# The Liberty Belle has Crashed **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 13, 2011, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344 "2011-06-13T19:16:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ducati](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/cc9497/32.png) [@ducati](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ducati)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2011, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/1 "2011-06-13T19:16:35Z")
Neither mundane, nor pointless, but I didn’t know where else to post. The Liberty Belle is a Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress. I had the good fortune to fly in her one day a while back. She crashed shortly after takeoff near Chicago today, and while all passengers escaped, the plane was destroyed. As a pilot and an American, this makes me sad. > **[Examiner is back - Examiner.com](https://examiner.com)** > > Examiner.com is the go-to source for millions of people who want to know what's happening in their city. And we're still growing! [http://tinyurl.com/3rtmj5y](http://tinyurl.com/3rtmj5y) ---
**Author:** ![Scubaqueen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@Scubaqueen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scubaqueen)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2011, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/2 "2011-06-13T19:24:52Z")
Me too. Sad to hear. B-17s have always been my favorite aircraft since childhood. There are so few of them left that can take to the air. I was fortunate to be able to climb up inside one at the Mt. Comfort air show (Indianapolis area) many years ago during the release of the movie ‘The Memphis Belle,’ which perked up interest in the aircraft at the time. AFAIK, the Memphis Belle is still undergoing renovation somewhere south of my location with the intent to house her permanently at Wright-Patt AFB in Dayton, OH. Hope that’s still true. Shoo-Shoo Baby needs company. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2011, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/3 "2011-06-13T19:59:03Z")
Wow, that’s too bad. Glad to hear that everyone got out okay. I rode on the Collings Foundation’s “Nine O Nine” and it was fantastic. I had hoped to ride their B-24 up at Concord this past weekend, but I couldn’t scrape together the $$$. ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2011, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/4 "2011-06-13T20:22:45Z")
Damnit! ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2011, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/5 "2011-06-13T20:53:31Z")
Sad, just a few weeks ago I watched her fly over my home. No mistaking the sound of those engines. ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2011, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/6 "2011-06-13T20:59:57Z")
I don’t understand why people keep flying these valuable artifacts. The failure rate is just too high. Will they keep flying them until they are all destroyed? ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/7 "2011-06-14T00:35:10Z")
> [@beowulff](#): > > I don’t understand why people keep flying these valuable artifacts. The failure rate is just too high. Will they keep flying them until they are all destroyed? Part of me agrees, but the other part says they were built to fly. It is a shame that people will no longer experience a flight (which will happen if they all crash anyway). Are there many still lying around the Pacific? Would their condition now make recovery - even to a non flying state- worthless. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/8 "2011-06-14T01:44:57Z")
I saw the photos earlier today. They were very hard to look at. Before I saw them I heard everyone aboard was OK and I thought it might just be bent metal. No such luck. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/9 "2011-06-14T02:10:44Z")
> [@beowulff](#): > > I don’t understand why people keep flying these valuable artifacts. The failure rate is just too high. Will they keep flying them until they are all destroyed? Plenty of B-17’s to go around. And they aren’t just flying them into the ground. They put a lot of time into restoring these A/C. If they’re not flying then they’re museum junk. ---
**Author:** ![JoThrive](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@JoThrive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoThrive)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/10 "2011-06-14T02:23:15Z")
I remember the B-17’s from WWII days. They were so beautiful, and played such an important part in winning the war. It is sad to hear of even one of them no longer flying. A toast to the B-17’s! Long may we remember them and the tasks they performed! ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/11 "2011-06-14T02:30:03Z")
They can keep 'em flying as long as the supply of volunteers holds up. From what I’ve seen, the various organizations have really extensive machine shops–they can build just about any part they need. That demographic is pretty old at present–are there younger folks dedicated enough to take over the work? It takes a LOT of dedication to maintain the old warbirds, and a lot of money as well. I asked a docent at the Pueblo Air Museum about their lack of a plane for their International B-24 Museum. He said there were a couple available, but they couldn’t afford the $500,000 to transport one to Colorado. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/12 "2011-06-14T02:30:25Z")
Damn shame. The B-17 is one of my all-time favorite aircraft. I took a few photos of _Liberty Belle_ when she visited Hooks Airport near Houston earlier this year. Glad at least that the crew and passengers got out. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/13 "2011-06-14T03:50:14Z")
> [@blondebear](#): > > They can keep 'em flying as long as the supply of volunteers holds up. From what I’ve seen, the various organizations have really extensive machine shops–they can build just about any part they need. That demographic is pretty old at present–are there younger folks dedicated enough to take over the work? It takes a LOT of dedication to maintain the old warbirds, and a lot of money as well. I asked a docent at the Pueblo Air Museum about their lack of a plane for their International B-24 Museum. He said there were a couple available, but they couldn’t afford the $500,000 to transport one to Colorado. People with money do it privately all the time. There’s a B-17 being restored in my area. Go to Oshkosh and you’ll not only see a sky full of WW-II aircraft but you’ll see many built-from scratch reproductions of aircraft going back to the Wright Brothers era. I’ve become jaded from seeing stuff like the [S-38 Sikorsky Seaplane](http://www.flickr.com/photos/fun_flying/203441747/). The aviation community is pretty hardcore when it comes to recreating the past. ---
**Author:** ![pullin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@pullin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pullin)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/14 "2011-06-14T23:28:38Z")
Wow, this is sad. I’m glad to hear nobody was hurt. It’s shame the fire trucks couldn’t reach the plane in time and it was lost. I’m a big fan of the B-17, and as I’ve posted before, I’ve got some logged time in the [Chuckie](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.militaryaviationmuseum.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/chuckieb-1704.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.militaryaviationmuseum.org/1823/chuckie-b-17-soon-to-arriving-at-the-museum&usg=__RSf02EhstsH79iVCzWWuxirxjig=&h=502&w=640&sz=21&hl=en&start=30&zoom=1&tbnid=OwJpZu3m73lR-M:&tbnh=111&tbnw=167&ei=He33Td2xIcHg0QHkn4m1Cw&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dchuckie%2Bb%2B17%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26biw%3D1014%26bih%3D540%26gbv%3D2%26tbm%3Disch&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=284&vpy=125&dur=677&hovh=199&hovw=254&tx=160&ty=126&page=3&ndsp=15&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:30&biw=1014&bih=540), thanks to the generosity of Doc Hospers many years ago. Keep 'em flying, I say. My son and his best friend recently got to take Dad’s\* restored [T-28](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.warbirdalley.com/images/T-28-4-spread-.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.warbirdalley.com/t28.htm&usg=__h61wEPi6ryibuYeUd8gYdSnxYoo=&h=302&w=470&sz=62&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=AwiIwA-gN8GyqM:&tbnh=110&tbnw=147&ei=wO73TdrmB6nb0QHZ2amXCw&prev=/search%3Fq%3DT-28%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26gbv%3D2%26biw%3D1014%26bih%3D540%26tbm%3Disch&itbs=1&iact=rc&dur=465&page=1&ndsp=15&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0&tx=56&ty=41&biw=1014&bih=540) and spend the weekend flying around south Texas. I appreciate anyone who works (and spends) to keep these craft in the air. \*BF’s dad, not me. PS. For any DFW dopers. The B-29 [FiFi](http://www.flickr.com/photos/flyforfun/1399841421/) is at Meacham this weekend. ---
**Author:** ![Man\_With\_a\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cab0a1/32.png) [@Man\_With\_a\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Man_With_a_Cat)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/15 "2011-06-15T01:19:30Z")
Just saw this thread now. Yesterday morning, I was in the family room, skimming CNN/ESPN, debating to myself if the cat was going to get the cereal milk or not, when I heard the LOUDEST FREAKING PLANE EVER coming closer to my house. I live near airports that regularly have vintage planes over, and I’ve seen B-17’s before. This sounded loud and “vintage” but really low, so I ran out to the back porch to look. The sucker was probably no more than 150-200 feet up, more less starting a circle, with a T-6 trailing it. (I know T-6’s, a friend flies one with some others) The left side, outboard engine clearly had some flame coming from it. Not a big flame, but flame. I watched it complete most of a 360 and could see it losing altitude. About 10-15 seconds after I lost it in trees, it got quiet, then a minute or so later, there was a plume of smoke. And, stupid me had my camera 12 feet away, inside the house. The local news had it on about 5 minutes later and already knew it wasn’t a crash, but an emergency landing and that everyone was ok. A good friend who lives a few hundred yards away was featured in the Tribune article, and another, the principal of the school only 1/4 mile or so from where it landed was on one of the local TV stations. ---
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2011, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/16 "2011-06-18T04:49:20Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Plenty of B-17’s to go around. And they aren’t just flying them into the ground. They put a lot of time into restoring these A/C. If they’re not flying then they’re museum junk. Wait, what? I thought I heard that there are only [del]13[/del] 12 of these historical birds still flying. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2011, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/17 "2011-06-19T01:41:05Z")
Crud. Glad the crew got out ok, though. ---
**Author:** ![that\_darn\_cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/59ef9b/32.png) [@that\_darn\_cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/that_darn_cat)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2011, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/18 "2011-06-19T03:09:42Z")
That’s really sad. **moi** and I saw her when she was in Tampa. I can’t believe the fire crews just watched her burn. I would have chanced getting my engine stuck in the mud to save a piece of history. Just glad nobody got hurt. ---
**Author:** ![Claire\_Beauchamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ec9cab/32.png) [@Claire\_Beauchamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claire_Beauchamp)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2011, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/19 "2011-06-19T18:12:16Z")
A high school classmate was the Captain. So thankful he and the rest of the crew are OK. [http://www.libertyfoundation.org](http://www.libertyfoundation.org) ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2011, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344/20 "2011-06-19T19:52:25Z")
So how many WWI Sopwith Camels, or SPADs or Fokker Triplanes are still flying? Eventually, they will all be gronded. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-liberty-belle-has-crashed/585344.md?page=2)