# The latest on civil suits ( lawfare) against Trump with possible political effect **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [January 25, 2021, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464 "2021-01-25T14:47:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/21 "2023-04-12T18:56:59Z")
This just in: [https://thehill.com/homenews/media/3946538-judge-sanctions-fox-news-for-withholding-evidence-in-dominion-lawsuit/](https://thehill.com/homenews/media/3946538-judge-sanctions-fox-news-for-withholding-evidence-in-dominion-lawsuit/) And I mean this just hit the Internet in the last quarter hour. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/22 "2023-04-12T19:05:58Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > And here’s the “on the other hand” story, about what Fox has in its corner, particularly the 1st Amendment: In Season 5 of The Wire, there’s a quote I like. “A lie isn’t a side of the story, it’s just a lie”. I’m okay with establishing a precedent that outright lies aren’t automatically protected by free speech rules. We can debate how the courts should handle particular cases, and what burden of proof might be needed, but in a case such as this where there appears to be overwhelming evidence that everyone at Fox knew they were lying the whole time, I’m okay with nailing them to the wall. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/23 "2023-04-12T19:08:43Z")
On the one hand I like hearing about finally getting some accountability from these bandits. On the other hand I have a very real fear that Trump, Fox, Republicans & co. are so existentially screwed that there’s no longer any upside at all for them to restrain themselves in governing or journalistic practices. Many of these guys are going to be ruined in many ways, and their only salvation is autocracy. When powerful people backed by a dangerous political movement are in a position like that, it’s… not great. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/24 "2023-04-12T19:10:07Z")
Cornered rats and such, yeh. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/25 "2023-04-12T20:11:16Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Dominion lawyers, later in the hearing Wednesday morning, also accused Fox of slow-walking documents part of discovery, with Dominion still receiving documents days before trial. Dominion lawyer Davida Brook c[ited a recent Daily Beast article](https://www.thedailybeast.com/ex-fox-producer-abby-grossberg-claims-there-are-secret-rudy-giuliani-recordings-about-dominion), in which a former Fox producer claimed there are secret Fox audio recordings of Rudy Guiliani and other Trump associates. Non paywalled version: > **[Ex-Fox News producer claims the company withheld damning recordings of Rudy...](https://ca.news.yahoo.com/ex-fox-news-producer-claims-235519040.html)** > > In a filing on Tuesday, lawyers for Abby Grossberg say Fox News neglected to share recordings featuring the likes of Sidney Powell and Rudy Giuliani. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/26 "2023-04-12T20:28:48Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > On the other hand I have a very real fear that Trump, Fox, Republicans & co. are so existentially screwed that there’s no longer any upside at all for them to restrain themselves in governing or journalistic practices. They’ve been there for a while. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/27 "2023-04-12T20:39:06Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > I’m okay with establishing a precedent that outright lies aren’t automatically protected by free speech rules. We can debate how the courts should handle particular cases, and what burden of proof might be needed, but in a case such as this where there appears to be overwhelming evidence that everyone at Fox knew they were lying the whole time, I’m okay with nailing them to the wall. Don’t we already have that? The 1st Amendment doesn’t protect us from using libel or slander. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/28 "2023-04-12T20:39:19Z")
More on sanctions. Judge to appoint a special master [https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/12/media/fox-news-dominion-special-master/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/12/media/fox-news-dominion-special-master/index.html) > [@](#): > > The special master will look into what sanctions might be appropriate against Fox, including potentially instructing jurors in the case that Fox inappropriately blocked Dominion from obtaining key evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464/29 "2023-04-13T12:01:43Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > Don’t we already have that? The 1st Amendment doesn’t protect us from using libel or slander. Yes, but at least in the US, protections from libel and slander have been watered down enough that it’s extremely difficult to win a case when the person being lied about is a “[public figure](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_figure)”. Add in the effects of the case from a few years ago that claimed Tucker Carlson “wasn’t a journalist”, and a big company like Fox pretty much has a license to lie. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-latest-on-civil-suits-lawfare-against-trump-with-possible-political-effect/931464.md?page=1)