-07-09T17:17:59Z")
Thanks for the capo suggestions, I’ll look 'em up now. ETA: First thing I discover is that it’s Kyser, not Keyser. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2651 "2012-07-09T17:44:34Z")
OK, silver Kyser purchased from Amazon. Not likely to get much use, but it’ll be nice to have one just in case. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2652 "2012-07-09T20:17:05Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > OK, silver Kyser purchased from Amazon. Not likely to get much use, but it’ll be nice to have one just in case. Thanks for the spelling correction and best of luck. Given your ambient approach to guitar, etc., if you like the basic ergonomics of the Kyser one-hander, you should know that they make partial capos, like the one \*\*Le Ministre \*\*modified himself, but which enable you to capo an alternate tuning - and you can switch to different capos to yield different tunings. Might be fun if you explore that approach in your playing. Fan Fret guitars - haven’t played any extensively enough to have an opinion other than that they seem interesting. Given my meat-and-potatoes approach to rhythm guitar work, I don’t know that they are a fit with my style - maybe if I did more fingerstyle and alternate tunings. **Fiddle Peghead** - any thoughts on my “why Martin for Bluegrass and Gibson for Rock” post? You said you had a POV you weren’t sharing to bias things - what were you thinking? ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2653 "2012-07-09T21:13:53Z")
Oh - and [Fender is going public](http://marketday.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/07/09/12644060-riff-on-this-fenders-going-public?lite). Lord, that seems kinda silly. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2654 "2012-07-09T23:54:44Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > **Fiddle Peghead** - any thoughts on my “why Martin for Bluegrass and Gibson for Rock” post? You said you had a POV you weren’t sharing to bias things - what were you thinking? On a completely facetious level, because [rock and rollers](http://www.google.com/imgres?start=82&hl=en&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbnid=1ZHLHp0gi24JwM:&imgrefurl=http://www.lasvegassun.com/photos/galleries/2011/feb/19/elviz-presley-2/42035/&docid=Omu-ske6jNxOvM&imgurl=http://photos.lasvegassun.com/media/img/photos/2010/01/07/AP060817032000_t653x653.jpg%253F345c8960c5484952b4411b83c62d17f0ae245bc0&w=510&h=653&ei=2Wv7T57QCOrl0QGgp-iABw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=535&vpy=575&dur=4444&hovh=254&hovw=198&tx=90&ty=129&sig=107977707109648243708&page=3&tbnh=143&tbnw=93&ndsp=46&ved=1t:429,r:10,s:82,i:37&biw=1393&bih=959) strive to be flashy, while [bluegrass players](http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbnid=seyFZq34vPskiM:&imgrefurl=http://www.charlestoncitypaper.com/charleston/peter-rowan-is-the-real-thing/Content%3Foid%3D2375711&docid=foAuqrF4JGTENM&imgurl=http://www.charlestoncitypaper.com/imager/backed-by-his-veteran-band-peter-rowan-delivers-inspired-music-of-all-shad/b/original/2375713/82bb/Peter_Rowan_Bluegrass_Band_by_Tim_Benko_resized.jpg&w=650&h=468&ei=6m37T8mJHKPd0QG__5D7Bg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=364&sig=107977707109648243708&page=1&tbnh=138&tbnw=181&start=0&ndsp=34&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:76&tx=127&ty=77&biw=1393&bih=959) do not. 🙂 I’ve actually got both a Martin D-18 and a Gibson Hummingbird, unfortunately the Martin is 200 miles away so I can’t compare the two, and my memory is not good enough to, well, remember exactly what the Martin sounds like. I am aware that Elvis was also known to play a Martin. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2655 "2012-07-10T02:59:37Z")
Trouble lives! Found someone with a only slightly battered sunburst JT90. Put the old neck, bridge, pickups on it. Went to this awesome place I accidentally found. [http://www.starguitars.net/](http://www.starguitars.net/) Guy knows what he’s doing. From what I saw, he’s a master on acoustics as well. Spent some money. Turns out that when my local place put the nut on the first time they didn’t cut it right. It’s like night and day. Even compared to the stock Blondie. I now have two offset teles again. I’m not complaining at all. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2656 "2012-07-10T03:22:58Z")
After checking that Veena out, I have determined that after I get A: really good and B: rich, I’m gonna save me up and get a Ravish Sitar pedal. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/XWid2B6c13E/maxresdefault.jpg "Summer NAMM '11 - Electro-Harmonix Ravish Sitar Demo") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWid2B6c13E) ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2657 "2012-07-10T11:28:31Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > On a completely facetious level, because [rock and rollers](http://www.google.com/imgres?start=82&hl=en&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbnid=1ZHLHp0gi24JwM:&imgrefurl=http://www.lasvegassun.com/photos/galleries/2011/feb/19/elviz-presley-2/42035/&docid=Omu-ske6jNxOvM&imgurl=http://photos.lasvegassun.com/media/img/photos/2010/01/07/AP060817032000_t653x653.jpg%253F345c8960c5484952b4411b83c62d17f0ae245bc0&w=510&h=653&ei=2Wv7T57QCOrl0QGgp-iABw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=535&vpy=575&dur=4444&hovh=254&hovw=198&tx=90&ty=129&sig=107977707109648243708&page=3&tbnh=143&tbnw=93&ndsp=46&ved=1t:429,r:10,s:82,i:37&biw=1393&bih=959) strive to be flashy, while [bluegrass players](http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbnid=seyFZq34vPskiM:&imgrefurl=http://www.charlestoncitypaper.com/charleston/peter-rowan-is-the-real-thing/Content%3Foid%3D2375711&docid=foAuqrF4JGTENM&imgurl=http://www.charlestoncitypaper.com/imager/backed-by-his-veteran-band-peter-rowan-delivers-inspired-music-of-all-shad/b/original/2375713/82bb/Peter_Rowan_Bluegrass_Band_by_Tim_Benko_resized.jpg&w=650&h=468&ei=6m37T8mJHKPd0QG__5D7Bg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=364&sig=107977707109648243708&page=1&tbnh=138&tbnw=181&start=0&ndsp=34&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:76&tx=127&ty=77&biw=1393&bih=959) do not. 🙂 > > I’ve actually got both a Martin D-18 and a Gibson Hummingbird, unfortunately the Martin is 200 miles away so I can’t compare the two, and my memory is not good enough to, well, remember exactly what the Martin sounds like. > > I am aware that Elvis was also known to play a Martin. If you think rockers are flashy (and most are) then let’s not get started on the Country guys- man, some of the guitars I have see have been over the top with countrified bling it’s not even funny. You need that D-18 back in your stable. I have one, too - pretty different from a Hummingbird. **E-Sabs** - great news! Glad it worked out. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2658 "2012-07-10T12:23:20Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > If you think rockers are flashy (and most are) then let’s not get started on the Country guys- man, some of the guitars I have see have been over the top with countrified bling it’s not even funny. > > You need that D-18 back in your stable. I have one, too - pretty different from a Hummingbird. > > **E-Sabs** - great news! Glad it worked out. Which is not to say that all bluegrassers are subdued and genteel. Witness my favorite, [Jimmy Martin](http://www.google.com/imgres?num=10&hl=en&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbnid=CxaPj9KyOiBtCM:&imgrefurl=http://www.rockabillyhall.com/COLRockRon68.html&docid=k-ZZvrPezJC0FM&imgurl=http://www.talentondisplay.com/rockron/rrJimmyMartin403.jpg&w=587&h=380&ei=KB78T6mtKIbz0gGw6bnVAg&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=1073&vpy=622&dur=1082&hovh=181&hovw=279&tx=204&ty=90&sig=107977707109648243708&page=1&tbnh=154&tbnw=207&start=0&ndsp=26&ved=1t:429,r:25,s:0,i:156&biw=1393&bih=916). ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2659 "2012-07-10T12:29:54Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Given your ambient approach to guitar, etc., if you like the basic ergonomics of the Kyser one-hander, you should know that they make partial capos, like the one \*\*Le Ministre \*\*modified himself, but which enable you to capo an alternate tuning - and you can switch to different capos to yield different tunings. Might be fun if you explore that approach in your playing. I did notice those alt-tuning Kysers, and it did start me thinking. There are possibilities there that might work in my style, as you correctly surmise. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2660 "2012-07-10T12:31:53Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > If you think rockers are flashy (and most are) then let’s not get started on the Country guys… Two words: Nudie Suits. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2012, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2661 "2012-07-11T04:53:28Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Trouble lives! > > Found someone with a only slightly battered sunburst JT90. Put the old neck, bridge, pickups on it. So what was damaged on Trouble? It sounds like the body itself needed replacing? That’s fairly unusual. ETA: congrats on the resurrection! ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2012, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/2662 "2012-07-12T09:43:26Z")
Lent it to a friend who begged. He got inspired and played Pete Townshend. He bought me a new one, then I bought me a new one, then I gave the first new one to WordMan. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172.md?page=132) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172.md?page=134)