# The Last Socially Acceptable form of Bigotry **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 24, 2008, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140 "2008-08-24T22:40:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/1 "2008-08-24T22:40:00Z")
Maybe I am over-reacting. In another thread, **Measure for Measure** made this very interesting observation. I thank him (her?) for it. [QUOTE=Measure for Measure] In the very early 1980s, the Village Voice noted that homophobia was the last socially acceptable form of bigotry – and the lefty writer was discussing his Manhattan social circle. At the time, even linking “Scorns gays” with “Bigotry” was an ultra-liberal sentiment - one that tended to piss off moderates. [/QUOTE] In Friday or Saturday’s _New York Times_, in the Op-Ed, not the obits was the story of the life of [Sandy Allen](http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5jkF2jZ1aogJAJ2SYCqDtQkQZTdzwD92HLSK80) who died recently at the age of 53. She was lucky, most people with her condition die much sooner than that. In the Op-Ed ([here](http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/22/opinion/22cohen.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=Sandy%20Allen&st=cse&oref=slogin) ) the author pointed out it was no longer allowed to point and laugh at fat people, or people in wheelchairs, or whatever. Miss Allen put up with that sort of thing almost every day of her life. She tried to teach tolerance by visiting classrooms. One dreadful day she was interviewed by Howard Stern, who supposed she had never had sex and forced her to admit that yes she was a virgin. No man, it would seem could see past her medical condition. In short, 'normal" people made her life a little bit of Hell. Now she is at rest. Sort of makes you wonder what sort medical condition could make her a freak whenever she went out in public, doesn’t it? I ask you to guess before you click. ---
**Author:** ![Khampelf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Khampelf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khampelf)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/2 "2008-08-24T22:44:49Z")
Acceptable bigotry? I’ve noticed a pronounced Anti-Semitic feeling in America, against the Arabs (Persians, too.) ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/3 "2008-08-24T22:47:27Z")
That word… I do not think it means what you think it means. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/4 "2008-08-24T22:49:01Z")
(Persians are not Semites. They are Aryans.) Maybe I am using the wrong word. Still interesting, no? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/5 "2008-08-24T22:53:04Z")
Finding somebody unattractive is not bigotry. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/6 "2008-08-24T22:54:39Z")
Making mockery of someone on a radio show like that probably is. Unless I am using the wrong word. (Umpty-ump years ago would people have said discrimination against Black people was not bigotry?) ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/7 "2008-08-24T23:02:27Z")
[QUOTE=Snarky\_Kong] Finding somebody unattractive is not bigotry. [/QUOTE] I have to agree. The implication is that everyone who didn’t sleep with her is a bigot. That includes you, Paul. Unless there’s something you’re not telling us, you’re a bigot. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/8 "2008-08-24T23:09:05Z")
I’m not sure it’s the last socially acceptable form of bigotry. Depending what community you’re in, there’s lots of other things that are socially acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/9 "2008-08-24T23:12:02Z")
I only point out that she was humiliated by Stern. Would he have done that with a person in a wheelchair or who was very fat? (Of course we _are_ speaking of Howard Stern, the answer might be yes.) I maintain average people would behave differently toward a person like Ms Allen than they would toward people with other medical conditions. I suppose most people would not ask for a fat person to pose for a picture, or make ay of a number of standard jokes. Or, I might be over-reacting. It would not be the first time. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/10 "2008-08-24T23:13:56Z")
The last acceptable form of bigotry is always going to be “different”, if “different” is sufficiently off of the normal curve. I knew what Ms. Allen’s condition was before this. I do think it’s possible her condition intimidated many men who might otherwise have agreeably entered into a relationship with her. Personally, I think the whole “last acceptable form of bigotry” meme is silly. There will ALWAYS be at least one acceptable form of bigotry. It’s human nature…as one form becomes socially unacceptable, a new one comes in. Fifty years ago, the lowest tier of obesity was considered “healthy” (Eat your food, you’re looking sickly!). Today, not so much. Tomorrow, maybe bigotry against redheads will come into vogue again. Currently, I think there are at least three acceptable bigotries, depending on your geographic area in the US: gays, the obese, and smokers. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/11 "2008-08-24T23:15:16Z")
[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi] I only point out that she was humiliated by Stern. Would he have done that with a person in a wheelchair or who was very fat? (Of course we _are_ speaking of Howard Stern, the answer might be yes.) [/QUOTE] The answer to that is probably yes. Stern has never been particularly at pains to keep PC or anything. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/12 "2008-08-24T23:18:12Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] Currently, I think there are at least three acceptable bigotries, depending on your geographic area in the US: gays, the obese, and smokers. [/QUOTE] I would add people like Ms Allen. If I am mistaken, I am willing to be corrected. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/13 "2008-08-24T23:18:38Z")
At the very least, there’s a difference in the flavors of bigotry exhibited here. I might make a joke about someone who is unusually fat, ugly, tall, short, skinny or whatever: that’s called being mean. But it’s unlikely that I would get self righteous about it. Plenty might find such attitudes acceptable, but even 100 years ago nobody would conceive them as proper. Put another way, homosexuality was widely considered to be sodomy and therefore worthy of social expulsion in high school or jr high and disgust or contempt elsewhere. Potential defenders were blunted by the possibility of being accused of membership in that ostracized group. Not fun. I’m not sure, but perhaps transvestites, transexuals and the transgendered might qualify as recipients of socially acceptable bigotry. Barring that, I suspect they crossed the threshold of tolerance after homosexuals did. (Hm. Wrong again, mfm. By wide margins, it’s still socially acceptable to be bigoted against criminals. Indeed, I’m guessing that the previous sentence pisses off most Americans.) ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/14 "2008-08-24T23:20:41Z")
[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi] I only point out that she was humiliated by Stern. Would he have done that with a person in a wheelchair or who was very fat? [/QUOTE] Are you familiar with the show? He makes fun of everyone! He often has fun with mentally retarded people at their expense. It’s accepted by millions of fans because its’ funny. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/15 "2008-08-24T23:21:14Z")
[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi] I would add people like Ms Allen. If I am mistaken, I am willing to be corrected. [/QUOTE] Okay, stipulate that in addition to any particular category of people, that “off the bell curve different” is always in vogue as an acceptable bigotry. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/16 "2008-08-24T23:22:15Z")
[QUOTE=Measure for Measure] I’m not sure, but perhaps transvestites, transexuals and the transgendered might qualify as recipients of socially acceptable bigotry. Barring that, I suspect they crossed the threshold of tolerance after homosexuals did. [/QUOTE] Okay, for my category of “gays”, substitute “queer”, including both orientationally queer and gender queer. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/17 "2008-08-24T23:26:47Z")
[QUOTE=x-ray vision] Are you familiar with the show? He makes fun of everyone! He often has fun with mentally retarded people at their expense. [/QUOTE] You mean his audience? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/18 "2008-08-24T23:36:55Z")
Ok, so are you saying it’s bigotry because Howard Stern made fun of her or because nobody slept with her? ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_Tyger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Silver\_Tyger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Tyger)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/19 "2008-08-24T23:38:06Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] Currently, I think there are at least three acceptable bigotries, depending on your geographic area in the US: gays, the obese, and smokers. [/QUOTE] Don’t forget furries (“all furries are freaks that want to have sex with animals / have fursuits that they make out in!” :rolleyes: ) and geeks (“geeks dress up like their favorite characters, speak Klingon, and are virgins!” :rolleyes: ). Asexuals don’t get a lot of understanding either. Anyone who is ‘different’ will be harassed at some point. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2008, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140/20 "2008-08-24T23:42:02Z")
[QUOTE=Silver Tyger Girl] Don’t forget furries (“all furries are freaks that want to have sex with animals / have fursuits that they make out in!” :rolleyes: ) and geeks (“geeks dress up like their favorite characters, speak Klingon, and are virgins!” :rolleyes: ). Asexuals don’t get a lot of understanding either. Anyone who is ‘different’ will be harassed at some point. [/QUOTE] Yes, anyone whose “different” is sufficiently off the normal curve is subject to this kind of thing. We like to think we’re “advanced” enough to have put most bigotry behind, but we aren’t. This just happens to be the upswing of a cycle where things that were socially unacceptable a couple of decades ago are now becoming socially acceptable. Other things that were socially acceptable a couple of decades ago are now becoming socially unacceptable (drinking & driving, sexual harrassment, smoking, wearing real fur). It’s a pendulum, not a one-way street. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-last-socially-acceptable-form-of-bigotry/461140.md?page=2)