# The gun and ammo hoarders may have been right **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 2, 2017, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837 "2017-02-02T18:31:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/81 "2017-02-03T10:04:25Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > I agree. The level of discourse is relatively bad. I would like to see some pushback from the sane left on their more extreme brethren though. I will continue to try and criticize bad posts when I see them. Will you, then, stop claiming that all liberals, or liberalism as a whole, is responsible for the violent actions of a very small number of people? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/82 "2017-02-03T11:50:13Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Not because Obama was ever going to “come for their guns”, but because they may just need them soon to defend their cities and homes against an occupying Trump army. The moves being made right now are clearly to test the power of the judicial and to see how far Congress will go to support the lunacy coming out of the White House. DHS has [already said](http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/316720-dhs-trumps-executive-orders-remain-in-place) that they will obey Trump’s orders and ignore judicial orders. How big a leap is it for the military to do the same? Can you quote the part where DHS said they will ignore judicial orders? I assume it’s not this (from your cite): > [@](#): > > “The Department of Homeland Security will comply with judicial orders…" The first judicial order issued was that travelers could not be summarily sent back to their country of origin, as was the original plan. This was in response to two Iraqi men who were about to be sent back to Iraq. Those two men are now in the US, per the judge’s order. That is not to say there was not a lot of chaos and some DHS employees did not immediately comply with the order, but it’s simply untrue to claim that DHC said they will ignore judicial orders. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/83 "2017-02-03T12:03:23Z")
The NRA will be Trump’s brown shirts; gun fetischism in the US has always been about white fear of blacks; that’s not changing under Trump. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/84 "2017-02-03T12:07:54Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > The NRA will be Trump’s brown shirts; gun fetischism in the US has always been about white fear of blacks; that’s not changing under Trump. Whatever do you spaketh of? I just wanted to kill me some squirrels! ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/85 "2017-02-03T13:39:28Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > How do you enact comprehensive social programs without the might of the state? With democracy. Or is almost every other advanced industrialized country in the world suffering under an authoritarian regime? AFAICT, these “authoritarian” regimes have higher than average levels of political freedom. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/86 "2017-02-03T13:46:41Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Without the ability to fail and have competition what incentive does it have to change? I’m not a big fan of “too big to fail” but I feel like our government should fall into that category. > [@](#): > > I agree. The level of discourse is relatively bad. I would like to see some pushback from the sane left on their more extreme brethren though. Some of us try but then we get called secret conservatives, or worse, secret Trump supporters. And that makes most of us shut up. > [@](#): > > I’ve been for limited government since I was a child in the Reagan era because I actually read and understand history and human nature. I hope Trump takes full advantage of whatever constraints have been removed from the executive in the name of expediency so that when he is out of power rational people on the right and the left can have a renewed sense of appreciation for limited power. Well, I suspect we will see how well our system of checks and balances works outside of classroom and laboratory settings. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/87 "2017-02-03T13:56:11Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > Non-violent revolutions tend to work better than violent ones, according to Erica Chenoweth’s work. When the military and police refuse to fire into the crowds the government is done. This can take only 3-5% of the total population. This is how you protest. 6 straight weeks with up to 5% of the population marching in protest every night… until last call. [http://www.reuters.com/article/us-southkorea-politics-protests-business-idUSKBN13T04R](http://www.reuters.com/article/us-southkorea-politics-protests-business-idUSKBN13T04R) ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/88 "2017-02-03T14:02:55Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Who on the right is talking about murder? Trump, and all the other Republicans who talk about “Second Amendment solutions”. They’ve been talking for decades about how much they’d like to murder their opponents, with less and less subtlety all the time. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/89 "2017-02-03T14:04:56Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Since the greatest threat to US democracy came during the FDR Administration (interment, a seeming President for life, SCOTUS stacking) I would disagree. That’s a grave error on your part. FDR did not inter anyone. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/90 "2017-02-03T15:35:21Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > The NRA will be Trump’s brown shirts; gun fetischism in the US has always been about white fear of blacks; that’s not changing under Trump. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/91 "2017-02-03T15:38:48Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Trump, and all the other Republicans who talk about “Second Amendment solutions”. They’ve been talking for decades about how much they’d like to murder their opponents, with less and less subtlety all the time. The fact that you still breath argues against your larger point. On the other hand, I have it on good authority that you are actually BigT(rump) himself trying to make Dems look bad.😛 ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/92 "2017-02-03T15:39:52Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > That’s a grave error on your part. > > FDR did not inter anyone. Nice catch, sir. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/93 "2017-02-03T15:51:15Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > The NRA will be Trump’s brown shirts; gun fetischism in the US has always been about white fear of blacks; that’s not changing under Trump. Is this belief the reason why Democrats want to ban all firearms? ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/94 "2017-02-03T15:59:37Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > They’ve been doing that for years. They get away with it because they are right wing, and so are pandered to. Cliven Bundy and the Hole In The Head gang. Right wing amnesia strikes again. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/95 "2017-02-03T16:05:40Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Consolidating power is dangerous. Even if the consolidation is to streamline a SNAP card. I don’t mind social programs. I do mind how they are implemented and administered. Take the VA for example. It does a shitty job because being a huge bureaucracy it cares mostly about it’s own self preservation. Don’t worry, social programs are the first thing to go on the chopping block. The only reason they haven’t YET is because the scumbags are worried about political repercussions … they don’t give a fuck about you or me, just about their own criminal asses. As for consolidating power, you only seem to mind it if it doesn’t fit your agenda… or the agenda of the criminals you worship. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/96 "2017-02-03T16:16:32Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Who on the right is talking about murder? The only political violence I have seen lately is from the left. I think that was that Blinky asshole (and a few others here and there. I could check but I would have to take him off “Ignore”. I don’t feel like it. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/97 "2017-02-03T16:27:42Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Consolidating power is dangerous. Even if the consolidation is to streamline a SNAP card. I don’t mind social programs. I do mind how they are implemented and administered. Take the VA for example. It does a shitty job because being a huge bureaucracy it cares mostly about it’s own self preservation. Moving the goal posts. The question wasn’t whether the government or the invisible middle finger of the free market was the best way to help the needy, it was whether the left’s expansion of government is more likely to lead to a military dictatorship. I pointed out that both the left and the right believe in expanding government’s power but do so in different ways, and only the expansions on the right are those that would be useful in the violent subjugation of the civilian populace. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2017, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/98 "2017-02-03T16:38:54Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Oh, please. The anti 1st, anti 2nd, anti 10th, anti constitutional party is and has been the left leaning one. However, now that Trump is president they are rediscovering, correction- discovering, the concept of limited government. Whut? You mean Executive Orders? So instead of any previous consultation or going through Congress, Trump throws out these Executive Orders because “limited government.” Tyrant issues aside, the lawsuits challenging these orders are taking time to resolve, and defending against these lawsuits is on the taxpayers’ dime. Resolution mistakes, such as airport snafus, are piling up due to little to no foresight on Trump’s part, leading to more lawsuits. So maybe the governing process will be limited, but the legislative swamp size will increase to deluge levels when dealing with the fallout. Less government, more litigation. Is this what you wanted? ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2017, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/99 "2017-02-04T00:18:35Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Nice catch, sir. 🙂 Oh damn, I just got it. I’m slow 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2017, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-gun-and-ammo-hoarders-may-have-been-right/778837/100 "2017-02-04T02:31:04Z")
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