I share the views of Diogenes the Cynic.
I also share his skepticism re: AcidKid’s links.
I believe Jackson is what he appears to be, Diogenes’ “duck” as it were.
Hands up everyone who honestly thinks that this guy would not be in jail right now, if he was some ordinary fellow rather than a super-wealthy & famous entertainer.
crickets chirp
It isn’t Bashir’s job to sugar coat it. Some people are saying he was too nasty-some are saying he was too easy on Jackson.
I think he did a good job, and I don’t think Bashir is a bad guy. (He doesn’t SEEM like a jerk).
If he had been harder on Jacko, the thing would never have aired-Michael’s too vain and too paranoid.
If he was nicer-he would have done a huge disservice. Like it or not, what is going on there is NOT right, and Bashir would be amiss NOT to say anything.
As for being nice to Michael-I don’t think he was being two-faced so much as he was being polite. His voice over was to express concern. I certainly am concerned!
Wow people. What a nice hijack. Couldn’t the arguement about MJ being a child molester have continued in one of the other 5 Wacko threads? This one was about Bashir being a backstabber, which he was.
Now its just another MJ molester thread.
I think the reason for this is that, while Bashir may be a backstabber, it’s just really hard to feel sorry for MJ.
Yeah, sorry I hijacked Stinkpalm. 
I don’t watch TV, so I didn’t see the show.
My instincts tell me that your conjecture about Bashirs motives is correct, but I can’t feel sympathy for Jackson.
He did, according to Bashir-he tried to get them not to air it-but he didn’t have a legal leg to stand on.
Here
TELL ME that doesn’t fit Michael Jackson.
These are the most daming, in my opinion:
As for the hijack, I think it’s probably because there’s very little to suggest that Bashir is a backstabber.
Stinkpalm, I disagree that Bashir is a tool. I think MJ is a tool for allowing this documentary to be done, and giving a journalist all the access he gave him. In other words, I think MJ made his own bed and is lying in it now. As far as I know, all he had to do to prevent a biased or unpopular documentary airing about him was refuse all interviews. I don’t know what MJ hoped to accomplish with this, but at 44 he should know what modern journalism is all about. He should know better than most people, even.
Stinkpalm I’m afraid I just don’t get where you are coming from. You admit MJ is weird. You don’t appear to deny that MJ was weird during the interviews and footage that Bashir obtained. But you seem to think that Bashir was being a tool because the documentary showed that MJ is weird (which is what you say MJ is).
Colour me confused.
How exactly do you think MJ should have come across? As normal? If so, logically you would now be denouncing Bashir as a tool for misrepresenting MJ.
What could Bashir have done to keep you happy?
First of all he could have left out the unneccessary commentaries that were there to lead the viewers to see what he wanted them to see.
Take out his voiceovers about his “impressions” about MJ and the thing would not have been 10% as bad as it was.
If you have seen the commercials for this upcoming fox special where MJ fights back you can hear some of the things the bashir was saying to MJ to get his trust. Its fucking sick.
Fuck this guy.
I didn’t see the whole Bashir thing. The bits I saw, Bashir was saying that he had seen and heard certain things about MJ, and he just didn’t see how he could leave them alone.
I can understand that.
I don’t doubt that Bashir got his foot in the door by saying to MJ he’s going to be nice, he’s not going to do a hatchet job. Then he starts interviewing and filming and finds that (for example) despite child molestation investigations and millions of dollars spent on settling that down, MJ is continuing to have boys stay in his bedroom and sleep in his bed.
You think that at that point Bashir should have just said well fuck the truth, I’ll just leave all that out and pretend MJ’s normal and do a complete snowjob?
If Bashir did that, that’s when I’d lose all respect.
Do you think that when Bashir reassured MJ he’d portray him in a good light he knew that MJ would admit that he was still inviting boys into his bedroom?
As to the documentary where MJ fights back, well, it sounds to me like the standard tactic. When you don’t like the message, and all attempts to cover it up fail, a vicious ad hominem attack on the messenger can work wonders.
Never mind that I’m weird, concentrate on how much of a tool the person who let you know I am weird is.
Now there’s a true statement if ever I heard one.
My apologies, too, for the hijack.
When I first saw transcripts and read about the show, I thought “hatchet job.” But since then I’ve read much other stuff about things they didn’t include. Questions MJ refused to answer (sure, he has every right to silence). The Jordy transcript as published in the News of the World.
Then other facts start to stand out. MJ’s predilection for children of one gender and the same age. The unashamed outrageousness of his statements given the context, even if he is describing innocent “touching”. The utter unlikelihood of MJ only having ever had one nosejob, and no other plastic.
So I think Princhester is probably spot on. It may have been that Bashir anticipated finding murky stuff from the start (what journo wouldn’t?!) but in all the furore over this interview, icebergs and tips come to mind…
Dijon, I think you have somewhat of a point there. If I thought my kid were being molested, the last thing I would do would be to slap hir, literally or figuratively.
Pedophiles prey on vulnerable kids. The fact that “J. Chandler”'s parents were going through an unpleasant divorce makes it, IMHO, just as likely that MJ found it easy to take advantage of him as that Chandler’s father brought a trumped-up charge. Go off on your kid, and s/he’ll run to the pedophile, who already has their trust, tell that person “Mom hit me/yelled at me; she doesn’t want me to see you any more!”, and the pedophile will find all kinds of ways to comfort hir.
“He also seemed to show only small blips of MJ acting nutty or weird shit at a time.”
Pee Wee Herman only acted nutty for a little bit and look at the shit sandwich he got!!
No one makes Jacko a headcase, and that reporter capitolized on it. Ho hum.
M.J was a dork for letting Bashir interview him so intimately (I’m no MJ fan but from the interveiw I got the impression MJ would have a problem masturbating let alone inflicting his penis on others…even after “fathering” 3 children, am I the only one that thinks those children are wayyyyyyyyyyyyy TOO white to be MJ’s?) but I do think Bashir probably let down MJ in a big way. He has also probably shot his own career in the foot. I can’t see any other celebrity lining up to be examined by him in the near future.
I find your statement unconvincing. Where is your proof? Accusations without proof are anathma here at the SDMB.
*note: the above is about statements couched as "fact’ that are nothing but suposition and has nothing to do with MJ and whether or not he is or isn’t a pedophile. I wouldn’t let my 9 year old son stay with him, however.
Let’s just say IMO, he molested that kid. I find the kid’s affadavit very peruasive in conjunction with all of the other variables taht I’ve already mentioned.
FWIW, I remember reading an interview in Playboy with Ola Ray, the former Playmate who costarred with Jackson in his “Thriller” video. She flatly said she had tried to get it on with him, and he wasn’t interested. She didn’t say it in an insulting way, or put him down at all; but she all but said she thought he was a virgin. “He’ll do it when he’s ready,” is, I believe how she put it.
Of course, it’s possible there are straight, unattached males in their early 20s who would turn down a proposition from a woman who looked like Ola Ray in her prime (Do a web search. She was stunning). Yeah, it’s possible. But likely? Like I said, FWIW.
And I’m with wring. After all he’s been through, to continue to engage in this provocative behavior with children betokens a compulsion that is pathological, and anything but “innocent.” Jackson is very obviously disconnected from reality in a major, major way.
He’s a eunich!