# The Great Un-Fork Hillary Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 12, 2015, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458 "2015-04-12T00:17:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/61 "2015-04-13T16:39:06Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Remember, you don’t have to outrun the bear. You only have to outrun the other guy you went camping with. Her _final_ ace in the hole is the propensity of the Republicans to put together a ticket that just can’t win. I expect a Cruz/Bachmann like ticket. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/62 "2015-04-13T16:47:16Z")
With a resigned sigh I have to say I don’t see anyone else (who’s likely to run) getting the nomination, nor do I think anyone else (who’s likely to run) would do as well against his/her Republican opponent. Not that this person would _lose_ necessarily, I just think Hillary would do better. Of those who _aren’t_ running? The only person I think who’d give her a good run for her money for the nomination would be Al Gore. He’s got everything, both an impressive political service record, the experience of campaigning\*, and yet he seems like an “outsider” having been out in the woods (sometimes literally) doing actual good for the world. His environmentalism now seems like visionary rather than pie-in-the-sky. He’s not tainted by having backed the Iraq war or any NSA bullshit. Importantly, he’s not the same campaigner/speaker he was back in 2000–that bullshit “wooden” comment won’t fly given how well he’s comported himself in the past fifteen years as a spokesperson and advocate. Despite his age (which is the same as Hillary’s) he’s admired by young people too. And I think many Democrats–and Independents–would _love_ the chance to put him where he should’ve been in January 2001. I would vote for him in a heartbeat, with an enthusiasm far exceeding that which I’d show for Clinton. But he won’t run, and I understand why, for several reasons. Not the least of which is that the Clinton folks would feel betrayed and it would be a difficult, internecine battle that could cause some damage. Don’t get me wrong, there is a lot to like about Hillary Clinton and I have always admired many of her stances. She will certainly have my support, as would any “D” candidate outside of… um… well, I can’t think of an option that would _ever_ make me choose an “R” candidate, so I guess I’m Yellow Dog through and through. IMO there is no Democratic candidate worse than any Republican candidate. Oh okay, I just thought of a scenario: Jim Cooper vs. Mike Bloomberg. 😃 In that case, yeah, I’d vote (R). Not a big Bloomberg fan but I’ve known for decades he’s a donkey in elephant’s clothing. So Clinton or whoever the nominee is will have my loyalty. Nevertheless, my heart will always weep for what should’ve been in 2000. I want President Gore. ☹ - Likely one of the many reasons he _doesn’t_ want to run again. After what he went through, I can’t blame him. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/63 "2015-04-13T16:53:33Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I’m not sure how much the VP’s home matters. It’s not as though Ryan delivered any of the Midwest for Romney (states Romney won like Indiana, he would have won regardless). Like everything in political campaigns, it’s window dressing. You pick someone who will appeal to a demographic you don’t cover yourself and tell a good story. Two people from the mid-Atlantic states can get painted as being in the “East Coast liberal bubble”. A New York/Montana match covers east and west, urban and rural, blue and red. That this is ultimately irrelevant doesn’t matter at all - it’s all about the perception. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/64 "2015-04-13T17:00:19Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Some perspective in terms of all these other names that keep getting brought up: according to a poll I saw recently, the strongest alternative to Hillary by far would be Elizabeth Warren, who has just 18% support and isn’t running for probably just that reason. As hopelessly small as that is, none of the other candidates had even half that much. Polls at this point are just name-recognition tests. Clinton and Warren are the two candidates most people are familiar with. I doubt one American in 100 could name O’Malley or Webb. I follow politics pretty closely, and I doubt even I’d recognize a picture of O’Malley. Though as I said earlier, any low name recognition candidate probably needs to already be moving to lock up support, start sucking up to the National Press and get some pictures in the Iowa papers of them trying to eat some sort of local delicacy/greasy meat pile with a forced, queasy smile. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/65 "2015-04-13T17:06:18Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Though as I said earlier, any low name recognition candidate probably needs to already be moving to lock up support, start sucking up to the National Press and get some pictures in the Iowa papers of them trying to eat some sort of local delicacy/greasy meat pile with a forced, queasy smile. And for the love of god don’t make it a corndog. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Quatro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bc8723/32.png) [@Mr\_Quatro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Quatro)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/66 "2015-04-13T17:06:29Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > There is some pressure among Democratic activists to keep Biden as the VP candidate this time, too. > > Reasons: > > - he’s been there for a while, keeping him is seen as keeping the Obama legacy going, not rocking the boat. > - good (neutral) public image; nobody hates him much. > - well known to Hillary, they got along when she was SoS, no threat to her. > - well known in Congress, gets along with them as well as anyone. > - given his age, he won’t run after her, leaves the field open for any other Democrat who’s thinking of a post-Hilary run – no ‘designated successor’. So they’d support this. > - his foot-in-mouth reputation is useful – he can float a trial balloon, easily deniable if it gets bad public reaction. > - even easier to identify the Democratic candidates as the ‘experienced’ team. > > So don’t count Biden out yet! I didn’t know all of that … sounds like inside party stuff. I still think the democrats have another dark horse (no pun intended) to run against Hillary. Perhaps it’s VP Joe Biden who can garner more votes than the obvious front runner Hillary Clinton. He has the Catholic vote and the military vote and the Jews aren’t mad at him and most important of all he has the white man vote. In these next few months all the eyes will be on Hillary Clinton. I bet the reality of a woman running for POTUS has not yet set into everyone’s subconscious minds. This is where she will lose if not in the Democratic primaries then surely against the likes of Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio. Like it or not in the end a man will win. Hillary should go all the way in and name a woman as her VP ahead of time because it will be a male against female race anyway. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/67 "2015-04-13T17:09:10Z")
Eight years ago, were you sure a white would win? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/68 "2015-04-13T17:11:14Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > And for the love of god don’t make it a corndog. Do you want Iowans to show up for the caucuses in some freezing high school gymnasium and go stand in your corner for a few hours? Then, by gum, you’re gonna \*eat \*that corndog for the cameras. All of it. And another one tomorrow, and the day after that … ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Quatro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bc8723/32.png) [@Mr\_Quatro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Quatro)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/69 "2015-04-13T17:17:23Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Eight years ago, were you sure a white would win? You mean white guy … and there was only one and he had a woman VP by his side :eek: ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/70 "2015-04-13T17:24:00Z")
> [@Mr\_Quatro](#): > > You mean white guy … and there was only one and he had a woman VP by his side :eek: Biden is a white guy. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/71 "2015-04-13T17:34:45Z")
Heh yeah, I can’t help remembering this exchange in _30 Rock_ back in 2007 between Liz and shallow Jenna: > [@](#): > > LIZ: Okay, what are you gonna do if they ask you about ’08? > > JENNA: Well, of course I want Hilary to be the first woman president. > > LIZ: Ugh. No. Obama, you support Barack Obama. [Jenna is unsure] Remember, you liked those pictures of him at the beach? > > JENNA: Oh right. Obama–what is he, Hispanic? > > LIZ: No, he’s black. > > JENNA (laughing): And he’s running for president? Good luck! As dim and ignorant as Jenna’s character is, she wasn’t alone to think the USA was not ready to vote in a non-white candidate. Maybe the same will be true for gender as well. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/72 "2015-04-13T17:42:50Z")
> [@choie](#): > > With a resigned sigh I have to say I don’t see anyone else (who’s likely to run) getting the nomination, nor do I think anyone else (who’s likely to run) would do as well against his/her Republican opponent. Not that this person would _lose_ necessarily, I just think Hillary would do better. > > Of those who _aren’t_ running? The only person I think who’d give her a good run for her money for the nomination would be Al Gore. He’s got everything, both an impressive political service record, the experience of campaigning\*, and yet he seems like an “outsider” having been out in the woods (sometimes literally) doing actual good for the world. His environmentalism now seems like visionary rather than pie-in-the-sky. He’s not tainted by having backed the Iraq war or any NSA bullshit. Importantly, he’s not the same campaigner/speaker he was back in 2000–that bullshit “wooden” comment won’t fly given how well he’s comported himself in the past fifteen years as a spokesperson and advocate. Despite his age (which is the same as Hillary’s) he’s admired by young people too. And I think many Democrats–and Independents–would _love_ the chance to put him where he should’ve been in January 2001. > > I would vote for him in a heartbeat, with an enthusiasm far exceeding that which I’d show for Clinton. > > But he won’t run, and I understand why, for several reasons. Not the least of which is that the Clinton folks would feel betrayed and it would be a difficult, internecine battle that could cause some damage. > > Don’t get me wrong, there is a lot to like about Hillary Clinton and I have always admired many of her stances. She will certainly have my support, as would any “D” candidate outside of… um… well, I can’t think of an option that would _ever_ make me choose an “R” candidate, so I guess I’m Yellow Dog through and through. IMO there is no Democratic candidate worse than any Republican candidate. > > Oh okay, I just thought of a scenario: Jim Cooper vs. Mike Bloomberg. 😃 In that case, yeah, I’d vote (R). Not a big Bloomberg fan but I’ve known for decades he’s a donkey in elephant’s clothing. > > So Clinton or whoever the nominee is will have my loyalty. Nevertheless, my heart will always weep for what should’ve been in 2000. I want President Gore. ☹ > > - Likely one of the many reasons he _doesn’t_ want to run again. After what he went through, I can’t blame him. Maybe she’ll pick him as her veep. “Clinton-Gore '16: Remember how awesome the 90s were?” ---
**Author:** ![typoink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@typoink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/typoink)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/73 "2015-04-13T17:46:01Z")
Wait, didn’t the right wing promise us a third term of Obama? Where’s the dictator-for-life we wanted? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/74 "2015-04-13T19:10:34Z")
> [@typoink](#): > > Wait, didn’t the right wing promise us a third term of Obama? Where’s the dictator-for-life we wanted? The same place as when the left wing predicted GWB would force a 3rd term for himself. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/75 "2015-04-13T19:17:50Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > Maybe she’ll pick him as her veep. “Clinton-Gore '16: Remember how awesome the 90s were?” Tipper for Veep! ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/76 "2015-04-13T19:19:46Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The same place as when the left wing predicted GWB would force a 3rd term for himself. One assumes you have a cite. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/77 "2015-04-13T19:20:08Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The same place as when the left wing predicted GWB would force a 3rd term for himself. Which left wingers were saying that, or is this just another example of wagging the finger and tut-tutting “I hate it when both sides do it” when in fact only one does? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/78 "2015-04-13T19:21:19Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > And that’s without mentioning her support for banning flag burning, the theft of private property during an emergency Just so I understand, this means "banning the theft of private property during an emergency? " ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/79 "2015-04-13T19:30:26Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > One assumes you have a cite. You must be new around here. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2015, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458/80 "2015-04-13T19:32:46Z")
So you withdraw the assertion then? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-great-un-fork-hillary-thread/717458.md?page=5)