# The inventor of the UK's national dish has died **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 23, 2022, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018 "2022-12-23T20:01:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/1 "2022-12-23T20:01:57Z")
[https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/ali-ahmed-aslam-chicken-tikka-masala-glasgow/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/ali-ahmed-aslam-chicken-tikka-masala-glasgow/index.html) > “Chicken tikka is an Indian dish. The masala sauce was added to satisfy the desire of British people to have their meat served in gravy.” ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/2 "2022-12-23T20:03:44Z")
It may not be authentic. Who cares? It’s awesome, and the best option after late night drinking. Haven’t felt this sad since the inventor of Hawaiian pizza succumbed. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/3 "2022-12-23T20:27:32Z")
John Harvey Kellogg died in 1943…or are you talking about Henry Heinz? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/4 "2022-12-23T20:39:13Z")
I’ve heard it said that Britain conquered an empire just so they could finally get a cuisine. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/5 "2022-12-23T20:51:46Z")
I find that a tiresome little bit of prejudice. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/6 "2022-12-23T20:53:01Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > John Harvey Kellogg died in 1943…or are you talking about Henry Heinz? > **[Sam Panopoulos](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Panopoulos)** > > Sotirios "Sam" Panopoulos (Greek: Σωτήριος Πανόπουλος; 20 August 1934 – 8 June 2017) was a Greek-born Canadian cook and businessman, credited as the inventor of Hawaiian pizza. > Sotirios Panopoulos was born in Vourvoura, Greece, on 20 August 1934. He emigrated to Canada in 1954, aged 20, arriving in Halifax, Nova Scotia. > Panopoulos settled in Sudbury, and then Elliot Lake, Ontario, where he found work in the mines. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/7 "2022-12-23T21:19:28Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > ’ve heard it said that Britain conquered an empire just so they could finally get a cuisine. Alternately, the British conquered half the world for spices and then decided they didn’t like any of them. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/8 "2022-12-23T22:18:18Z")
From reading Wodehouse I always assumed that the national dish of the United Kingdom (or at least England) was [jellied eels](https://eatyourworld.com/destinations/europe/england/london/what_to_eat/jellied_eels). Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/9 "2022-12-23T22:25:40Z")
I’ve had cold eels, with enough jelly, I suppose, to count as the dish in question. And if it’s good enough for Gally Threepwood, in his association in his younger days with bookies, jellied-eel sellers and three-card-trick men, it’s good enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/10 "2022-12-23T22:34:40Z")
As long as we’ve drifted, another UK (English in this case) “national dish”–by far, I submit, standing alone in that respect certainly world wide-- is fish-and-chips. And that, as I never fail to wedge into conversation at the slightest opportunity, was a novelty in the mid- to late 19th century, taken from the Syrian Jews in London. Documented in any number of contemporary food commentaries as well as English cookbooks both haute-cuisine in their regional chapters and in cookbooks for middle class readers. I didn’t even know there were Syrian Jews in the East End then. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/11 "2022-12-23T22:38:23Z")
Unlike Tikka Masala but un-nameable for a founder to live or die like fish-and-chips, another “national dish” in England are donners, the meat-stick from Turkey. ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/12 "2022-12-23T22:39:27Z")
Downers? I could see that, given the English winters… ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/13 "2022-12-23T23:02:46Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > another “national dish” in England are donners, the meat-stick from Turkey. The _döner_ kebab is more of a (West) German thing (as adapted by Turkish immigrants) that made its way south and west in the ‘Eighties, and you can find a variant of in most of Western Europe today. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/14 "2022-12-23T23:13:49Z")
Trader Joe’s has them frozen, six to a bag. Very convenient. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/15 "2022-12-23T23:17:07Z")
Where’s the like button? I’ve had some fantastic dishes in the UK. They get the short shrift for no good reason. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/16 "2022-12-23T23:25:51Z")
Even the ‘boring, bland’ stuff is good. Roast beef and Yorkshire pudding, bangers and mash, faggots and peas, fish and chips, Scotch eggs, steak & kidney pie, shepherd’s pie… not to mention the curries and kebabs. They’re all good. (Just stay away from Wimpy burgers; at least from the '80s.) ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/17 "2022-12-23T23:50:45Z")
Black pudding, white pudding, haggis, stargazy pie, full English breakfast, toad in the hole, liver and bacon, tripe and onions, mince pies. What’s not to love? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2022, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/18 "2022-12-23T23:54:11Z")
Cute. I’ll _eat_ a full English, mostly. Ditto TitH. The rest is why Britain doesn’t have an Empire anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2022, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/19 "2022-12-24T00:11:37Z")
The idea that obtaining elements of cuisine from elsewhere is somehow uniquely British, and indicative of some sort of failing is a pathetic, ignorant trope and it needs to die. Curry is a dish that is firmly part of the British cuisine. If you accept that burgers and pizza and hotdogs are American menu items, you _have to_ accept that curry is part of British cuisine. Curry was already on the British menu _before the United States of America came into being._ Every food culture adopts things from other places, or inspired by other places; two of the five classic French mother sauces _refer to the names of countries that are not France_ ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2022, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018/20 "2022-12-24T00:30:53Z")
I would say that a cuisine that fails to experiment with and adapt elements of other people’s foods is a sad thing, and all good cuisines have elements from elsewhere. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-inventor-of-the-uks-national-dish-has-died/977018.md?page=2)