# The Lake ate two more people yesterday... **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 6, 2010, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384 "2010-08-06T10:56:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Eureka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/74df32/32.png) [@Eureka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eureka)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/21 "2010-08-07T10:27:57Z")
The Great Lakes are fresh water. ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/22 "2010-08-07T11:07:12Z")
Except for a shallow layer of warm water they are frigged too. The cold will shut you down quick. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/23 "2010-08-07T13:05:19Z")
> [@johnpost](#): > > also a big risk on those lakes is undertow. I would disagree, at least as applies to the western shore of Lake Michigan. An undertow which pulls a person out into deeper water is rare there. Mostly the current pushes you in to shore, or at least parallel to it. One must be cautious near the mouths of rivers, and if it has recently rained heavily, even small creeks can be dangerous. These will push you out. What did the little girl whom I was unable to rescue in was not current, which was rather negligible near shore that day, but the wind. ---
**Author:** ![Athena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@Athena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Athena)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/24 "2010-08-07T13:15:08Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > > [@johnpost](#): > > > > also a big risk on those lakes is undertow. > > I would disagree, at least as applies to the western shore of Lake Michigan. An undertow which pulls a person out into deeper water is rare there. It depends on the spot, I guess. The place where most people drown here is a spot with a bad undertow. People panic and can’t stay above water. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/25 "2010-08-07T13:19:09Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > I would disagree, at least as applies to the western shore of Lake Michigan. An undertow which pulls a person out into deeper water is rare there. Mostly the current pushes you in to shore, or at least parallel to it. And of course, the problem with parallel-running winds/currents is that many people will try to fight that force and swim against it intending to get back to their friends. Doing this, they’re tiring themselves out. Swimming perpendicular to it to the shore would be much easier but it’s not always something that people think about. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/26 "2010-08-07T14:09:09Z")
Drownings even happen on our little recreational lake [Teen drowns in Lake Saint Louis](http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/metro/article_3eb1048e-98b8-11df-abd3-00127992bc8b.html) The spot was just outside the little marina at lower left of [Google Maps](http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=63367&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=36.368578,33.486328&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Lake+St+Louis,+St+Charles,+Missouri+63367&ll=38.8019,-90.787368&spn=0.00454,0.012317&t=h&z=17) Water’s all fun and games until somebody puts an eye out. Or something like that. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/27 "2010-08-07T15:32:12Z")
> [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > Are these lakes fresh water or a bit salty? Because floating and treading water is a lot easier in salt water which may lead people to overestimate their swimming abilities when swimming in a fresh water lake. They’re fresh water, yep. Many _many_ communities get their drinking water from them. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/28 "2010-08-07T15:34:06Z")
A few years ago I went out in Lake Superior ,near the Lake of the Clouds for a dip. It was August and the water was extremely cold. I would not want to spend any time in it. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/29 "2010-08-31T19:05:52Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > > [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > > > A guy I used to climb with is a surfer. He has surfed on [Lake Huron](http://media.photobucket.com/image/surfing%20lake%20huron/joshcannonball/PB050112.jpg) (that’s not him, but you can see what the surfing can be like). The waves can be similar on [Lake Michigan](http://logosecho.home.mindspring.com/LakeSurf2s.jpg) in the right weather. > > Those photos do look like ocean waves on a rough day at the beach, but I’ve swum in that sort of surf. Is it the waves, or the lack of experience on the part of the swimmers? Sorry to bump the thread if it’s gone stale, I was out of town and missed this. The big difference with these waves and similar ocean waves is: 1. Freshwater, not saltwater. The buoyancy difference is actually significant when you’re tired and in trouble. 2. The Great Lakes can be so cold that your testes crawl up to snuggle with your spleen. I personally find Georgian Bay way worse in that respect. 3. Yes, inexperience with big waves and currents certainly contribute. 4. As mentioned before, the wind on some of the Great Lakes can be _brutal_. I don’t have much ocean experience so I don’t know how it compares. But on Lake Michigan, you can be totally fine and not feel a breeze, but then move over 20 feet an you’re being blown to Oz. ---
**Author:** ![rayman5321](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@rayman5321](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayman5321)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/30 "2010-08-31T20:28:40Z")
Stay away from Marquette. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/31 "2010-08-31T21:46:16Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > > [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > > > Not good. These lakes are obviously big enough to have significant surf and wave effects? > > A guy I used to climb with is a surfer. He has surfed on [Lake Huron](http://media.photobucket.com/image/surfing%20lake%20huron/joshcannonball/PB050112.jpg) (that’s not him, but you can see what the surfing can be like). The waves can be similar on [Lake Michigan](http://logosecho.home.mindspring.com/LakeSurf2s.jpg) in the right weather. This landlubber just wants to say - holy shit! We just went to visit the[Great Slave Lake](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Slave_Lake) in the Northwest Territories this summer - those huge lakes are endlessly fascinating to me. Just - so big! ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/32 "2010-08-31T22:40:41Z")
People need to know the body of water they’re going to swim in before they take the plunge. Lake Michigan can be a real pussycat, when it wants to be. Last night, the Mrs. and I took a late dip, because the water was in the 70’s, as was the air. There was a warm wind blowing, the stars were out, the moon was rising redly on the horizon, and it was glorious. The lake hasn’t tried to kill me in nearly 3 months, because I don’t give it the opportunity. Unless I have to. ---
**Author:** ![Ibanez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a4c791/32.png) [@Ibanez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibanez)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/33 "2010-08-31T22:51:59Z")
I never mess around while out on the water. If I have to delay my return date by a day or so on canoe camping trip so be it. I have a rule, if I see white caps no canoeing. I survived one trip where I tipped in a large lake in rough weather with all my gear. Learned a hell of alot from that trip. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/34 "2010-08-31T22:57:01Z")
> [@Ibanez](#): > > Learned a hell of alot from that trip. It’s what you learn when you think maybe you’re going to die that really, really stays with you. ---
**Author:** ![Athena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@Athena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Athena)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/35 "2010-09-01T16:41:49Z")
We had another drowning over the weekend, in the same spot where the Wisconsin guy drowned earlier this year. This wasn’t two weeks after the city put up no less than 3 big flagpoles within about a mile of city beach, each with a color-coded flag system that indicates whether or not it’s safe to swim. The beach in question had two big huge red flags saying “this beach is NOT safe to swim at!” the night the kid drowned. It was an 18-year-old, just came up to start his freshman year of school. Two days later the coast guard fished two girls out of the water in the same place, once again, swimming when the two big red flags were up. At this point, it’s starting to be Darwinism. Sad, but WTF? We have flags, and a big sign saying it’s not safe to swim there yet people just keep going in. ---
**Author:** ![Tranquilis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tranquilis/32/3639_2.png) [@Tranquilis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tranquilis)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/36 "2010-09-01T17:12:20Z")
> [@Athena](#): > > At this point, it’s starting to be Darwinism. Sad, but WTF? We have flags, and a big sign saying it’s not safe to swim there yet people just keep going in. Go, Lemmings! :rolleyes: Yeah, I know - Insensitive, but c’mon folks! Read the bloody signs. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/37 "2010-09-01T17:19:17Z")
[Story from OP](http://www.ironmountaindailynews.com/page/content.detail/id/517834.html) > [@The Link](#): > > They were identified by the Marquette City Police Department as Elias Jenkins, 15, of Berkley, Ill., and Alex Schuiteman, 16, of Felch. Submitted without further comment. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/38 "2010-09-01T18:12:51Z")
Do you get tourists from the coasts, who apparently think, “it’s only a _lake_, how bad can it be?”, and dive right in? I’d think the impossibly verdant woods or other greenery coming right down to the shoreline would be enough to remind anyone they’re not in Santa Monica anymore. Come to think of it the sight of all this greenery next to a lake that looks like an ocean is probably the thing that has made the biggest visual impression on me, during my visits to Chicago. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/39 "2010-09-01T19:23:16Z")
Maybe that’s it - from my landlocked perspective, if someone puts up a sign telling me not to swim, I’m damned well not swimming! Okay, you know this lake better than I do. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384/40 "2010-09-01T20:14:08Z")
> [@Athena](#): > > Two days later the coast guard fished two girls out of the water in the same place, once again, swimming when the two big red flags were up. At this point, it’s starting to be Darwinism. Sad, but WTF? We have flags, and a big sign saying it’s not safe to swim there yet people just keep going in. Back about 8 years ago or so, in Ontario we had a long drawn out fall. As a result, there was a particular lake that hadn’t frozen over the way it usually does and some snowmobiles dropped through the ice. Huge media frenzy about the families’ anguish, the difficulty and danger in recovery efforts etc. It dominated the local news. Then some more snowmobiles went through the ice, then some more, and in one case, it wasn’t too far from where recovery efforts were going on to fish out the frozen bodies. Still the snowmobilers came! Eventually, the police had to basically say that the next batch of dumbfucks to even _try_ to go out on that lake were going to be arrested. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-lake-ate-two-more-people-yesterday/549384.md?page=3)