# The Great Ongoing Space Exploration Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** science-math\ **Created:** [November 16, 2020, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703 "2020-11-16T12:18:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 82
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2024, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1622 "2024-10-04T22:20:53Z")
Scott Manley did a great analysis of the launch. The nozzle came off but the vehicle heroically still made it to its orbit. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2024, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1623 "2024-10-04T22:25:37Z")
I’ll have to watch that later today. Modern control systems are great, anyway. They easily compensated for the thrust loss. Both the first and second stage burns had to go longer, though. It wouldn’t have made orbit if it were a large payload right at the margins. It’s one thing for something like Starship to lose a couple of engines… but this seems a bit worse. It was a non-trivial loss of performance even if it still made orbit. Not sure why they seem so optimistic about certification. If it had been some heavy NSA bird, it would have been a loss of mission. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2024, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1624 "2024-10-05T01:38:56Z")
Basically, rocketry is working you way down the long, long list of ways your rocket can commit suicide and trying your best to forestall them, until it has to really work to find an outlier you overlooked. Sort of like monitoring detainees in prison or psychiatric hospital on suicide watch. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2024, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1625 "2024-10-05T03:44:57Z")
This idea isn’t new, but nevertheless seems like a real… longshot: > **[A Human Future In Space | Longshot](https://www.longshotspace.com/)** > > Longshot is a hypersonic launch startup based in Oakland, California, committed to a vision of the future in which humanities reach extends to the stars. I like the cut of their jib, though: > This is why we are focused on kinetic launch. The lowest possible cost for putting mass to orbit with simple and reliable technology - guns. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2024, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1626 "2024-10-05T04:37:10Z")
It worked for Georges Méliès, after all. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2024, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1627 "2024-10-05T04:41:10Z")
But not so great for Gerald Bull: > **[Gerald Bull](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Bull)** > > Gerald Vincent Bull (March 9, 1928 – March 22, 1990) was a Canadian engineer who developed long-range artillery. He moved from project to project in his quest to economically launch a satellite using a huge artillery piece, to which end he designed the Project Babylon "supergun" for Saddam Hussein's government in Iraq. > Bull was assassinated outside his apartment in Brussels, Belgium, in March 1990. His assassination is believed to be the work of the Mossad over his work for the Iraqi government.... These Longshot guys should probably make sure they only buy walkie-talkies from legitimate sources… ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2024, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1628 "2024-10-05T19:44:56Z")
Hey, hey, **HEY**!! Be careful where you point that thing; it might be loaded. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2024, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1629 "2024-10-05T19:46:34Z")
Mr. Barbicane at the Baltimore Gun Club approves. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2024, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1630 "2024-10-14T17:09:53Z")
Europa Clipper launches: > **[NASA launches mission to a moon of Jupiter to find out if it could support life](https://www.nbcnews.com/science/space/nasa-launch-europa-clipper-mission-icy-moon-jupiter-rcna171706)** > > NASA's Europa Clipper probe will study Jupiter's moon Europa, which is thought to have an underground ocean and a potentially habitable environment. Looks successful so far. As a reminder, Europa Clipper was originally intended to fly on the SLS rocket. In fact, it had been _legally mandated_ by Congress to launch on SLS. However, it turned out there wasn’t going to be an SLS available. And if there was, the solid rocket boosters would have shaken the probe to bits. So they opened up the competition to other rockets, which basically meant Falcon Heavy. The trip will be a tad slower since SLS is more powerful than Falcon Heavy, but as an upside the SpaceX launch saved 2 _billion_ dollars. $200M vs. $2.2B, roughly. It’s a fully expendable launch so they can get every last bit of performance. A worthy cause. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2024, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1631 "2024-10-14T17:21:44Z")
Just 23 years behind schedule! (I refer to the fictional probe to Europa in the 1960s book and film _2001: A Space Odyssey_.) I gather that this isn’t a coincidence – that, even in the mid-60s, we knew (or strongly suspected?) that Europa contained lots of liquid water. How _did_ we know that, then? Spectral signatures taken with big (Earth-surface) telescopes of the era? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2024, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1632 "2024-10-14T18:26:27Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > It’s a fully expendable launch so they can get every last bit of performance. A worthy cause. Did they use stages that were getting long in the tooth anyway and so were flagged for being expended? > [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > the SpaceX launch saved 2 _billion_ dollars. $200M vs. $2.2B, roughly Probably just in time for Boeing to insist they need an extra 2 billion in funding… ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2024, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1633 "2024-10-14T18:39:02Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Did they use stages that were getting long in the tooth anyway and so were flagged for being expended? Center core was all new. They have a lot of structural changes so they can’t be reused from Falcon 9 missions. And as of yet, they’ve never recovered a center core. Mostly they’re deliberately expended anyway since Falcon Heavy missions tend to have extreme requirements. The side boosters had 6 flights each. So not nearly at life leader levels, which is currently at 23 flights. Six flights might well be at _peak_ reliability. Well out of the first part of the bathtub curve, while not entering the later part. But in any case, they still got a good amount of use. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2024, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1634 "2024-10-14T18:43:40Z")
And to think that we may be just a couple of years away from Starship being _cheaper_ per flight than Falcon 9 or Heavy, as well as having more payload. ---
**Author:** ![Ponderoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponderoid/32/19221_2.png) [@Ponderoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponderoid)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2024, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1635 "2024-10-14T18:52:42Z")
I believe nothing was known about water on Europa until the Voyager missions that flew by Jupiter in 1979. Clarke didn’t write anything about exploring a water-rich Europa until he wrote the sequel, _2010_ in 1982. Of course he used all the latest scientific knowledge available at that time. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2024, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1636 "2024-10-14T20:45:07Z")
Got it - thanks! ---
**Author:** ![zimaane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a3d4f5/32.png) [@zimaane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zimaane)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1637 "2024-10-15T01:08:37Z")
Iirc it was theorized in the 60s or 70s that the moons of Jupiter could be heated by tidal interactions, but it wasnt confirmed until the flybys. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2024, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1638 "2024-10-20T07:00:30Z")
So, as of a couple hours ago, SpaceX has launched 6 rockets in less than 7 days. One Starship, one Falcon Heavy, and four Falcon 9s. Five of those had recovered boosters. Three of the Falcon 9 flights were for Starlink, with the last one for OneWeb… which is Starlink’s competitor (they switched to SpaceX after Russia invaded Ukraine and seized their satellites). Getting really damn close to [A Rocket a Day](http://www.astronautix.com/a/arocketadayhighcostsaway.html). But what’s funny about that proposal is that they only suggested a payload of 2000 kg, 365 days a year. 730 metric tons. But SpaceX already put 1200 tons into orbit just in 2023, and will easily beat that this year (may have already beaten that). SpaceX did just win a contract for 8 launches for the Space Force: > **[SpaceX secures new contracts worth $733.5 million for national security space...](https://spacenews.com/spacex-secures-new-contracts-worth-733-5-million-for-national-security-space-missions/)** > > The company won the first task orders issued under the National Security Space Launch (NSSL) Phase 3 Lane 1 program \<$100M each. Actually, I find this one somewhat unfortunate. This was the Space Force “Lane 1” program, which was intended for higher-risk providers that had not yet met the full NSSL certification. I.e., something intended to support _new_ entrants. It would have been nice to see Rocket Lab or someone else appear here. But only SpaceX and ULA showed up, and I guess ULA’s bid was uncompetitive since they awarded the whole thing to SpaceX. There will be more rounds and I hope even Blue Origin wins a few, just to kick their butts into gear. For now, the steamroller continues… ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2024, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1639 "2024-10-21T22:20:04Z")
Not exactly “exploration”, but a couple of days ago I saw reports of contact being lost with a large communications satellite in geosynch that experienced an anomaly and was likely unrecoverable. Now updates say that the “anomaly” was “separating into dozens of pieces” and the likelihood of recovery has gone _way_ down. > **[Space Force Is Tracking New Debris Field After Communications Satellite...](https://gizmodo.com/space-force-is-tracking-uncontrolled-debris-after-communications-satellite-breaks-apart-2000514385)** > > This follows the failure of another satellite from the same series that may have been due to a meteoroid impact. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2024, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1640 "2024-10-21T22:24:36Z")
Yeah, Jonathan McDowell reported that a couple of days ago: > > We are working closely with **Boeing** , the satellite manufacturer, to address the situation Does Boeing have _any_ division that isn’t completely FUBAR? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2024, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703/1641 "2024-10-21T22:44:17Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Does Boeing have _any_ division that isn’t completely FUBAR? Possibly struck from board of directors’ minutes: “Shut up and hand over your tithes, peasants! This is OUR country! We are the GODS!” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703.md?page=81) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-ongoing-space-exploration-thread/925703.md?page=83)