# The Great Ongoing Space Exploration Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** science-math\ **Created:** [November 16, 2020, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703 "2020-11-16T12:18:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/102 "2021-03-18T21:52:05Z")
A fully-stacked Starship is going to be one impressive vehicle. The Super Heavy booster is already significantly taller than a Falcon 9, and almost triple the diameter. With the upper stage on top, it’ll really be a monster. I’m curious what they do about landing legs for the booster. Musk says they plan on “catching” the booster eventually, but that has to be a far-out thing, if it ever happens. In the meantime they’ll need something else. Maybe just a half-dozen beefed-up Falcon 9 legs… ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/103 "2021-03-18T21:54:53Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > A fully-stacked Starship is going to be one impressive vehicle. The Super Heavy booster is already significantly taller than a Falcon 9, and almost triple the diameter. With the upper stage on top, it’ll really be a monster. Yup [![](https://cdn.businessinsider.de/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/spacex-starhopper-starship-nasa-saturn-v-apollo-mk1-height-comparison-graphic-illustration-chart.png) ](https://cdn.businessinsider.de/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/spacex-starhopper-starship-nasa-saturn-v-apollo-mk1-height-comparison-graphic-illustration-chart.png) ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/104 "2021-03-24T01:10:34Z")
> **[Europe is starting to freak out about the launch dominance of SpaceX](https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/03/european-leaders-say-an-immediate-response-needed-to-the-rise-of-spacex/)** > > The Falcon 9 has come to dominate commercial satellite launches. Elon Musk’s response to this article on Twitter today: “They are aiming too low. Only rockets that are fully & rapidly reusable will be competitive. Everything else will seem like a cloth biplane in the age of jets.” Then later he commented… “SpaceX will be landing Starships on Mars well before 2030. The really hard threshold is making Mars Base Alpha self-sustaining.” ESA is surely facing an existential crisis right now. Their plans are becoming outdated fast and EU red tape (which I can tell you from experience is considerable) will not help matters. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/105 "2021-05-05T18:12:50Z")
This Chinese rocket is expected to fall back to Earth in the next two or three days and could land absolutely anywhere: > **[Chinese rocket is hurtling back to Earth after space station launch](https://www.newscientist.com/article/2276526-chinese-rocket-is-hurtling-back-to-earth-after-space-station-launch/)** > > On 29 April, China launched the first module of its biggest space station yet atop a Long March 5B rocket. Now, part of that rocket is hurtling back towards Earth, and there is no way to predict exactly where or when it will land ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2021, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/106 "2021-05-15T10:29:03Z")
More Chinese activity but this time a bit more significant. They have landed a rover on Mars with a somewhat familiar technique: > **[China lands its Zhurong rover on Mars](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-57122914)** > > The six-wheeled robot has made the hazardous descent to the surface of the Red Planet, China announces. Nevertheless it is a great achievement. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2021, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/107 "2021-05-15T17:51:26Z")
Some failure: > **[Rocket Lab's satellite launch from New Zealand site fails](https://apnews.com/article/new-zealand-technology-09c0ee1744faf35d96e29b078fb348bb)** > > LONG BEACH, Calif. (AP) — California-based Rocket Lab said a launch of satellites from its facility in New Zealand failed Saturday. The problem occurred during ignition of the Electron rocket’s second stage, the company said in a statement. And some success: > **[China lands on Mars in major advance for its space ambitions](https://apnews.com/article/china-technology-business-science-e1c1d0679aa78a8cc79c04a4d1375322)** > > BEIJING (AP) — China landed a spacecraft on Mars for the first time on Saturday, a technically challenging feat more difficult than a moon landing, in the latest step forward for its ambitious goals in space. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2021, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/108 "2021-05-15T18:33:39Z")
Was watching the Rocket Lab launch last night. Stage separation seemed off, though it was dark and hard to tell, and then the cameras cut out. Telemetry looked wrong too, but again that got cut. A couple minutes later and they ended the webcast. They hadn’t announced anything official at that point but it was pretty clear they were not going to space today. Hopefully they get back on their feet quickly. Electron is still a pretty new vehicle. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2021, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/109 "2021-05-27T22:28:44Z")
A map of dark matter has been created for an eighth of the night sky: > **[Astronomers create largest map of the universe’s dark matter](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/may/27/astronomers-create-largest-map-universe-dark-matter-einstein)** > > International team reveal vast cosmic voids over the Earth’s skies that could challenge Einstein ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2021, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/110 "2021-05-27T22:58:36Z")
A somewhat related article that I saw recently: > **[How a weird theory of gravity could break cause-and-effect](https://www.livescience.com/modified-gravity-faster-than-light-travel.html)** > > New research has found a critical flaw in modified gravity theories: They allow for effects to occur without causes and for information to travel faster than the speed of light. This is bad … for modified gravity. > The team of physicists put MONDian theories to the test and found that they contain features that allow for non-locality and acausality. In other words, if MONDian theories are correct, then it’s possible for events to happen without a cause and for effects to travel instantaneously, which violates the speed-of-light limit in the universe. MOND is a proposed alternative for dark matter. Instead of hidden mass, it proposes that gravity doesn’t fall off at the same rate as general relativity says it should. This is already fairly problematic, but it turns out that you can’t even preserve locality and causality with them. That should put another nail into the MOND coffin… but dark matter isn’t without its problems, either. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2021, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/111 "2021-05-27T23:15:43Z")
Seems to me if there’s repeated non-conformity to the existing laws of physics in the observable universe then everything must be in doubt including things like the expansion of the universe. However there are not too many scientific agnostics who can earn a living. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2021, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/112 "2021-05-28T12:48:03Z")
Depends a bit on how widespread they are. Pockets of apparent non-conformity imply there is something locally different there, perhaps a concentration of rare but real AsYetUnknownium. Which does not invalidate what we think we know, just widens the error bars on it a bit sometimes someplace. For TBD but probably small values of “bit”, “sometimes”, and “someplace”. Conversely, widespread non-conformity from existing expectations, like the surprise following the discovery of the CMB, pretty well says there’s something significant, if not fundamental, missing from the current theory. So the “bit” part may be small in magnitude, but the “sometimes” and “someplace” turn into “everywhere” and “always” _as far as we can tell so far_. Ref the two articles, if indeed we discover that the gravity equations need a few new terms to account for dark matter, but at very large scales dark matter is, on average, evenly distributed, the effect on much of cosmology will be a bit like the effects near-_c_ velocities have on mass and time versus normal earth-bound engineering. IOW very significant in the very high speed corner of the envelope, and a rounding error in 99.9% of it. At the particular scale where dark matter anisotropies matter, it will matter a LOT. But that scale is neither whole universe, nor whole Solar system. It’s somewhere in between. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2021, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/113 "2021-06-02T20:20:33Z")
> **[NASA Selects 2 Missions to Study ‘Lost Habitable’ World of Venus](https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/nasa-selects-2-missions-to-study-lost-habitable-world-of-venus)** > > Following a competitive, peer-review process, DAVINCI+ and VERITAS were chosen based on their potential scientific value and the feasibility of their development plans. DAVINCI+ seems the most interesting to me: > DAVINCI+ will measure the composition of Venus’ atmosphere to understand how it formed and evolved, as well as determine whether the planet ever had an ocean. The mission consists of a descent sphere that will plunge through the planet’s thick atmosphere, making precise measurements of noble gases and other elements to understand why Venus’ atmosphere is a runaway hothouse compared the Earth’s. We could learn some very interesting things about the Earth with this mission. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2021, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/114 "2021-07-23T22:42:07Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > The inevitable result of the previous decision about the Europa Clipper (EC) and SLS: > … > All that remains to be see is which commercial provider they choose. And it’s official: > **[SpaceX to launch the Europa Clipper mission for a bargain price](https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/07/spacex-to-launch-the-europa-clipper-mission-for-a-bargain-price/)** > > Decision comes after shaking issue with SLS rocket made it untenable. Launching on the SLS would have cost _$3 billion_: $2B for the launch itself, and $1B for the modifications needed to ensure the rocket doesn’t vibrate the probe into pieces. Instead, NASA will pay $178M for a Falcon Heavy launch. This is more than a usual Falcon Heavy mission, but it’s almost certain that NASA will be using the FH in expendable mode, which obviously increases the price. There are likely other mission-assurance costs factored in. NASA claims this is the total launch services contract price. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2021, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/115 "2021-08-29T01:44:02Z")
Astra did not go to space today: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/O8Tdm797BzM/maxresdefault.jpg "Astra Test Flight (Launch Vehicle 0006)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8Tdm797BzM) This is among the most… _remarkable_ liftoffs I’ve ever seen. Major props to their vehicle control team, which seems to have prevented their pad from being destroyed. Sure, they didn’t make orbit, but losing the pad is a much bigger setback than losing the vehicle. Let’s hope for the fourth time being the charm. Worked for SpaceX, at least. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2021, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/116 "2021-08-29T05:06:37Z")
I’ve never seen a rocket go sideways right off the pad before. At least not without immediately crashing, that is. In other news, Blue Origin had another suborbital launch the other day. This time without any billionaires (or anyone else) on board. Ho-hum. Wake me up when you’re going to do something interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2021, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/117 "2021-08-29T05:22:14Z")
It’s happened to me many times… in Kerbal Space Program. It was fairly clear early on, and [confirmed later](https://twitter.com/Kemp/status/1431831601445425157), that they lost one out of the five engines very early into flight, which brought their thrust/weight ratio from a healthy 1.25 to about 1.0. So it just hovered for a bit until it burned off enough fuel to rise. But of course that was too wasteful to make orbit, or even stay within the launch corridor. Still, it was impressive to see their control systems deal with the situation, keeping the rocket upright and away from the pad. Maybe there was a bit of luck, too. How many companies will make orbit before Blue Origin does? Or before BO even ships their BE-4 engines to ULA, or finishes their lawsuit against the government? Time will tell, I guess… ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2021, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/118 "2021-09-15T21:43:14Z")
SpaceX is a few hours from launching the Inspiration4 mission: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/3pv01sSq44w/maxresdefault.jpg "Inspiration4 | Launch") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pv01sSq44w) It’s the first flight to orbit with a fully-private crew. IMO, it’s a lot more interesting than the Blue Origin or Virgin Galactic rides. Those lasted a few minutes; this will last a few _days_. The astronauts will be doing some scientific work as well as fundraising for St. Jude’s Children’s Hospital. Unlike other Dragon missions, this one won’t be docking/berthing with the ISS. Hence they’ve managed to replace the docking adapter with a nice hemispherical window. Should be a great view. That’s also where the toilet is located, so they’ll probably have the human record for the best view taking a dump. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2021, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/119 "2021-09-16T00:15:14Z")
And they’re in orbit! Looks like a fun ride, as always. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2021, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/120 "2021-09-16T00:30:39Z")
That was awesome! My aunt sent me a video she shot with her phone from her porch, too! ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2021, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/121 "2021-09-16T00:49:07Z")
Nice! Late evening launches always have the best views. There is a Netflix documentary on the mission. I haven’t watched it yet but I hear it’s pretty good. I assume there will be another after we get the actual mission footage. Of the four, Chris Sembroski seems the most relatable to me. He’s not one of those super type-A personalities, but has always been interested in STEM subjects (and was a counselor at Space Camp, which I went to as a kid). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703.md?page=7)