# The Great Un-Fork Hillary Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 12, 2015, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458 "2015-04-12T00:17:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/721 "2015-07-01T16:41:46Z")
The free-fall continues! ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/722 "2015-07-01T16:59:43Z")
I know, right? It seems like a short time ago where we were right around the corner from general election polls showing Clinton trailing multiple GOP candidates and the DNC pulling their support. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/723 "2015-07-01T18:25:39Z")
Weren’t there polls just a few days ago showing Sanders closing the gap with Clinton? Or did I dream that? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/724 "2015-07-01T18:33:43Z")
There was a CNN/WMUR poll of New Hampshire democrats that showed Sanders within 8 points that got some press. There was also Bloomberg/St. Anselm poll released the same day that showed Clinton with a 32 point lead in New Hampshire. The second poll didn’t get much press at all. [CNN/WMUR](http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2015/images/06/25/062515goppoll.pdf) [Bloomberg/St. Anselm](http://images.businessweek.com/cms/2015-06-24/NH-methodology-public.pdf) ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/725 "2015-07-01T20:12:41Z")
Clinton raised $45mil+ her first quarter, beating Obama’s previous first quarter record of $41.9mil ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/726 "2015-07-01T22:18:19Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **adaher** : > > They have a toxic brand, yet they win pretty often. Imagine how screwed the Democrats would be if they put Hillary Clinton up against a non-toxic brand. Not screwed at all. There’s nothing wrong with losing to another party sometimes, if the other party is sane and benevolent. The fact that the Republicans would screw over the country if elected is precisely what makes them toxic. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/727 "2015-07-02T01:09:25Z")
To voters, that’s not actually what makes them toxic. The ideology isn’t the problem. Voters have been quite happy to fill Congress with right-wing ideologues, as well as elect governors and state legislatures filled with the same. All that’s left to conquer is the Presidency and the one standing in the way is… Hillary Clinton? A known liar? Seriously? You’re making this too easy. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/728 "2015-07-02T01:50:55Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > To voters, that’s not actually what makes them toxic. The ideology isn’t the problem. Voters have been quite happy to fill Congress with right-wing ideologues, as well as elect governors and state legislatures filled with the same. Oh okay I’ll bite. So what is it, in your opinion, that is poisoning the brand? Hey no question in my mind that Hillary is beatable. The only thing standing in the way of beating her is the complete lack of adequacy by any metric of any the GOP hopefuls as alternatives. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/729 "2015-07-02T02:47:04Z")
They needlessly alienate a lot of people that would normally be on their side. That’s one. The other problem is failure to govern effectively at the federal level. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/730 "2015-07-02T03:31:31Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > They needlessly alienate a lot of people that would normally be on their side. That’s one. The other problem is failure to govern effectively at the federal level. And which one of those DOESN’T stem from their ideology? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/731 "2015-07-02T03:42:09Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > To voters, that’s not actually what makes them toxic. The ideology isn’t the problem. Voters have been quite happy to fill Congress with right-wing ideologues, as well as elect governors and state legislatures filled with the same. > > All that’s left to conquer is the Presidency and the one standing in the way is… Hillary Clinton? A known liar? Seriously? You’re making this too easy. “A known liar” – as compared too… who, exactly? I’ll add this one to the **adaher** prediction list. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2015, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/732 "2015-07-03T14:01:52Z")
Meanwhile it would be great if Sanders keeps in it long enough to make the primary process interesting. Let us assume the highly probable, that he loses both the Iowa caucus and the NH primary. If his performance in each at least “exceeds expectations” (and it might) does his campaign stay alive for awhile? It is no free fall but the latest Iowa numbers do show Hillary down from 60 in the previous Qunnipiac poll to 52 with Sander having gained. And again NH is where he should do the best of anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/733 "2015-07-08T17:57:38Z")
Interesting article on 538 today: [Bernie Sanders Could Win Iowa And New Hampshire. Then Lose Everywhere Else](http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/bernie-sanders-could-win-iowa-and-new-hampshire-then-lose-everywhere-else/). Basically it says Sanders is likely to do better in Iowa and New Hampshire than almost any other state (Vermont and Massachusetts being similar to IA and NH). > [@](#): > > Put another way, Iowa and New Hampshire aren’t representative of the more diverse electorates that Democrats will turn out elsewhere. It just so happens that the idiosyncrasies of the first two states match Sanders’s strengths and Clinton’s relative weaknesses. I personally don’t think Sanders will win either state based on the available information, but my opinion will change if see some polls with Sanders in the lead. So far only one poll (of NH released 6/25) has him within single digits. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/734 "2015-07-08T18:01:30Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > If his performance in each at least “exceeds expectations” (and it might) does his campaign stay alive for awhile? If, as I’ve always suspected, he is running as Clinton’s sparring partner, perhaps even with her funding him, in return for getting his views known nationally and maybe pulling her that way, then he’s in for as long as she needs him to be in. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/735 "2015-07-11T07:25:14Z")
Clinton decides she doesn’t need Colorado: > **[Hillary Clinton’s push on gun control marks a shift in presidential politics](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/clinton-makes-big-gun-control-pitch-marking-shift-in-presidential-politics/2015/07/09/4309232c-2580-11e5-b72c-2b7d516e1e0e_story.html?hpid=z1)** > > Democrats have often been timid on the issue, but she is inviting debate and vowing to take on the NRA. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/736 "2015-07-11T12:47:43Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Clinton decides she doesn’t need Colorado: > > [http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/clinton-makes-big-gun-control-pitch-marking-shift-in-presidential-politics/2015/07/09/4309232c-2580-11e5-b72c-2b7d516e1e0e\_story.html?hpid=z1](http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/clinton-makes-big-gun-control-pitch-marking-shift-in-presidential-politics/2015/07/09/4309232c-2580-11e5-b72c-2b7d516e1e0e_story.html?hpid=z1) Right, 'cause Colorado voted twice for that noted recreational shooter and NRA member Barack Obama. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/737 "2015-07-11T13:04:41Z")
Probably taking political advice from her husband, who’s total lack of political skill is widely known. Yessiree, Bob, nothing but blue skies and sunshine ahead for the Republican Party! ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/738 "2015-07-11T13:16:51Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Right, 'cause Colorado voted twice for that noted recreational shooter and NRA member Barack Obama. Obama shied away from gun control. Colorado has been deep red since his gun control push, complete with recalls of safe Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/739 "2015-07-11T13:31:17Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Obama shied away from gun control. He’s said very similar things to what Hillary did. > [@](#): > > Colorado has been deep red since his gun control push, complete with recalls of safe Democrats. And yet Obama won it twice, saying similar things to Hillary. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/740 "2015-07-11T16:24:59Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Colorado has been deep red since his gun control push, complete with recalls of safe Democrats. 1. The two people who won the recalls lost the next election and are no longer in the legislature. 2. The legislation that triggered the recalls is still law. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458.md?page=38)