# The Jews of the world don't like you either, Sevastopol **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 5, 2009, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138 "2009-12-05T23:19:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/141 "2009-12-07T22:41:47Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Let me put it another way - the only “alternative” a Jew has to being a Jew is being a dead Jew. Only if you define Judaism \*solely \*as an ethnicity. This definition is simply wrong, as any number of Jews-by-choice will be happy to explain to you. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/142 "2009-12-07T22:48:24Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > Judaism and Christianity are not synonimous - Judaism is an ethinicty as well as a religion; hence, thyere are many Jewish atheists (not so many “Christian atheists”). Yes, and there are many observant Jews who are not ethnically Jewish (see my response to **Alessan** ). > [@Malthus](#): > > Hence, it is no answer for a Jew-hating bigot that their hatred is simply a species of atheism. This doesn’t even make sense. > [@Malthus](#): > > It is clear the target of the OP is using “Judaism” in this sense, as an ethnic group identifier, and not as some critique of religion. It certainly isn’t clear to me and to many others participating in this discussion. > [@Malthus](#): > > The term “American Judaism” is an identifier of **ethnicity** , not religion. If an American Jewish Atheist supports Israel, are you of the opinion s/he’s not included here? “American Judaism” is not an identifier of ethnicity. > [@Malthus](#): > > The appropriate comparator is ethnicity, not religion. The equivalent is ‘who would be Armenian? The soul of their evil is … X’. > > Are you seriously contending that the above is not indicative of anti-Armenian bigotry? Assiging a “soul of evil” to an entire ethnicity? He’s referring to the religion, not the ethnicity. The comparison doesn’t work. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/143 "2009-12-07T23:13:59Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > Yes, and there are many observant Jews who are not ethnically Jewish (see my response to **Alessan** ). And many atheists who are Jewish. > [@](#): > > This doesn’t even make sense. Sure it does. Simply put, the bigotry on display in the OP is not merely a critique of religion in general (subspecies Judaism). > [@](#): > > It certainly isn’t clear to me and to many others participating in this discussion. Then you (and these “others”) are being wilfully blind. > [@](#): > > “American Judaism” is not an identifier of ethnicity. It quite obviously is, in this context. Riddle me this then: are you seriously contending that the guy blasted in the OP has no problem with _atheist_ Jews (in many places in America, the majority) - who support Israel? If so, you need a reality check. What is meant by “American Judaism” is clearly in this context no more and no less than Jews who happen to be American. The quotes in the OP say nothing and indicate nothing about _theism_ and saying they do is purely a disingenuous attempt to avoid the obvious - that this here is a bigot - by linking that bigotry to disapproval of religion in general. This isn’t merely my opinion, it is fact. Some of the fellows he _specifically_ singles out in his tirade to tar all “American Jews” are, in fact, “Jewish” _only by ethnicity_ - see for example Charles Krauthammer (an atheist). Cite: [Charles Krauthammer - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Krauthammer) > [@](#): > > He’s referring to the religion, not the ethnicity. The comparison doesn’t work. No, he’s not. What have “… public figures like Douglas Feith, Lieberman, Wolfowitz, Perle, Krauthammer, Abrahams, Pipes and Lewis Libby etc.” in common? It sure as shit isn’t the fact that they are religiously observant! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/144 "2009-12-07T23:30:30Z")
I’m interested in kearning what specific Jewish beliefs he has a problem with, since he hasn’t deigned to mention any. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/145 "2009-12-07T23:36:45Z")
> [@kombatminipig](#): > > We don’t. For the last 150 years, we’ve preferred to have our own nation, where we can defend ourselves. Everyone prefers to have their own nation. The Nazi’s preferred to have their own nation. It didn’t work out that way. Just because you prefer it doesn’t make it a right. If Israel wasn’t sitting on a piece of desert, it would have never been an option. Defend yourselves. By all means. But do it on your own dime, not ours. Without US aid, perhaps Israel would survive… perhaps not. I personally don’t care one way or the other. I’m interested in the strategic interests of the United States, and Israel is not a strategic asset, economy or piece of desert. Indeed, I submit that if it weren’t for our relationship with Israel, we wouldn’t be in Iraq and Afghanistan today. If all Jews feel that Israel is their birthright, why not emmigrate to the holy land? I respect a jew who puts his balls on the line for what he/she believes. Not for the jews that live throughout the world complaining of anti-semitism and asking other governments to pump money into their sandbox, while they live the good life in the US and the rest of the western world. One other thing I don’t understand in this thread. How can you be a jew and an athiest at the same time? That makes no sense to me. I thought the religion and the culture were intertwined. Learn something new every day. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/146 "2009-12-07T23:45:47Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > Great. You don’t see someone smearing an ethnic group as an “evil cult” as problematic … but you _do_ see smearing the person who says that as a bigot as problematic? > > What, exactly, would someone have to do, before you’d be willing to label 'em as a bigot? Is he smearing an ethnic group, a religion, or a country? I guess before I call someone a bigot, I’d have to understand the point of attack. For example, I don’t have a problem with Jewish people that are US citizens, put America first, and are willing to shoulder their share of the burden of living in this country (and that includes participating in the military). I don’t have a problem with the Jewish religion, as I don’t have a problem with any religion. I have seen many slams on this board about Christianity being an evil cult, and very few blink. The ones that do are labeled brainwashed freaks or right wing fundies. Be consistent. If a religion is a cult, they are all cults, including the Jewish religion. I DO have a problem with the state of Israel and its policies, including the drag of Israel on America’s ability to do what is in its best interests in the Middle East without worrying about any impact on Israel. Does that make me a bigot? Not by my definition. There are many countries I don’t care for, Israel happens to be one of them. I don’t judge a people by the dictates of their government. Just as I hope no one judges me by the dictates of mine. But that happens all the time. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/147 "2009-12-07T23:48:01Z")
oh, and for the record, I realize this thread is way off track. My apologies to the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/148 "2009-12-07T23:54:43Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > If all Jews feel that Israel is their birthright, why not emmigrate to the holy land? I respect a jew who puts his balls on the line for what he/she believes. Not for the jews that live throughout the world complaining of anti-semitism and asking other governments to pump money into their sandbox, while they live the good life in the US and the rest of the western world. Jews can’t complain about anti-Jewish bigotry, because Israel exists - even if they don’t happen to live there? Colour me confused. To begin with, “all Jews” don’t believe the same thing. Some believe that Israel is their country and some don’t. Some that don’t, quite naturally sympathize to an extent with those that do, because they share many things in common (specifically, an ethnic identity). This is hardly an unusual situation. > [@](#): > > One other thing I don’t understand in this thread. How can you be a jew and an athiest at the same time? That makes no sense to me. I thought the religion and the culture were intertwined. Learn something new every day. Because Judaism isn’t necessarily, or even primarily, a religion. It is an ethnicity associated with a religious belief. In Israel, “secular” Jews are probably the majority: > **[Religion in Israel](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Israel#The_secular-traditional_spectrum)** > > .mw-parser-output .smooth-pie{display:none;position:relative;width:100px;height:100px;border-radius:50%;background-color:#333;color:black;border:1px solid black}.mw-parser-output .smooth-pie div{position:absolute;transform-origin:left bottom;background-color:#655;color:black;top:0;left:50%;width:50%;height:50%;border-radius:0 500%0 0}.mw-parser-output .smooth-pie div.pie50{transform-origin:left center;height:100%;border-radius:0 100%100%0/50%}.mw-parser-output .smooth-pie .pie12-5{clip-path:p... In America, Jews are more likely to be non-religious than the general population: > **[American Jews | Observances and engagement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism_in_the_United_States#Observances_and_engagement)** > > The American Jews' majority continues to identify themselves with Judaism and its main traditions, such as Conservative, Orthodox and Reform Judaism. But, already in the 1980s, 20–30 percent of members of largest Jewish communities, such as of New York City, Chicago, Miami, and others, rejected a denominational label. > [@](#): > > The 2008 American Religious Identification Survey found that around 3.4 million American Jews call themselves religious — out of a general Jewish population of about 5.4 million. The number of Jews who identify themselves as only culturally Jewish has risen from 20% in 1990 to 37% last year, according to the study. In the same period, the number of all US adults who said they had no religion rose from 8% to 15%. Jews are more likely to be secular than Americans in general, the researchers said. About half of all US Jews — including those who consider themselves religiously observant — claim in the survey that they have a secular worldview and see no contradiction between that outlook and their faith, according to the study’s authors. To use a specifically “religious” definition of Judaism probably leaves out one-third to half of all Jews world-wide. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/149 "2009-12-07T23:58:17Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > oh, and for the record, I realize this thread is way off track. > > My apologies to the OP. It’s gone off track in the exact same way as every other thread that mentions the word “Israel” in the OP always goes. It gets kind of boring after page 3 or so. For the record, \*\*Stink Fish Pot \*\*, I disagree with virtualy everything you’ve written, but I don’t think you’re an antisemite. This board has plenty of people who don’t like Israel, but the only one who is ever repeatedly accused of being an antisemite is **Sev**. Mull on that. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/150 "2009-12-07T23:59:02Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Is he smearing an ethnic group, a religion, or a country? I guess before I call someone a bigot, I’d have to understand the point of attack. > > For example, I don’t have a problem with Jewish people that are US citizens, put America first, and are willing to shoulder their share of the burden of living in this country (and that includes participating in the military). > > I don’t have a problem with the Jewish religion, as I don’t have a problem with any religion. > > I have seen many slams on this board about Christianity being an evil cult, and very few blink. The ones that do are labeled brainwashed freaks or right wing fundies. Be consistent. If a religion is a cult, they are all cults, including the Jewish religion. > > I DO have a problem with the state of Israel and its policies, including the drag of Israel on America’s ability to do what is in its best interests in the Middle East without worrying about any impact on Israel. Does that make me a bigot? Not by my definition. There are many countries I don’t care for, Israel happens to be one of them. I don’t judge a people by the dictates of their government. Just as I hope no one judges me by the dictates of mine. > > But that happens all the time. In this case his target is “American Jews” in general, so it isn’t a religion and it isn’t a country. The notion that anyone is smearing this guy for his dislike of Israeli policies is simply mistaken. He’s being smeared, and rightly, for his Jew-hatred. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/151 "2009-12-08T00:07:29Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > One other thing I don’t understand in this thread. How can you be a jew and an athiest at the same time? That makes no sense to me. One can dispense with the religious aspect without rejecting all cultural connections. One other factor, at least for me, is that historically, those who’ve conducted pogroms and other campaigns of harassment and extermination have not always been scrupulous about distinguishing between religious Jews and atheists/agnostics. I doubt that the next outbreak, whenever it occurs, will only single out the religious. So I feel that I have a stake in fighting bigotry. Incidentally, I have been critical when someone “on my side” says something bigoted on the subject of the Mideast conflict. Somewhere in the depths of the dusty SDMB archives is a thread in which I came down on **december** when he crossed the line and posted objectionable comments about Arabs/Palestinians (something far milder than what **Sevastopol** has said). I’m not especially proud of that action; I should have spoken up sooner than I did. To supporters of the Palestinians who are making excuses for **Sevastopol** ’s bigotry - why is it so hard for you to reject his tactics? ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/152 "2009-12-08T00:16:42Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > It’s gone off track in the exact same way as every other thread that mentions the word “Israel” in the OP always goes. It gets kind of boring after page 3 or so. > > For the record, \*\*Stink Fish Pot \*\*, I disagree with virtualy everything you’ve written, but I don’t think you’re an antisemite. This board has plenty of people who don’t like Israel, but the only one who is ever repeatedly accused of being an antisemite is **Sev**. Mull on that. Fair enough. I will admit to not following his posting or style at all. I guess I should have stayed out of this pit thread. I was just riled by the OP without knowing the history of **Sevestapol**. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/153 "2009-12-08T00:19:29Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > In this case his target is “American Jews” in general, so it isn’t a religion and it isn’t a country. > > The notion that anyone is smearing this guy for his dislike of Israeli policies is simply mistaken. He’s being smeared, and rightly, for his Jew-hatred. Again, I appreciate the info. I’ll bow out of this thread until I get a better feel for who/what Sevestapol is all about. ---
**Author:** ![SecondJudith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@SecondJudith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecondJudith)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/154 "2009-12-08T00:32:27Z")
You can also be a religious Jew and an atheist – hell, you can even be a rabbi and atheist, at least in my movement. Jewish identity is really complicated, and anyone who says there is one simple way to tell who is a Jew/who isn’t a Jew is blowing smoke. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/155 "2009-12-08T02:39:06Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > You must be shitting me. > > Are you seriously claiming that someone who says stuff like in the OP isn’t a Jew-hater? No, I am not shitting you. The quoted material in the OP does not suggest a Jew-hater, it suggests that there is lack of tolerance of dissent among Jews over the subject of Israeli policy and that portions of the public hold it against the Judaism. The sort of thing that suggest anti-Semite are the classic stereotypes used in a manner to denigrate a whole people. I’m very suspicious of charges of anti-Semitism when leveled at people criticizing Israeli policy. That is frequently, but not always “shitting”. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/156 "2009-12-08T03:31:56Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > No, I am not shitting you. The quoted material in the OP does not suggest a Jew-hater, it suggests that there is lack of tolerance of dissent among Jews over the subject of Israeli policy and that portions of the public hold it against the Judaism. The sort of thing that suggest anti-Semite are the classic stereotypes used in a manner to denigrate a whole people. I’m very suspicious of charges of anti-Semitism when leveled at people criticizing Israeli policy. That is frequently, but not always “shitting”. WTF? As I pointed out in the OP **Sev** called Judaism polluted and corrupted. He wrote that, “Jews have a deep obligation to Israel no matter what.” How are accusations that Judaism is dirty or that Jews have dual loyalties not evocative of classic anti-Semitism? Is anything short of accusing Jews of grinding up Christian children to make matzo to be shrugged off? ---
**Author:** ![sleeping](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/839c29/32.png) [@sleeping](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleeping)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/157 "2009-12-08T04:34:46Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > This is not reasonable criticism. This is anti-Semitism. From the three samples you’ve provided, it seems that not only is **Sevastopol** critical of Israel and Zionism–not Jews–he is inveighing against how Zionists have sullied Judaism. If anything, that’s somewhat pro-Jewish. ---
**Author:** ![sleeping](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/839c29/32.png) [@sleeping](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleeping)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/158 "2009-12-08T04:38:48Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > How are accusations that Judaism is dirty or that Jews have dual loyalties not evocative of classic anti-Semitism? Here’s the thing. **Sev** has not, to my knowledge, condemned Judaism (at least no more so than he’s attacked religion in general). He has, however, observed that by creating strong associations between Judaism (and Jewish identity) and Israel, Zionisms have made Judaism dirty. That’s hardly the same thing as calling Judaism an inherently corrupt religion. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/159 "2009-12-08T05:20:42Z")
> [@sleeping](#): > > If anything, that’s somewhat pro-Jewish. Yes, aside from a few odd beliefs like wanting Israeli settlers to all be shot since they’re morally defective subhumans, he’s very pro-Jewish. ---
**Author:** ![kombatminipig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5ac83/32.png) [@kombatminipig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kombatminipig)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138/160 "2009-12-08T08:29:32Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Everyone prefers to have their own nation. The Nazi’s preferred to have their own nation. It didn’t work out that way. Non sequitur argument. What do Nazi’s have to do with this? Not everybody prefers to have a nation, but most do indeed…Assyrians, Kurds, Sami and Palestinians being among them. Who are you to even discuss anybody’s right to sovereignty? > [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Just because you prefer it doesn’t make it a right. If Israel wasn’t sitting on a piece of desert, it would have never been an option. Are you kidding me? So Israel was an option only because it was sitting on a piece of shit arid land far from any notable natural resources or major trade routes? Gee, that sure makes sense. > [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Defend yourselves. By all means. But do it on your own dime, not ours. Without US aid, perhaps Israel would survive… perhaps not. It survived fine through several wars without any US aid, and it would continue to do so. > [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > I personally don’t care one way or the other. I’m interested in the strategic interests of the United States, and Israel is not a strategic asset, economy or piece of desert. Indeed, I submit that if it weren’t for our relationship with Israel, we wouldn’t be in Iraq and Afghanistan today. How do you think that anything in Iraq or especially Afghanistan affect Israel in the least? Are you aware of which spheres of influence are involved, or even the distance? I might give you a point of you had mentioned Iran or Syria, whose spheres of influence affect Israel…but Iraq and Afghanistan affect Israel for shit. > [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > If all Jews feel that Israel is their birthright, why not emmigrate to the holy land? I respect a jew who puts his balls on the line for what he/she believes. Not for the jews that live throughout the world complaining of anti-semitism and asking other governments to pump money into their sandbox, while they live the good life in the US and the rest of the western world. I live in Sweden because I happen to be born here, no other reason. My only reason to uproot myself and move to Israel would be if antisemitism here became so ripe that the situation became untenable, and if that happens I’m happy to have Israel to bugger the fuck off to, instead of having to apply for asylum at any random nation. It’s a luxury, but one I’m glad to have. Once a year the neo-Nazis march past my window in Stockholm to remind me of that fact. And no, I’m not asking anybody to pump money into Israel. > [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > One other thing I don’t understand in this thread. How can you be a jew and an athiest at the same time? That makes no sense to me. I thought the religion and the culture were intertwined. Learn something new every day. How can somebody celebrate Christmas and not believe in the literal resurrection of Jesus Christ? Plenty of people do. Religion and culture are intertwined, but you can have one while merely respecting the existence of the other. Faith isn’t a choice. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jews-of-the-world-dont-like-you-either-sevastopol/520138.md?page=9)