# The "I Hated Juno" thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 20, 2009, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783 "2009-02-20T23:05:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/61 "2009-02-21T08:25:55Z")
> [@tr0psn4j](#): > > When did you go to high school? We kind of talked like that. No. You didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/62 "2009-02-21T08:42:22Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > This is the _perfect_ way to describe an interview I saw with Ellen Page, which made me decide I will never ever watch Juno. I think there’s something to that. I watched Juno and was amused, but then I saw an interview with Ellen Page and she just came off as an insufferable little snot. ---
**Author:** ![DudleyGarrett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d9b06d/32.png) [@DudleyGarrett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DudleyGarrett)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/63 "2009-02-21T11:56:01Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > I loved it. 🙂 This. I just saw it last night. I thought it was great. ---
**Author:** ![DudleyGarrett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d9b06d/32.png) [@DudleyGarrett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DudleyGarrett)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/64 "2009-02-21T12:01:34Z")
> [@SkipMagic](#): > > This is inappropriate for this forum, **Hostile Dialect**. Cafe Society is meant for discussion about the topic, not what you think of the other posters. Please don’t do this again. I just have to say… this was really polite, for SDMB moderator standards. And look at the reaction you received. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/65 "2009-02-21T13:38:34Z")
> [@Small\_Hen](#): > > I liked the movie. Yeah, the dialogue was a little too clever for realism, but guess what? Dialogue in the real world is boring! If movie dialogue were like real life, who the hell would ever go? I’ve got to pitch in with **lissener** and the others to point out that unrealistic dialogue is something that works and sometimes doesn’t. You can’t hand wave away Juno’s dialogue, which goes way beyond “unrealistic” and into “ludicrous,” by saying movies all have unrealistic dialogue. A lot of movies have special effects, but some use them well; Star Wars was a better movie than Highlander II. A lot of movies have bloody, explosive battle scenes, but Saving Private Ryan was still a better movie than Windtalkers. Any movie technique can be effective or not effective depending _on the skill with which it is employed._ The use of slo-mo in “The Natural” works extremely well. The use of slo-mo in “Battlefield Earth” is pointless and absurd. Robin Williams’s crazy schtick is extremely effective in “Aladdin” and “Good Morning Vietnam” but in “Patch Adams” it just doesn’t work. All movies have stylized dialogue but you can’t say all movies are equally good. “Juno” doesn’t work in part because the dialogue just repeatedly defies the suspension of disbelief. Whe The Joker talks in “The Dark Knight” you find yourself pulled into the story, and The Joker comes off as frightening and unsettling; in Juno, the characters come off as actors being asked to repeat ridiculous lines. Part of the problem is, I suspect, that the cutesy-ultrawitty-teen shit has been done before. Juno might have been better if it’d been made in 1991, before we saw a lot of this sort of crap, but being made when it was it just came away looking like the producers were trying very, very hard to make A Gilmore Girl Gets Pregnant. ---
**Author:** ![alexandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e68b1a/32.png) [@alexandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alexandra)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/66 "2009-02-21T13:50:23Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > This paper’s J.R. Jones captured pretty succinctly the movie’s plusses and minuses: > _[Screenwriter Diablo Cody saddles her teenage heroine with annoyingly glib dialogue, and Reitman hammers it so hard you almost expect a laugh track. More impressive are the adult characters: Allison Janney and J.K. Simmons are ruefully funny as the girl’s practical parents, and as the yearning adoptive mother, Garner proves that even a limited actress can really connect when given the right role.](http://onfilm.chicagoreader.com/movies/capsules/32585_JUNO)_ I agree. Although I liked the adult characters and their storylines- especially the slow reveal that Adoptive Dad was a bit of a shit - enough to forgive the hipster dialogue. I do not like Cera, but Ellen Page was sweet. Agree about the lack of drama surrounding her best friend being another plus point. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/67 "2009-02-21T13:50:52Z")
I liked Juno and have watchd it several times. It’s a relaxed, friendly, fun movie about teen pregnancy with a soundtrack that’s also relaxed and fun. Makes a great background movie when you’re doing other things and you can’t put porno on. My only problem was that the male lead was just another iteration of The Boy. _When will they develop realistic, well-thought-out characters for male actors!!!???_ ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/68 "2009-02-21T13:59:08Z")
> [@Cagey Drifter](#): > > …No one on the face of the planet has ever talked like any of the characters in Juno… > [@Mosier](#): > > If you liked Star Wars (and who didn’t?) then your whole argument has been debunked. Those characters weren’t on this planet. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/69 "2009-02-21T16:09:54Z")
> [@Small\_Hen](#): > > I liked the movie. Yeah, the dialogue was a little too clever for realism, but guess what? Dialogue in the real world is boring! If movie dialogue were like real life, who the hell would ever go? > > The last conversation I heard with teens (between guys 4 and 5 years older than Juno): > “Hey, you guys wanna play Guitar Hero?” > “…uh, yeah, okay.” _Starts game._ > _Misses a note._ “Faggot!” > _Misses another note_ “Fag! Fagging Faggot!” > _Fails out of set_ “Fucking faggot, man! Cocksucking faggot jackoff! Get me a beer, okay?” > “Yeah, okay. You suck at that, you faggot.” > “Shut up, dick head.” > > If that’s the movie you want to see, fine. I’ll stick with Juno, thank you. Heh - this post made me laugh out loud - I’ve totally met these guys. In other news, I liked _Juno_ - I thought it was fun. ---
**Author:** ![SaharaTea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@SaharaTea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SaharaTea)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/70 "2009-02-21T16:12:05Z")
Wasn’t a fan. Surprisingly, I thought Jennifer Garner’s performance was the best thing about it. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/71 "2009-02-21T16:23:45Z")
I caught a 5 minute snippet of “Farewell to Arms” on AMC this morning and not only was the dialogue vomit worthy (Rock Hudson: “My darling. Will I ever see you again?”) but everyone spoke in those horrible affected quasi-British accents. In comparison to what dreck Hollywood used to turn out, “Juno” is very realistic. Now if we could only get Hollywood to hire size 10 actresses who don’t have flawless skin and perfect teeth, we’d be stepping in the right direction. ---
**Author:** ![Cagey\_Drifter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@Cagey\_Drifter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cagey_Drifter)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/72 "2009-02-21T17:15:41Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > All movies have stylized dialogue but you can’t say all movies are equally good. “Juno” doesn’t work in part because the dialogue just repeatedly defies the suspension of disbelief. This is exactly my point; it’s not so much that the lines are terrible and unrealistic, it’s that you _notice_ that they’re terrible and unrealistic. You feel like you are watching a movie. You feel like you are watching someone recite from a script. That is not the sign of a good movie, IMHO. > [@Sublight](#): > > Those characters weren’t on this planet. 😃 Thanks, **Sublight**! And by the way, I’m actually not a big Star Wars fan. Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Dan\_Norder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4af34b/32.png) [@Dan\_Norder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dan_Norder)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/73 "2009-02-21T17:23:56Z")
People’s opinions vary of course, but to criticize _Juno_ for having clever dialog that’s supposedly unrealistic is just odd. First off, if you think clever, snarky speaking is unrealistic you either need to get out of the house more in general or interact with some people who aren’t total clod heads. Second, isn’t this the board that falls all over itself in love with Joss Whedon, who has made a career of this same kind of writing? How about the love for _Clerks,_ which also is just an excuse to string clever dialog through a film with no real plot and horrible, horrible acting. I love Whedon’s stuff (most of it, the Dr. Evil blog thing was just god-awful) and like early Kevin Smith stuff (before he decided he could get away with anything because his fanbase would lap up dreck just because it’s him), and it’s for many of the same reasons I liked _Juno._ And as far as the music supposedly being faux-folk, again, get out more. The indie folk scene is doing very well, thank you very much, and there’s a reason it’s popular. ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/74 "2009-02-21T17:37:19Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > From AFI 100 list: > Movies with heavily stylized dialogue: > …85 Duck Soup 1933… I did not find Harpo’s dialogue stylized at all. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/75 "2009-02-21T17:50:02Z")
Hey, I loved the stylized dialogue in _Juno_. If I want to hear actual people speak, I’ll go listen to actual people speaking. The only thing I found really annoying about _Juno_ was Rainn Wilson. He delivered his lines in an oddly affected way-- a way that made his character seem (weirdly) threatening and entirely unsympathetic to Juno. I think that character’s lines should have been delivered with at least some hint of affection for the title character (presumably she’s a regular at the store) and sympathy for the title character’s dilemma. ---
**Author:** ![Cagey\_Drifter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@Cagey\_Drifter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cagey_Drifter)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/76 "2009-02-21T17:52:37Z")
> [@Dan\_Norder](#): > > People’s opinions vary of course, but to criticize _Juno_ for having clever dialog that’s supposedly unrealistic is just odd. I’m not criticizing it for being clever. I’m criticizing it for being “clever.” > [@](#): > > First off, if you think clever, snarky speaking is unrealistic you either need to get out of the house more in general or interact with some people who aren’t total clod heads. Odd, I would say that the “clever” snarky people who supposedly talk like Juno are the ones who are clodheads. And yes, I do avoid such people. Despite this, I am a graduate TA who comes in contact with a lot of students, some of whom are brilliant, and some of whom are like Juno. None of them talk like this. But I like I said before, it’s not so much that the dialogue is unrealistic; it’s that I noticed every second of it, and knew they were reading off a script. That’s how forced it was. > [@](#): > > Second, isn’t this the board that falls all over itself in love with Joss Whedon, who has made a career of this same kind of writing? As **RickJay** stated above, it’s not the style of writing itself so much as how artfully it is done. The stylized writing in Juno is gross, unrefined, and far too enamored with itself. It is sickening. > [@](#): > > And as far as the music supposedly being faux-folk, again, get out more. The indie folk scene is doing very well, thank you very much, and there’s a reason it’s popular. It’s popular so it must be good?? Are you serious? Have you listened to Top 40 radio recently? Have you seen the big blockbuster movies of late? Have you watched the most popular television shows? Are the popularity of these in any way indicators of quality? ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/77 "2009-02-21T18:34:40Z")
> [@Struan](#): > > _snort_ Have you ever heard two people talking in real life? Ever? Come on, give us a proper answer. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/78 "2009-02-21T18:37:14Z")
> [@Dan\_Norder](#): > > Second, isn’t this the board that falls all over itself in love with Joss Whedon, who has made a career of this same kind of writing? How about the love for _Clerks,_ which also is just an excuse to string clever dialog through a film with no real plot and horrible, horrible acting. I like to say that if it’s funny, it doesn’t need an excuse. What you’re saying about Whedon’s stuff is mostly true (I did think Clerks, unlike the rest of Kevin Smith’s work, actually had something to say), but I _enjoyed_ those things and I did not enjoy Juno. Is Whedon’s dialogue realistic? No, but it somewhat resembles the way some geeks joke about themselves, so there’s some resonance. Smith’s dialogue is a little bit like the way some disaffected pop-culture junkies talk, too. Although nowadays I think they’re imitating Kevin Smith more than the other way around. Does Juno have something like that going on? I don’t think so. I didn’t connect with the characters because they spent the whole movie spouting dialogue that was supposed to be clever and ironic, but emotionally revealing. Meanwhile it wasn’t funny OR true to life, so what was left? ---
**Author:** ![Dan\_Norder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4af34b/32.png) [@Dan\_Norder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dan_Norder)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/79 "2009-02-21T18:46:38Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Meanwhile it wasn’t funny OR true to life, so what was left? Maybe it wasn’t true to _your_ life, or funny by _your_ definition, but, you know, lots of people can say the same thing about the dialog from whatever TV and movies you like. It’s not like there’s an objective test of these things. Lots of people thought the dialog was funny, and the movie is well regarded as being very true to life. And from the people I’ve seen who have liked it (both in my circle of friends and as far as other people in the entertainment industry who have commented upon it), it’s not that these people are idiots or anything. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2009, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783/80 "2009-02-21T18:47:29Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > Are you serious? The dude quoted scripture that doesn’t actually exist, in a powerful and righteous firebrand style, before whacking people execution-style. > > The whole “dead nigger storage” bit was realistic to you? Come on. The scripture quoting is unrealistic. But it’s not really dialogue as such, just something odd one person likes to say. I don’t realize what in particular you disagree with in the “dead nigger storage” bit. Quentin is too articulate for the situation? Too blasé? It’s weird to use the expression “dead nigger storage”? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-i-hated-juno-thread/486783.md?page=5)