# the Jon Stewart economic solution **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 3, 2009, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jon-stewart-economic-solution/484281 "2009-02-03T18:00:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jon-stewart-economic-solution/484281/121 "2009-02-09T21:22:14Z")
> [@MichaelJohnBertrand](#): > > “Greed” is the desire for money for its own sake. You just want moneymoneymoneymoneymoney. This, to me, is shallow and decadent and lazy and does not stand a great chance of contributing much to society. These people just want to play with the system and get rich. If they can do that by just moving meaningless numbers around on a screen to make it look like they have something when they don’t, that’s just fine. I don’t believe there is anything wrong with a desire for money for it’s own sake. Except I do agree that there is a proliferation of people who do just as you say - make money by moving money around a spreadsheet or make the rules for moving money around a spreadsheet. At least in the old days, a greedy steel or railroad tycoon was actually building something. Basically what happened with the economy is someone figured out they could give loans to anyone, package and sell off the loans so they didn’t have to worry if they got repaid or not and made a ton of short-term money. At least with the dot-coms, someone was actually trying to create a business (and people forget, for all the vaporware businesses, there are a lot that are still around and sold legitimate products) ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jon-stewart-economic-solution/484281/122 "2009-02-09T21:25:46Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I don’t believe there is anything wrong with a desire for money for it’s own sake. Except I do agree that there is a proliferation of people who do just as you say - make money by moving money around a spreadsheet or make the rules for moving money around a spreadsheet. At least in the old days, a greedy steel or railroad tycoon was actually building something. > > Basically what happened with the economy is someone figured out they could give loans to anyone, package and sell off the loans so they didn’t have to worry if they got repaid or not and made a ton of short-term money. At least with the dot-coms, someone was actually trying to create a business (and people forget, for all the vaporware businesses, there are a lot that are still around and sold legitimate products) And quite a few of those are still around and still adding economic benefit. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelJohnBertrand](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dfb087/32.png) [@MichaelJohnBertrand](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelJohnBertrand)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2009, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jon-stewart-economic-solution/484281/123 "2009-02-10T03:28:40Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > And quite a few of those are still around and still adding economic benefit. I don’t know. I still think this whole Internet thing is a fad. I mean, does anyone still use that thing? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Trom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@Trom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trom)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2009, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jon-stewart-economic-solution/484281/124 "2009-02-10T05:53:36Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > … > > -The entire culture of “speculation” and “easy wealth”, particularly people daytrading or flipping homes who have no business doing so > > … I make my living as a trader at a small trading firm. Some of my trading is day trading, some of it longer term. The only guaranteed pay I get is a very small monthly draw against my forward profit. Thus, I eat what I kill. If I make $25k, $100k, or $1 million in a year it is 100% due to my decisions to buy or sell from other market participants at mutually agreed upon prices. Other than being market participants in the same markets, I have basically nothing in common with Wall St. traders. I have no connections to inside information, no commissions, no banking/client relationships, no end of year bonus, no incentive to take excessive risk, etc. All I do all day, every day is provide liquidity to the market. Would you consider me to “have business doing” what I do? This post is not meant to be hostile or defensive. I am honestly interested in your perspective on this. (Sorry for the slight hijack.) ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jon-stewart-economic-solution/484281/125 "2009-02-11T13:01:54Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > And quite a few of those are still around and still adding economic benefit. Like the dot-coms, there isn’t anything fundamentally wrong with creating a business of packaging and reselling mortages into RMBS and CDOs, if done correctly. Clearly the idea of doing business over the internet didn’t go away either. But it needs to be done correctly. If you make a bunch of bad loans to people who won’t be able to pay them, then misjudge the risk involved and provide an incorrect rating and then have financial institutions start buying them wholesale without due dilligance, it’s a recipe for disaster. **Trom** - I can’t speak specifically what you do or your firm. A friend of mine did work for a daytrading firm for a number of years, ultimately with disasterous results when the dot-com bubble burst, and described his place as “a bunch of dumb Jersey meathead Guidos”. What I am specifically thinking about is how back in the 90s, you had all these articles about people quitting their regular jobs and setting up trading desks so they can make tons of money. More recently, you have all these shows about speculators with no idea what they are doing, taking out huge loans so they can “Flip That House” and make huge profits. I tend to think anything once it becomes the subject of reality shows and lifestyle articles has become totally overhyped. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-jon-stewart-economic-solution/484281.md?page=6)