# The Great Ongoing Guitar Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [January 31, 2010, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172 "2010-01-31T23:20:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 45
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2010, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/881 "2010-10-04T14:54:43Z")
Oh Le Ministre - I am so, so sorry. That really stinks. So it is just a side repair - the top wasn’t affected? The great news is that a side crack can typically be repaired almost invisibly and would not have a major effect on the tone…I have an old Martin dread with a 12" side crack on the treble / lower side and never even think about it… Best of luck and keep us posted. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/882 "2010-10-05T14:52:01Z")
Many thanks for your kind words, all of you. The situation as it stands - Edward Klein, the luthier who made the instrument, is the only one who can repair it. If anyone else repairs it or does work on it, it voids the warranty. So, I’ll have to ship it back to his atelier to get it repaired. That being the case, I spent yesterday going around Edmonton to various guitar shops/repair shops to ask their opinion on how much it would cost to fix and what seemed to be the cause of the damage. (There are some really fine shops here, by the way!) I took it around in the packaging it was shipped in. End result - everyone is of the opinion that it is repairable, and that the damage stems from the instrument being dropped on its end. Everyone was admiring the craftsmanship with which the instrument was made. I deliberately didn’t point out the damage, letting the luthiers find it for themselves. It was horrifying to hear ‘Now, what am I supposed to be looki- GAH! There is no God!’ out of one of them. Long & McQuade’s guitar repair person said simply that they don’t have the time nor the space to devote to a repair of that scope. (!!) Then the Purolator damage inspector phoned and we got together so that she could see the damage. She was kind, polite and sympathetic - her report, of which I have a copy, indicates compliance with Purolator standards. I also gave her photocopies of two estimates of repair costs, which she will include in her file. And that is where the matter rests for now. I’m reassured that none of the repair people said it was beyond fixing, and the damage inspection went as well as I could have hoped. Now to see what develops… ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/883 "2010-10-05T14:58:14Z")
Wow - a good first step. And again, I am not hearing any reports that contradict the most important point I made in my post: it appears that the damage doesn’t affect any of the major tone-producing/influencing components, like the top, bracing, etc… Continued good luck with this. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/884 "2010-10-05T19:59:23Z")
New thread: [Gibson Guitars’ List of the Top 50 Guitar Solos](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=580809) ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/885 "2010-10-05T23:58:03Z")
On a personal note: I now know about seven or nine chords without looking. Still can’t arbitrarily switch from one to another quite at full speed yet. But I’m pretty good at playing only the strings I want, strumming down or up… the problem is remembering to upstrum alternately, or in whatever weird pattern the songs I’m practicing want. Still, I console myself that what I’m playing generally looks harder, for the specific skill I’m practicing, than most normal songs do. And I know more chords than AC/DC or the Ramones. Now if I could just match the speed… ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/886 "2010-10-06T21:42:56Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > On a personal note: I now know about seven or nine chords without looking. Still can’t arbitrarily switch from one to another quite at full speed yet. But I’m pretty good at playing only the strings I want, strumming down or up… the problem is remembering to upstrum alternately, or in whatever weird pattern the songs I’m practicing want. … Just keep at it, and keep it fun. You’ll get there. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2010, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/887 "2010-10-15T18:06:16Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > I was favorably impressed. > > Contact info: Rick Benson 818-760-5089 or [rick@65amps.com](mailto:rick@65amps.com) > > Nice people. Even after I told them I was “just looking”, they still took time to talk to me. I was going back to this thread to review an upstream post and came across your review - I realized I hadn’t thanked you for it. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2010, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/888 "2010-10-15T19:21:11Z")
Man, I am having the worst trouble right now. I picked this up. > **[Amazon.com: VH1's 100 Greatest Songs of Rock & Roll: Easy Guitar with Notes...](https://www.amazon.com/VH1s-Greatest-Songs-Rock-Roll/dp/0634041118)** > > Amazon.com: VH1's 100 Greatest Songs of Rock & Roll: Easy Guitar with Notes & Tab Edition: 9780634041112: Hal Leonard Corp: Books because I figured it was time to just practice playing actual songs. Aaaannnd I’m about quarter speed. Not so good. More practice, I’ll get better. The problem is, I can’t get anything to sound right. I’m clearly not ‘getting’ what an amp means. I can almost play Wild Thing, though! Got that to maybe half speed without stopping. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2010, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/889 "2010-10-15T19:33:48Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Man, I am having the worst trouble right now. I picked this up. > [Amazon.com: VH1s 100 Greatest Songs of Rock and Roll Easy Guitar Songbook | Notes and Tab for Classic Hits | Beginner Rock Guitar Sheet Music | Includes Hey Jude, American Pie, Smells Like Teen Spirit: 9780634041112: Various: Books](http://www.amazon.com/VH1s-Greatest-Songs-Rock-Roll/dp/0634041118) > because I figured it was time to just practice playing actual songs. > Aaaannnd I’m about quarter speed. Not so good. More practice, I’ll get better. The problem is, I can’t get anything to sound right. I’m clearly not ‘getting’ what an amp means. > > I can almost play Wild Thing, though! Got that to maybe half speed without stopping. Excellent! Who needs speed at this point? Focus on finding a groove. Reminder - try playing the riffs on 1 string/with single notes to feel your way through the group and set the bar for what it should feel like groove-wise when your chording comes together. ETA: by the way, that looks like a smart book. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2010, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/890 "2010-10-16T01:28:29Z")
It’s pretty nice. Classic rock is rock I have in my bones… and for this book, music died as of Beat It. Plus, not so much alternate tunings or drop D on every song. That being said, I can make a pretty decent Chuck Berry noise, but nothing later, unless I hook the Vox up, and that’s bulky. Well, not so much bulky as ‘the headphone cables are too short’. Thinking of investing in a Pocket Pod to get some better practice amp up. How would you make the sound in… let’s say, Wild Thing, or Should I Stay or Should I Go? I’m guessing it’s really needing a lot of overdrive, and the Rock-It won’t do that. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2010, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/891 "2010-10-16T02:38:57Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > How would you make the sound in… let’s say, Wild Thing, or Should I Stay or Should I Go? I’m guessing it’s really needing a lot of overdrive, and the Rock-It won’t do that. I’d say moderate drive, a touch too much of reverb but not so much that it sounds muddy. Seriously, those songs aren’t that overdriven. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2010, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/892 "2010-10-16T14:08:46Z")
Reverb! That’s what I’m overlooking. I was figuring it was just they had cheap amps. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2010, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/893 "2010-10-17T01:53:59Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > > [@SteveG1](#): > > > > I was favorably impressed. > > > > Contact info: Rick Benson 818-760-5089 or [rick@65amps.com](mailto:rick@65amps.com) > > > > Nice people. Even after I told them I was “just looking”, they still took time to talk to me. > > I was going back to this thread to review an upstream post and came across your review - I realized I hadn’t thanked you for it. Thanks! It’s all good. I’ve been “advised” (as in sternly warned) that I don’t need any more ummmm stuff. Good thing my Strat arrived just before the “warning” 😃 I now have the 1978 LP Custom, the Takamine GS330S dreadnought, a 2006 MIM Telecaster, and a 1996 MIM Stratocaster. I had a bad case of GAS this year 😃 ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2010, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/894 "2010-10-18T11:54:44Z")
I agree with \*\*squeegee \*\*- not a lot of overdrive. What is your current rig for amplication? You might consider getting a POD or some other amp modeller/effects processor. For a compact, versatile way to go, it is my understanding they are hard to beat. \*\*SteveG1 \*\*- sounds like a good set of tools! ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2010, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/895 "2010-10-18T12:28:25Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Man, I am having the worst trouble right now. I picked this up. > [Amazon.com: VH1s 100 Greatest Songs of Rock and Roll Easy Guitar Songbook | Notes and Tab for Classic Hits | Beginner Rock Guitar Sheet Music | Includes Hey Jude, American Pie, Smells Like Teen Spirit: 9780634041112: Various: Books](http://www.amazon.com/VH1s-Greatest-Songs-Rock-Roll/dp/0634041118) > because I figured it was time to just practice playing actual songs. > Aaaannnd I’m about quarter speed. Not so good. More practice, I’ll get better. The problem is, I can’t get anything to sound right. I’m clearly not ‘getting’ what an amp means. > > I can almost play Wild Thing, though! Got that to maybe half speed without stopping. > [@WordMan](#): > > Excellent! Who needs speed at this point? Focus on finding a groove. Reminder - try playing the riffs on 1 string/with single notes to feel your way through the group and set the bar for what it should feel like groove-wise when your chording comes together. > > ETA: by the way, that looks like a smart book. My motivation to practice kind of ebbs and flows depending on where I am in the book I’m learning from. (Just got to some lessons on fingerstyle. Good to know, I’m sure, but it’s a bit dispiriting to go from making music to semi-futile plucking noises.) Can anyone recommend a book (perhaps the same one **E-Sabbath** is using) of songs that will sound decent but still be a bit of stretch? ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2010, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/896 "2010-10-18T12:31:41Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Can anyone recommend a book (perhaps the same one **E-Sabbath** is using) of songs that will sound decent but still be a bit of stretch? What type of music do you like and what type of guitar playing are you looking to explore a bit more? Fingerstyle looks indecipherable until you invest a ton of time getting a feel for it. Now that I do hybrid picking, I find myself picking through little patterns I would never have imagined having a feel for prior to that - and I’ve been playing for over 30 years… ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2010, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/897 "2010-10-18T13:25:18Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > What type of music do you like and what type of guitar playing are you looking to explore a bit more? I like playing almost anything that I can recognize. There’s some very simple Bach pieces in the book I’ve been learning from. I posted an MP3 of me playing _Jamaica Farewell_ to this thread a while ago. I was in the orchestra in high school, which I think gives me a big leg up on playing melodies. I don’t want to just take the path of least resistance, though. Chords and rhythm playing don’t come as easily to me, but it seems to be the core of any guitarist’s arsenal. I guess I don’t have a single style of music or playing that calls to me yet. (I’m not entirely sure I know what the various styles are.) My biggest concern is to not have everything dumbed down too much. I mean, some people can sit at a piano and tap out a recognizable melody with one finger, but that’s not really getting the best out of the instrument, is it? > [@](#): > > Fingerstyle looks indecipherable until you invest a ton of time getting a feel for it. Now that I do hybrid picking, I find myself picking through little patterns I would never have imagined having a feel for prior to that - and I’ve been playing for over 30 years… Oh, I can understand it.[sup]\*[/sup] I’m a very methodical person. I may never be able to jam or improvise worth a lick (and I have great respect for people who can), but anything that can be written down and systematized I can certainly understand. I’m just not very good at it. Yet. Maybe it’s just impossible to get a recommendation for the perfect guitar book. Only I will know what’s at just the right level to be a fun challenge. I wish they were arranged a little better in the book and guitar stores; from easiest to hardest, so I can zero in on the sweet spot. I want to make sure I’m using the terms right. What my book describes as fingerstyle is to hold a chord with the left hand, and to pluck the strings in a particular pattern with the right (rather than strumming). The thumb plays one of the top three strings, index, middle, and ring on the bottom three, respectively._Scarborough Fair_ seems to be a perfect example. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2010, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/898 "2010-10-18T13:28:28Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I like playing almost anything that I can recognize. There’s some very simple Bach pieces in the book I’ve been learning from. I posted an MP3 of me playing _Jamaica Farewell_ to this thread a while ago. > > I was in the orchestra in high school, which I think gives me a big leg up on playing melodies. I don’t want to just take the path of least resistance, though. Chords and rhythm playing don’t come as easily to me, but it seems to be the core of any guitarist’s arsenal. > > I guess I don’t have a single style of music or playing that calls to me yet. (I’m not entirely sure I know what the various styles are.) My biggest concern is to not have everything dumbed down too much. I mean, some people can sit at a piano and tap out a recognizable melody with one finger, but that’s not really getting the best out of the instrument, is it? > > Oh, I can understand it.[sup]\*[/sup] I’m a very methodical person. I may never be able to jam or improvise worth a lick (and I have great respect for people who can), but anything that can be written down and systematized I can certainly understand. I’m just not very good at it. Yet. > > Maybe it’s just impossible to get a recommendation for the perfect guitar book. Only I will know what’s at just the right level to be a fun challenge. I wish they were arranged a little better in the book and guitar stores; from easiest to hardest, so I can zero in on the sweet spot. > I want to make sure I’m using the terms right. What my book describes as fingerstyle is to hold a chord with the left hand, and to pluck the strings in a particular pattern with the right (rather than strumming). The thumb plays one of the top three strings, index, middle, and ring on the bottom three, respectively._Scarborough Fair_ seems to be a perfect example. All good. I can’t possibly imagine what it would be like to learn the way you do and not improvise - since that is the ONLY way I can learn - but variety is what keeps it interesting. Have you explored youtube? Start with a search on “learning fingerstyle guitar” or something like that and I bet you will find dozens upon dozens of wannabee teachers. Find one who speaks your language and go from there… ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2010, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/899 "2010-10-18T14:08:54Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > All good. I can’t possibly imagine what it would be like to learn the way you do and not improvise - since that is the ONLY way I can learn - but variety is what keeps it interesting. I can’t imagine doing it any other way. If I just sit down and try to tap out something on a piano, it just comes out as random noise. Maybe someday I’ll have an intuitive sense of what sounds I want to come out of a guitar. My book has some sections for improvising, but I haven’t gotten to them yet. (There’s a CD that came with the book, to play along to. For the improvs I guess it just has a steady backing groove to keep the rhythm.) For now, the only thing that works for me is to be methodical about it. > [@](#): > > Have you explored youtube? Start with a search on “learning fingerstyle guitar” or something like that and I bet you will find dozens upon dozens of wannabee teachers. Find one who speaks your language and go from there… I don’t think I need that sort of help. I really do understand what the lesson is trying to teach me, and I muddle through it if I take it slow enough. I may need to find a better hand position so my fingers line up with the strings better, but really it’s just a matter of practice. I just thought it might help to have some more melodic pieces to practice while I’m struggling through the early stage of a new technique. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172/900 "2010-10-18T16:20:45Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I can’t imagine doing it any other way. If I just sit down and try to tap out something on a piano, it just comes out as random noise. Maybe someday I’ll have an intuitive sense of what sounds I want to come out of a guitar. My book has some sections for improvising, but I haven’t gotten to them yet. (There’s a CD that came with the book, to play along to. For the improvs I guess it just has a steady backing groove to keep the rhythm.) For now, the only thing that works for me is to be methodical about it. That makes perfect sense - whatever works and keeps you playing. For me, I know how to make chords, but I have never done much fingerpicking. Now that I am using both a flatpick and my fingers, I just kinda noodle a lot - drifting between chords and picking patterns and listening for stuff that sounds cool. At this point, I have “written” 4 - 5 riff/songs that sound cool, work my hybrid picking and have changes through chords. I noodle on those and try to stretch them out further, throwing in lead fills or other chord changes to see what works. That’s how I am trying to build my technique…and have fun. > [@](#): > > I don’t think I need that sort of help. I really do understand what the lesson is trying to teach me, and I muddle through it if I take it slow enough. I may need to find a better hand position so my fingers line up with the strings better, but really it’s just a matter of practice. > > I just thought it might help to have some more melodic pieces to practice while I’m struggling through the early stage of a new technique. That makes sense - for me, I try to find songs l like (regardless of their melodic sophistication) and then work on those. Then, as always, I am in front of the TV with an unplugged electric, working through my quota of reps while I watch the baseball playoffs… Best of luck! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172.md?page=44) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-guitar-thread/527172.md?page=46)