# The Japanese are "killing us"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [May 8, 2003, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906 "2003-05-08T15:11:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/1 "2003-05-08T15:11:26Z")
I hesitate to do this, but in [http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1\_189.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_189.html), Cecil stated that “The Japanese are killing us” in regards to the automobile market. I must ask the following: Cite? It might have been true 20 years ago, or even a decade ago, but the calamitous collapse of Japan, Inc. is now part of the “whatever happened to” lore of recent years. ---
**Author:** ![whitetho](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whitetho/32/1059_2.png) [@whitetho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whitetho)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/2 "2003-05-08T15:29:45Z")
The column in question, [Why do car makers come up with so many meaningless car names?](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_189.html) is dated “03-Dec-1982” so Cecil’s statement is indeed 20 years old, and so this probably should be viewed as a historic document. ---
**Author:** ![whitetho](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whitetho/32/1059_2.png) [@whitetho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whitetho)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/3 "2003-05-08T15:29:45Z")
The column in question, [Why do car makers come up with so many meaningless car names?](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_189.html) is dated “03-Dec-1982” so Cecil’s statement is indeed 20 years old, and so this probably should be viewed as a historic document. ---
**Author:** ![gluteus\_maximus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f17d59/32.png) [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/4 "2003-05-08T16:32:50Z")
I live in Japan, and believe me, there’s been plenty of time for the Japanese auto-makers to catch up in the inane name department. There’s “Parsley”, “Carrot”, and “Voxy”, and Mitsubishi’s SUV called “Pajero”, which a Chilean friend tells me means "one who masturbates. Oh, yeah… Mitsubishi also sells a “Mini Pajero”. No kidding! ---
**Author:** ![zenith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zenith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zenith)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/5 "2003-05-08T18:18:28Z")
I’ve asked it before. I’ll ask it again: If the Japanese are so damned smart, how come they can’t figure out that Americans have large hands and adjust their radios/tape decks/CD players much more often than they do the heating and A/C controls? Every Japanese vehicle I’ve encountered-- including the Nissan Altima which was designed in California under the direction of an American who used to work for the legendary Bill Mitchell at GM and thus ought to have known better– has had the heater controls mounted high and the radio controls mounted an inch or so off the floor. The typical Japanese radio( which is also in use in at least one Korean car, the Hyundai Accent) has tiny controls. In many applications(including the Korean one), the floor-mounted gearshift is placed such that you can’t get a tape into or out of the slot with the shifter in PARK. Also, the Japanese and Koreans put the headlight switch at the end of the turn-signal stalk where most Americans expect to find the wiper controls. How many accidents/near-misses has this boneheaded move caused? ---
**Author:** ![Flyfisher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e480ec/32.png) [@Flyfisher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyfisher)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/6 "2003-05-08T19:43:57Z")
I at one time in past history owned a vehicle manufactured by Nissan. I always thought it was goofy having the head light switch on the turn signal. After you turn the lights on and leave them on them on until you don’t. However, rain comes drizzing out of the sky at times so slowly or randomly spaced that you have turn the wipers on and off regardless of whether or not you have a delay feature. So having them on the turn signal stalk is good since its so damn convenient. These day I have a vehicle that doesn’t have a “made up” name (or I don’t think it is, but eh, does it matter?). A nice and big green one ton PU (diesel power? … but of course). It also has a “crosshair” hood ornament a Toyota proof skid plate to protect the vital under parts from getting dented or bent. (just kidding about the hood ornament and skid plate). ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/7 "2003-05-08T19:46:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dogface \* > \*\*I hesitate to do this, but in [http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1\_189.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_189.html), Cecil stated that “The Japanese are killing us” in regards to the automobile market. I must ask the following: Cite? > > It might have been true 20 years ago, or even a decade ago, but the calamitous collapse of Japan, Inc. is now part of the “whatever happened to” lore of recent years. \*\* Last time I looked, all the American car companies were offering enormous rebates and zero percent loans to sell their cars, while the Japanese generally did not have to resort to these incentives. Last time I looked, the Consumers Reports ratings, not one single category with Japanese competition had an American car on top. Last time I looked, the Japanese had hybrid technology cars on the market today, while GM is talking about maybe getting them out by 2007. The Japanese are killing us. ---
**Author:** ![li\_l\_Dickie\_Dirtz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/2bfe46/32.png) [@li\_l\_Dickie\_Dirtz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/li_l_Dickie_Dirtz)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/8 "2003-05-09T04:36:08Z")
The Ford Escape Hybrid will be offered for sale in 2004. Just so you know. ---
**Author:** ![SlickRoenick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@SlickRoenick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlickRoenick)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/9 "2003-05-09T07:55:44Z")
> [@](#): > > _from the article_ > \*\*Pontiac pilfered the name from a race car made by Ferrari. The letters origianally stood for Gran Turismo Omologazione, which loosely translates from the Italian as “approved grand touring car.” \*\* The History Channel said GTO stands for Gran Turismo Omologato. My spelling might be off. ---
**Author:** ![SlickRoenick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@SlickRoenick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlickRoenick)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/10 "2003-05-09T07:57:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Exapno Mapcase \* > \*\*Last time I looked, the Japanese had hybrid technology cars on the market today, while GM is talking about maybe getting them out by 2007. > > The Japanese are killing us. \*\* I’m not much of a debater, but isn’t this apples and oranges? The current hybrids are gas/electric. GM is working on a hybrid that is run on Hydrogen. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/11 "2003-05-09T10:04:02Z")
I am too lazy to look up the market share, but yes the Japanese continue to make inroads into the US market in terms of market share. Eg, the percentage of new cars sold of Japanese origen (however that is defined) is increasing while the US automakers are decreasing. ---
**Author:** ![troub](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troub/32/14802_2.png) [@troub](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/troub)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/12 "2003-05-09T14:06:58Z")
**Zenith** , my girlfriend just bought a Toyota RAV4, and you’d be pleased to know that the radio is [way up at the top of the dash.](http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/ToyotaRav4/Images/Dash.jpg)[My next car](http://www.edmunds.com/media/roadtests/roadtest/03.mazda.6/03.mazda.6.int.500.jpg), however seems to suffer a bit, but still not too bad. No matter where the controls are positioned on the dash, I find it ridiculous that American builders like Pontiac and Chevrolet put the cupholders on many cars between the gear shifter and the radio/climate controls. The cup is literally resting against the controls, obviously blocking them, and if you have a larger, fast-food style cup, the lid (at least on my Pontiac Sunfire) is almost at the point of messing up the equalizer controls. Not to mention if you have to perform “evasive” maneuvers and the drink spills inside your radio. That would suck. Yet they still continue to put the damn cupholder right in front of the controls. ---
**Author:** ![gluteus\_maximus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f17d59/32.png) [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/13 "2003-05-09T15:17:56Z")
Cup holders in cars are like parking lots at bars. You shouldn’t be drinkin’ and drivin’ anyhow. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/14 "2003-05-09T16:59:15Z")
“Dude, Where’s My Hybrid?”, by Stuart F. Brown, _Fortune_, April 28, 2003, p. 112. > [@](#): > > General Motors CEO Rick Wagoner astounded the Detroit auto show earlier this year whe he announced that by 2007 the company will be tooled up to produce three types of hybrids in volumes as high as a million a year, if the market wants them. Some gas/electric hybrids will be out earlier. These are not hydrogen fuel cell cars, which are projected for farther down the road. ---
**Author:** ![lazybumcus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6a8cbe/32.png) [@lazybumcus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lazybumcus)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/15 "2003-05-09T17:32:38Z")
“Maybe you’ve heard. The Honda FCX is the first fuel-cell car to be government- certified for everyday use. Which shouldn’t come as any surprise. Honda has been a pioneer of environmental technology from the beginning. The Honda FCX is poised to follow in this progressive tradition. The fuel-cell itself is propelled by electricity generated by a hydrogen-oxygen chemical reaction—and its only emission, remarkably, is water vapor. Now, with a fresh stamp of approval from the Environmental Protection Agency and the California Air Resources Board, Honda is delivering a family of new FCX fuel-cell vehicles to its first customer, the city of Los Angeles.” > **[American Honda Motor Co., Inc. - Official Site](https://www.honda.com/)** > > Explore an innovative line of quality products from American Honda Motor Company. Find the latest news and information on Honda and Acura brand products. how do they make the fuel cells? is that process environmentally sound? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/16 "2003-05-09T17:42:40Z")
All-hydrogen cars are supposed to be impractical at the moment, I forget exactly why. Supposedly it’ll be more practical and environmentally safe around 2020. GM and several of the other majors said they’ll have a hybrid ready by '07, but I think a while back they promised to have them ready for 2000, so… ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Salhany](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Steve\_Salhany](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_Salhany)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2003, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/17 "2003-05-09T18:44:38Z")
Hydrogen/fuel cell cars are impractical for the time being because with existing technology, the processes for obtaining pure hydrogen are quite energy-intensive, and thus would cost more to acquire the stuff than is really worth it. Hydrogen fuel cell cars are AT LEAST 20-30 years in the future, possibly more. Hybrids are becoming more commonplace. They are quite thrifty on gas in the city, but lose some of that advantage while cruising on the highway. Toyota and Honda already have hybrids out, while Ford plans to bring a couple out next year. The post above about Rick Wagoner’s comments about GM and hybrids suprises me; from what I’ve read GM was really not planning on building any. ---
**Author:** ![Chaucerwatch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/77aa72/32.png) [@Chaucerwatch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chaucerwatch)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/18 "2003-05-10T02:13:13Z")
I live in Japan. My all-time #1 favorite bizarre car name is the “We’ve.” Yep, with the apostrophe and everything. I think it might be a Nissan. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2003, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/19 "2003-05-11T05:35:24Z")
Speaking of poor car layouts, I drive a Saturn - 5 speed, shift on the floor. The cup holders are between the stick and the dash, _under_ the edge of the climate controls. A straight up from the cupholder catches the lip of climate controls and the levers. If you put a big cup in, it actually tilts outward. Plus the stick butts up against the cups. There is technically another cupholder behind the stick and a slot, but this is not available if you get the console attachment. The console attachement provides an armrest and has a fliptop lid to an interior compartment. I like the armrest, but it removes the central cupholder. Also, there is a slot that is just the right size to hold CDs, _but_ the button on the console interferes such that you can’t get CDs into the slot. ---
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906/20 "2003-05-13T15:22:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Chaucerwatch \* > \*\*I live in Japan. My all-time #1 favorite bizarre car name is the “We’ve.” Yep, with the apostrophe and everything. I think it might be a Nissan. \*\* Engrish is alive and well, I see. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-japanese-are-killing-us/173906.md?page=2)