# The Invention of Lying seems to fall victim to the same logical fallacy as Liar, Liar **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 29, 2009, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934 "2009-09-29T01:12:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2009, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/21 "2009-10-01T04:39:12Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > I’d bet dollars to doughnuts that at the end of this story, the characters come around to realizing that the best policy is not fabrication and falsehood, but to try to be as honest as possible while taking into account whether you’ll hurt the other person’s feelings, whether they really need to know a particular piece of information, and what’s the right time and place to bring things up. There, I just saved $8. I saw the movie last night, so I’ll take that bet. $1,000, even money? **mobo85** : Not his first lie, just the biggest. And I’m very interested in seeing how this film, who’s biggest message is that religion is a lie, goes over with the American public. I’m waiting for the first right-wing nutcase who blames it on Obama. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2009, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/22 "2009-10-01T15:51:05Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I was just going to say what **gary** did. _Liar, Liar_ is about a magic spell, not a computer program. It doesn’t have to behave logically. He couldn’t even ask a question if he knew the answer was going to be a lie. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2009, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/23 "2009-10-02T02:20:00Z")
> [@commasense](#): > > I saw the movie last night, so I’ll take that bet. $1,000, even money? 😛 oh, sure, like we could send that many doughnuts thru the intarwebs tubes…! > [@](#): > > **mobo85** : Not his first lie, just the biggest. > > And I’m very interested in seeing how this film, who’s biggest message is that religion is a lie, goes over with the American public. Whoa … Now, THAT – _ **that** _ would be different (and unexpected for the average US moviegoer). Now I might even want to watch just to see how much of a deal is made of that point and how proportionate is the reaction. Hmm… a universe of constant full disclosure would be one where the _caveat emptor_ culture of skepticism would not have taken root, wouldn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![middleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2009, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/24 "2009-10-02T21:31:00Z")
I like to think of the condition as utter candor and not an inability to lie. I saw it today and give it a moderate to strong recommendation. It was funny but also a smart film. Though there is some brilliant commentary on religion, i don’t find the movie as anti-religious that the film would have been in more jaded hands. The start of the third act drags a bit, which was my only real beef with the film. I have not seen Ricky Gervaise in anything (might check out Extras, but probably won’t pick up the Office), but I found his performance to be excellent. He is obviously funny, but I completley bought his dramatic scenes. Jennifer Garner played her role of innocence and openess well. Really good stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Lanzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/74df32/32.png) [@Lanzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lanzy)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/25 "2009-10-05T13:53:59Z")
I loved when he brought the “tablets” to the crowd. I’ve always wondered if Moses had that many questions from everyone. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/26 "2009-10-05T14:01:40Z")
**middleman** , you might try last year’s Ghost World. It was pretty predictable, but I still enjoyed it. ---
**Author:** ![middleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/27 "2009-10-05T14:09:22Z")
> [@Khadaji](#): > > **middleman** , you might try last year’s Ghost World. It was pretty predictable, but I still enjoyed it. I’ve seen a film called Ghost World, but it came out several years ago. The one with Thora Birch and Scarlett Johansson? Didn’t that come out in 2001? ---
**Author:** ![tim-n-va](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim-n-va/32/3001_2.png) [@tim-n-va](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim-n-va)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/28 "2009-10-05T14:21:21Z")
> [@middleman](#): > > I’ve seen a film called Ghost World, but it came out several years ago. The one with Thora Birch and Scarlett Johansson? Didn’t that come out in 2001? Yes. _Ghost Town_ is the one with Gervais. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/29 "2009-10-05T14:45:19Z")
> [@tim-n-va](#): > > Yes. _Ghost Town_ is the one with Gervais. Thanks for the correction. Yes, I meant Ghost Town. That’s what I get for relying on my ever-failing memory… ---
**Author:** ![SawEverythingTwice](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f07891/32.png) [@SawEverythingTwice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SawEverythingTwice)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/30 "2009-10-05T18:49:32Z")
Just wanted to pipe in and say there is no fallacy involved. The voice over at the beginning of the film plainly pointed out that people in that world simply said whatever was on their mind. So, it’s not just that they can’t lie, they have no filter to keep inappropriate/hurtful comments from slipping out. But hey, you can just ignore that; I know it can be fun to critique movies you haven’t seen. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2009, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934/31 "2009-10-10T09:07:43Z")
Just saw it. Some spoilers ahead so beware. Pretty enjoyable, but like Ghost Town, it’s more of a big sap fest with a bit of light comedy and an interesting premise. It’s not just that there’s no lying - people have the inability to say or even conceive of things that aren’t true, and in addition, they lack the strong thinking-to-saying filter we have, so they pretty much just say what’s on their mind. Not to the extent that they babble on randomly, but they do blurt out things that come to mind. They don’t even have fiction - all popular films are someone sitting in a chair reading a dramatic account of historical events. I liked that even the architecture of the town is kind of bland and straightforward. I also liked that despite what the trailer implies, though he does use his new found gift for lying to commit theft, he never ends up using it to get sex, which I would have considered tantamount to rape, and he even ends up declining to use it for emotional manipulation, though the temptation is certainly presented. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-invention-of-lying-seems-to-fall-victim-to-the-same-logical-fallacy-as-liar-liar/511934.md?page=1)