# The Great Ongoing Guitar Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [January 31, 2010, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172 "2010-01-31T23:20:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 154
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3063 "2013-05-10T08:38:54Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > I’m sort of embarrassed to not know this, but I’ve never had a semi-solid/hollow body guitar. On an ES-335, are the pickups mounted to the soundboard or to the block? They’re mounted on the top, not the block. Semis and fully hollow guitars are very different beasts (and I say that as someone who owns and uses one of each). Semis are really solidbodies with hollow sides, not much like a hollowbody archtop at all in terms of sound or feel. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3064 "2013-05-10T14:16:03Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > They’re mounted on the top, not the block. > > Semis and fully hollow guitars are very different beasts (and I say that as someone who owns and uses one of each). Semis are really solidbodies with hollow sides, not much like a hollowbody archtop at all in terms of sound or feel. True. I haven’t worked on 335’s; the ones I’ve owned were set up fine. But I feel I should know a bit more - I am pretty sure the center block is solid, but I assume it is routed to make room for the pickup bottoms. I also can’t recall if the gluing surface between the center block and top and back is fully-contoured, or if there is a space with some high spots that receive the glue… They really are a typically-mellower-toned variant of a solidbody vs. having much overlap with hollow bodies. Speaking of which, I continue to enjoy my acoustic archtop. Solid-top archtops have a very different feel and sound vs. flat-tops - you don’t slap the strings when you strum, you kinda _push_ them. And the pick attack is different - you can get this great round tone. Finally, the tone of an archtop helps me realize more about the tone of a flat top. Flat tops have a rich, full tone with a lot of sustain. Kinda like a good baritone singer. Archtops don’t have nearly as much bass in the tone profile - the same note fretted on an archtop sounds higher, like the guy from Boston is singing it ;). It’s very cool - it makes the guitar sound more like a horn for single-note melody work. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3065 "2013-05-10T15:31:44Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > True. I haven’t worked on 335’s; the ones I’ve owned were set up fine. But I feel I should know a bit more - I am pretty sure the center block is solid, but I assume it is routed to make room for the pickup bottoms. I also can’t recall if the gluing surface between the center block and top and back is fully-contoured, or if there is a space with some high spots that receive the glue… There’s some variation, but typically (in my experience) the top is separate from the block in the pickup area, but from the bridge back to the end of the guitar the top meets the centre block and they’re glued together. The block is usually routed for pickups, and sometimes there’s a route for a wiring channel too. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3066 "2013-05-10T15:41:08Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > There’s some variation, but typically (in my experience) the top is separate from the block in the pickup area, but from the bridge back to the end of the guitar the top meets the centre block and they’re glued together. > > The block is usually routed for pickups, and sometimes there’s a route for a wiring channel too. Cool; thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3067 "2013-05-10T19:34:06Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > They’re mounted on the top, not the block. > > Semis and fully hollow guitars are very different beasts (and I say that as someone who owns and uses one of each). Semis are really solidbodies with hollow sides, not much like a hollowbody archtop at all in terms of sound or feel. When I typed “semi-solid/hollow body” I intended to imply that I’ve seen the same style of construction guitar be called a “semi-solid” body or a “semi-hollow” body and wasn’t certain the preferred name. I’m quite aware that a semi-solid is different from a hollowbody archtop. Okay, this explains to me why some semi-solids (like the Gibson/Epiphone Lucille) have NO sound holes in them. Thanks everyone. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3068 "2013-05-17T02:39:23Z")
Can anyone recommend a decent guitar tuner. I want something technical enough to set intonation, not a dumb tuner with two arrows and a note letter displayed. A meter of some sort with cents display, ability to set the reference range to something that’s not 440=A, etc. And _especially_ good tracking, smart tracking, it doesn’t get confused easily. I have a Korg CA-30 that should fit this category and… I just hate it. It is so goddamn squirrelly, so particular about what range of notes it can track reliably, that I just can’t trust it for working on a guitar or really day to day playing and recording. I can’t tune E,A,D except using octave harmonics, it gets really stupid if you don’t play really damn soft, etc etc. The tracking sucks, utterly. I used to have some other Korg model in a white case that was a little less stupid, but it finally broke and I’ve been suffering with this one. I’d be willing to spend reasonable cash, hopefully \< $100, for something better, something that’s not so - arg! - maddening to use. Something that’s a pleasure to operate. I don’t need to tune a piano, but I feel like I’m tuning a fish here. What do I need to buy or spend to get a tuner that tracks notes really darned well? ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3069 "2013-05-17T10:17:49Z")
I use the idiot tuners - I’d search on the Gear Page… ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3070 "2013-05-17T10:41:55Z")
I use a Boss TU-3 and am very happy with it. Price point is right around $100. It is rated to be accurate +/- 1 cent but your requirement for a cents \*display \*may be hard to meet at the price range you’re talking about. The reference is adjustable from 436-445 Hz. It’s a floor pedal that connects inline with other pedals. When you switch it on it cuts out the circuit so you can check your tuning in between tunes at a gig and nobody has to listen to you tuning up. It also has the the advantage of a power output jack so if you use an AC adapter to power it you can daisy chain your other pedals to it. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3071 "2013-05-17T12:22:05Z")
> [@CookingWithGas](#): > > I use a Boss TU-3 and am very happy with it. Price point is right around $100. It is rated to be accurate +/- 1 cent but your requirement for a cents \*display \*may be hard to meet at the price range you’re talking about. The reference is adjustable from 436-445 Hz. It’s a floor pedal that connects inline with other pedals. When you switch it on it cuts out the circuit so you can check your tuning in between tunes at a gig and nobody has to listen to you tuning up. It also has the the advantage of a power output jack so if you use an AC adapter to power it you can daisy chain your other pedals to it. I use one of these, as well. It works great for my purposes, but as you said, it has no cents display. It’s pretty fast, but I am not sure it tracks as fast as the tuner you desire. (I’ve never seen any tuner that I thought tracked as fast as I could hear the pitch change.) ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3072 "2013-05-17T17:39:56Z")
Snark SN-2. Fast, easy, cheap. Pick three. > **[Amazon.com: Snark ST-2 All Instrument Clip-On Chromatic Tuner : Musical...](https://www.amazon.com/Snark-Instrument-Clip-Chromatic-Tuner/dp/B003VWKPHC)** > > The Snark Chromatic All-Instrument Tuner provides a solid connection to your instrument or music stand, precise tuning, and advanced features too! Its full color display makes it fast and easy to tune, plus it's got a tap tempo metronome, pitch... [http://www.evetsusa.com/snarktuners/images/pdf/SN1\_SN2.pdf](http://www.evetsusa.com/snarktuners/images/pdf/SN1_SN2.pdf) (manual) Yes, you can calibrate the pitch. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3073 "2013-05-17T18:02:23Z")
Thanks for the feedback, guys. The consensus out there on the Gear Page seems to be that the [Sonic Research Turbo Tuner\* is really good for the kind of tuner I need, and it supposedly tracks really really well. I’d really like to get the ST-122A rather than the stomp version, but nobody seems to sell it, and even straight from Sonic it’s back ordered until July. Hmm. > [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Snark SN-2. Fast, easy, cheap. Pick three. > > [Amazon.com](http://www.amazon.com/Snark-Instrument-Clip-On-Chromatic-Tuner/dp/B003VWKPHC)]([http://www.turbo-tuner.com/](http://www.turbo-tuner.com/)) > [http://www.evetsusa.com/snarktuners/images/pdf/SN1\_SN2.pdf](http://www.evetsusa.com/snarktuners/images/pdf/SN1_SN2.pdf) (manual) > Yes, you can calibrate the pitch. I don’t think that one’s going to be good enough for doing a setup, but I’ll probably pick one up anyway for quick tuning. Tell me it tracks well. ? ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3074 "2013-05-17T18:39:38Z")
> [@squeegee](#): > > Thanks for the feedback, guys. The consensus out there on the Gear Page seems to be that the [Sonic Research Turbo Tuner\* is really good for the kind of tuner I need, and it supposedly tracks really really well. I’d really like to get the ST-122A rather than the stomp version, but nobody seems to sell it, and even straight from Sonic it’s back ordered until July. Hmm. [url=[http://www.turbo-tuner.com/](http://www.turbo-tuner.com/)]Fixed link.]([http://www.turbo-tuner.com/](http://www.turbo-tuner.com/)) Bluh. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2013, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3075 "2013-05-19T19:38:25Z")
The Snark tracks well. The SN8 tracks even faster than the -2, but the 2 has a wider range. [http://www.harmonycentral.com/t5/Electric-Guitars/snark-vs-turbo-tuner-surprising-results/td-p/33875216](http://www.harmonycentral.com/t5/Electric-Guitars/snark-vs-turbo-tuner-surprising-results/td-p/33875216) The Snark won’t mute you while you tune, admittedly. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2013, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3076 "2013-05-19T23:40:51Z")
Tracks well? Explanation please. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3077 "2013-05-20T00:02:25Z")
> [@Nars\_Glinley](#): > > Tracks well? Explanation please. Samples the sound frequently and responsively enough to be accurate for use in intonation. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3078 "2013-05-20T03:27:45Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > The Snark tracks well. The SN8 tracks even faster than the -2, but the 2 has a wider range. > [http://www.harmonycentral.com/t5/Electric-Guitars/snark-vs-turbo-tuner-surprising-results/td-p/33875216](http://www.harmonycentral.com/t5/Electric-Guitars/snark-vs-turbo-tuner-surprising-results/td-p/33875216) > The Snark won’t mute you while you tune, admittedly. Cool. Got one in my Amazon cart now. And no, I don’t care about stomp box performance stuff like mute while tuning. I am interested in setting up instruments and feeling confident that my tuner is reporting a tiny difference that exists, vs the one my current tuner just randomly comes up with. And if this vs that note in different positions on the fretboard really are slightly different, or if my tuner is just stoopid. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Clanger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@Small\_Clanger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Clanger)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3079 "2013-05-20T14:05:58Z")
This post was mostly written about a month back in reply to a conversation about learning solos note-for-note. So nothing about tuners, sorry! Three or four times a year I pick up a copy of _Guitar Techniques_ where they have the tab and dots for solos (of varying difficulty). You get a CD with the tracks with and without the lead part. I have learnt amongst other things: **Race With the Devil** (tricky (for me anyhow) rockabilly)) **Sylvia** by Focus, which I could never figure out by ear (turns out it changes key about fifty times). The Shadows/Hank Marvin’s **Apache** (not much of a stretch that one). Currently I am off book (and nearly up to speed) with Albert Lee’s solo for **Tear It Up**. This one is really fracking hard work. His licks are mostly not like anything like I’ve played before, he’s constantly sliding up and down the frets, in a couple of places he goes from 2nd position to 9th in one beat. And the tempo is bonkers, over 200 bpm. But it’s so satisfying going from “What the HELL was _that?_” to “_Nailed it_”. tl;dr I find it much more interesting to learn stuff out of my comfort zone. They also cover classical stuff (which I have been less persistent with) and shred (been there done that). This month’s issue\* has Deep Purple’s _Lazy_, but I don’t need help with that, been playing it for years 🙂 Anyone else here read this magazine? Maybe it’s just me, after all it is totally lacking any GAS-porn 🙂 - Well, it was this month when I wrote this. It’s Alvin\*\* Lee’s very flash _Going Home_ solo (from Woodstock) this actual month. \*\* As they point out in the blurb _Alvin_ Lee is the fast English blues guy, _Albert_ Lee is the fast English country guy. No need to mix them up. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3080 "2013-05-20T16:51:05Z")
So, I’m in the market for a tremolo. If it could do vibrato, that be neat, but not totally important. Durability is necessary, I’m hard on stuff. Another absolute necessity is for it to have a complete bypass switch. If it dies, I’d like to remove it from the chain mid-song with just a push of my foot, rather than having to unplug it. Stereo would be neat, as I’d get to use both mine and my wife’s amps with it, which would sound sweet. However, that’s not absolutely necessary either. I’ve been looking at the Electro-Harmonix range, mostly. I believe they all have true bypasses. The Stereo Pulsar runs about $85, is stereo, doesn’t do any pitch modulation, but it seems to be a extremely versatile tremolo. The Worm runs about $100, does some pretty nice vibrato/wah/phaser (it’s a seriously good country phaser) effects on top of the tremolo (but not at the same time), does not do stereo. The Wiggler runs about $200, is tube, sounds completely lush, does a pretty nice Leslie imitation. No stereo. A few reviews say it drives the signal a bit when it’s on. I’m also worried about the tubes living near my feet. How strong are those little cages they live in? I’m not really considering: The Holy Stain runs about $115, has a boatload of effects, but frankly sounds like a digital effects processor in the demo on their site. To be honest I’m seriously considering each of the 3 I mention liking above about evenly. Their features are about equal with their prices, which are very reasonable for what they do IMHO. Anyone want to warn me off of or recommend one of them? How about a favorite you’d like to recommend which would draw me away from any of them? ETA: Wow, no I hadn’t heard of that magazine, **Small Clanger** it sounds great, must check it out. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3081 "2013-05-20T22:19:47Z")
I find [this trem](http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=u0afpvOJ8fM&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Du0afpvOJ8fM) kind of intriguing. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/3082 "2013-05-20T23:22:14Z")
I guess it’s intriguing. The video mostly reminds me of why I never used tremolo. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172.md?page=153) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172.md?page=155)